wamubu

The price is just the PC, and using Ubuntu 8.10 because it is supposed to have better multi-display capability vs. 8.4.1. I have a couple of old CRT monitors (Compaq 19" and Sony 17") laying around, but went to Office Depot on Black Friday and managed to snag an Acer X223W on sale for $129+tax = $142. Newegg had the same monitor for $149 with free shipping. I'm not including the monitor in the price of this build, otherwise it would be just over $400 with the Acer 22".

My signature has the build, with the total Newegg price being $278. I don't plan on getting a new PC for... years.

I am debating whether or not to lap the HS, because the processor is only 45W anyway. But if it makes the fan spin less, or less fan noise, then I'm for it. I have the tools, just a matter of doing it.

Purpose of this build is a small footprint for the cheapest price that can output dual and maybe quad display, but not to skimp on quality. After getting the 22" monitor, I don't think I have the real estate for more than a second one. There are quite a few things I could have changed to drop the price up to $50 or more, but this is the build that I want and plan to keep for quite some time (5+ years).

• I like the ASUS M3A78-EM because it has solid caps and I've had good luck with ASUS. It also can handle a 140W CPU if I wanted to go that way - so a 45W CPU should be no bother. It also has HDMI output if I want to hook this up to a TV someday - and DVI for the current one I have if I do it now. It should have 1 molex to 2 SATA power cable, and 2 SATA data cables to get my SATA drives up and running.
• I went with the G.Skill 1066 memory for much the same reason - good overclocking (if I do it) and will handle a quad-core CPU running at 1066. I don't anticipate needing more RAM with Ubuntu, and memory is really cheap anyway.
• Seagate 7200.10 250GB 16MB cache - just a good combo deal with the CPU. More than enough space for what I need - office-type PC with aspirations for a HTPC.
• Samsung DVD/RW w/ lightscribe - Nothing fancy, but should get the job done.
• The small Rosewill case with 300W PS is more than enough for what I need to get the job done. It comes with a SATA connector, 2 molex, 20+4, and a 4-pin CPU plug. By my estimation and what I've read in reviews, this setup shouldn't even hit 100W. The small case is to appease my wife who is tired of the huge cases I've had in the past. She really likes the chrome look on the front. If I upgrade any cards, I just need to remember to get half-height cards.

The box that the case was in had a 3" hole in the side and crushed on one end, but no apparent damage to the case itself. All the foam was broke apart inside the box too.

Wife says, "Is this the last time I will see the inside of the case?" No dear, it is not if you come into view of my PC. But I don't have plans to have it cracked open for very long - a week or 2, maybe 3 at the most.

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BlankThis

Very nice work rig system there. That's great RAM kit

~B~

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wamubu

Mind you that I'm running Linux (Ubuntu disto), and so I don't have access to the various test suites for Windows. I may try to run some when I get a chance through WINE, but I'm not holding my breath on them working. The only testing I was able to so far was with MemTest.

Default settings: 5-5-5-18 at 1.8V DDR2 714.

Operational voltage for the memory is 2.0-2.1V.

Still with Ubuntu and only using Memtest86+:
After playing around a little more using the AMD OC Guide, I was able to get a stable system clock at 300MHz, but 310MHz wouldn't boot. So I tested out the CPU, and it seems that its top is somewhere over 2900MHz, but not 3000MHz. Then I tested the Memory, and it lost stability around 300MHz x DDR333. I'm a little disappointed with the <300MHz clock, but this is using stock voltages...

So the final settings I have at the moment are:
System Clock: 290MHz
CPU Multiplier: 10x (2900MHz)
Memory: 4-4-4-12, 2.0V (DDR966)
HT: 800MHz (4x)

I've run out of patience with Ubuntu (it's just not running what I need to do my work), and will be installing XP Pro SP3 ASAP. I'll be back with real benches as soon as I can.

Stability at stock V, boot to XP(32bit) Orthos tested 2 minutes:
Max Clock: 310
CPU: 2875
Mem: 4-4-4-10 / 2.1V - DDR1000 (Latency 44ns) Clock 250 x 400MHz DDR2

System stable (Orthos Passes 5 hours) at:
Clock: 245 (need to test 248 for CPU 2851, mem 992)
HT 4x (980)
DDR2 939 4-4-4-10 /2.1V
CPU: 2817 (11.5x)

Max CPU temp observed: 37C on stock lapped HSF
Idle CPU temp: 25C

wamubu

I love the size of the case, and I'll post a pic of the completed system when I get a chance. The only thing is the fan on the case blows at a hard 2900RPM. The volume of air (not to mention the low-pitched noise) that comes out is about the same as the house vent that I'm sitting right next to. Update: There is a rubber "bumper" that sits right below the HDD, and I think it caused a problem with my HDD with the PCB side down - the drive assembly wouldn't mount in the case right with the HDD flipped over. I removed the rubber "bumper" to see if that resolves my HDD issue.

I don't need to move that kind of air volume, so I found a 3-way switch (High-Low-Med) that was attached to an old CPU fan. On the low setting I was able to slow it down to about 1500RPM and hardly any noise. I'm very happy with that solution. It is now about as loud as my notebook when it kicks its fan on high.

Other BIOS settings:
I disabled the following, as I don't need them: Serial Port, Parallel port, Firewire, Floppy Drive. I bumped up the Vid clock to 750MHz, default was 550MHz, and from reviews I've seen it can hit over 800MHz

wamubu

Without much further to-do, a screen-shot of CPU-Z and the Everest latency report.

I also tested the 248MHz clock for a few minutes and it tested good.
Clock: 248MHz
HT: 4x (992MHz)
CPU: 11.5x (2852MHz)
Mem: set to 400MHz in BIOS: DDR992 @ 4-4-4-10-24-2T @ 2.1V

The first is the 245MHz clock (Orthos tested over 12 hours) latency 43.7ns:
Clock: 245MHz
HT: 4x (980MHz)
CPU: 11.5x (2817MHz)
Mem: set to 400MHz in BIOS: DDR980 @ 4-4-4-10-24-2T @ 2.1V

The 2nd is with the 300MHz clock (tested 1 hour) latency 42.8ns:
Clock: 300MHz
HT: 4x (1200MHz)
CPU: 9.5x (2850MHz)
Mem: set to 333MHz in BIOS: DDR950 @ 4-4-4-10-24-2T @ 2.1V

I opted to go with the following and burned with OCCT for 2 hours (my settings for 24/7 stable):
Clock: 295MHz
HT: 4x (1180MHz)
CPU: 9.5x (2802MHz)
Mem: 333: DDR 934 (CPU/6) @ 4-4-4-10-24-2T @2.1V
Vid: 700MHz

One last set of settings. Maxing out (+0.150V) for CPU and Vid gives the following:
Clock 290MHz
HT: 4x (1160MHz)
CPU 10.5x (3045MHz (Max stable 3060MHz)
Mem: 333: DDR 870 (CPU/7) @ 4-4-4-10-24-2T @ 2.1V
Vid: 850MHz (Artifacts and eventual lockup @ 875MHz)

I have to say, the difference between 700MHz and 850MHz allows for this system to be a pretty good basic gamer.

Update (best I've got it to do - but not 24/7 stable):
Clock: 266MHz
HT: 5x (1330MHz)
CPU: 11.5x (3060MHz @ +0.15V) (best @ 3080MHz)
Mem: BIOS = 400MHz, CPU/6 = 510MHz @ 4-5-5-10-18-2T @2.1V
Vid: 700MHz (best @ 850MHz + 0.15V)
3DMarks: 1674
SM 2.0: 546
SM 3.0: 644
CPU: 2328

Vid @ 850MHz +0.15V
3DMarks: 1766
SM 2.0: 573
SM 3.0: 685
CPU: 2335

24/7 Stable:
Clock: 264MHz
HT: 5x (1320MHz)
CPU: 11.5x (3036MHz @ +0.15V) (best @ 3080MHz)
Mem: BIOS = 400MHz, CPU/6 = 506MHz @ 4-5-5-10-18-2T @2.1V
Vid: 700MHz (best @ 850MHz + 0.15V)
3DMarks: 1644

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wamubu

I OCed the GPU clock to 700MHz (wouldn't boot at 800MHz) and ran a few older games I had laying around. It runs those games slightly better at much better resolution (resolutions I couldn't dream about with my old system) than my old AMD XP 2000+ with ATI 9750 Pro and DDR333 Memory (~$1200 new at that time). The 22" wide screen display makes even the old games look new and fresh.

I have found out I still need the dual-display, so I'll be moving my printer and putting my 19" CRT there.

I'm not sure it will be worth putting in another vid card, especially since I'm limited to half-height. I know the ones that ASUS recommends can be found as half-height. Or am I better off going with something else that isn't hybrid CFX. I want something that will be quiet too. But to do Hybrid CFX, they say the basic requirements are: Vista, 1GB RAM, AM2+ CPU, and On-board Graphics set to 256MB. I don't meet the Vista and AM2+ CPU requirements, and will likely not be upgrading it to meet them.
What is the best half-height ATI vid card now? Looks like the HD4550 is the top one with a L/P bracket. Is the HD4550 hybrid CFX? I don't see any plug on top of the card. More researching now, post later...

Update: I tried running at 750MHz and I can boot ok into windows, but within 5 seconds of running a video test, the screen went blank. So I'm leaving my vid at 700MHz. It had minimal stutter with the clock set to 300MHz and the HT at 4x. I like using EgoSoft's X3 demo for my testing because it was the last game that I just couldn't play on my last build - with the lowest res: 1024x768 I'm able to run it just over 30fps on my new build with the lowest wide-screen mode, 1024x600(?). I think it was about 20fps on my last PC.

Found LP Vid card on NewEgg: HD3650. Would blow away any crossfire configuration, and even the HD 4550, which is the only other ATI mid-end LP card I've found. Sparkle makes a 9800 GT, and that would be the best LP vid card at this time (March '09).

Higgins

Looks nice

And if i'm not mistaken you do not have to have a crossfire bridge for hybrid crossfire.

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[Steam : teh_higgins]

wamubu

This is my desk as it stands right now. It works, but the 19" really takes up some real estate. The total width of my monitor shelf is 45 1/2". The width of the 22" is 20 1/2". The width of the PC (minus the feet) is 4", with the feet it's 8". The width of the 19" is 18" at the front.

8"+20.5"+18"=46.5"

I have a power strip to the left of the PC, I may just have to find a new home for it.

At this moment, NewEgg has a sale on the same monitor for $169 with free shipping.

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wamubu

BIOS 1206 update: The M3A78-EM motherboard now supports the PII and 7xxx series CPUs. Unfortunately I didn't foresee the 7xxx series coming so soon after I bought this mobo for a price that could have still kept me under $300. Besides, I needed this system quick and it's been real good for me. Not to mention that the GPU is my limitation and I don't need any more ponies in the CPU anyway. I'm not sure I'll eventually get a PII for this system or not, as it would be better served with a SB750 or better and this PC is destined to be a HTPC someday anyway.

I have found that the GPU is the graphics bottleneck, so I dropped my CPU speed down to save on heat (47C vs 42C) at the loss of less than 1fps on my demo game (X2 demo @ average 24fps - it happens to be a multi-threaded game, likely the first). I have cool-n-quiet enabled and set my start V for my CPU fan to 4V@25C, which makes the fan spin at 1850 RPM and maxes out at 2300RPM at 42C. With Cool-n-Quiet disabled, the fan (@ about 3500RPM) is really too noisy for my work environment (ok for gaming with a headset) - and even at 2000RPM it is a little bothersome, but can be ignored (about as loud as a notebook fan spinning at max).

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WAMUBU's build log for the <$300 dual-screen capable PC (just the box, no OS, monitor, keyboard, or mouse).
3DMark06 (untweaked listing from various sites): < 1200
3DMark06 (Vid@700MHz): 1674 :: SM2: 546 :: SM3: 644 :: CPU: 2328
3DMark06 (Vid@850MHz): 1766

I did Latty's Linux Challenge and I now have tried Linux!

wamubu

My wife used my PC the other day (in Win 7), and I came into the room to a amber light on the monitor. After cycling power on the PC, I got a "tic-tic-tic chzzzt" sound (the "chzzzt" sounds like a dot-matrix printer) from the HDD and sometimes it wouldn't be recognized with an error (can't detect drive), but no S.M.A.R.T. error. If it started booting, it never finished (blue-screen or just rebooted).

I left the PC powered off for the day, and came back the next to find that it would boot up just fine. After being on for a bit, it died with the same symptoms as before. After letting it sit for a bit, I was able to run a chkdsk on it and found some bad clusters, but after running it again no new ones were discovered.

So I played with it again today, and it was able to boot up and almost completed running chkdsk on my D: partition from XP before dieing again - the video seems to fade out - the background first, then the DOS window I had open. Odd. Then an amber light on the monitor.

Unfortunately I don't have another SATA drive to play with, but I do have a couple of ATA drives. I'm toying with getting some non-conductive freezing spray and see what exactly seems to be having the thermal problem - chip-set or HDD? I may kick up my case fan to see if that helps. It was the warmest day in the room that we've had in some time, so that may have attributed to the problem. Setting the BIOS to AUTO everything seems to make it last longer. I can't reduce the voltage on anything.

Ideas to try:

• Increase case fan speed
• Feel for hot spots
• Use a freezing spray (or fan) to cool off chips/HDD to see if the problem goes away
• See if the HDD needs a firmware upgrade (some 7200.11 do)
• Stay with wife, not or .

It is really possible that the HDD is overheating, it is tucked away in a spot that doesn't get any airflow. I've never experienced an overheating HDD before, so this is interesting...

Update:
I found something interesting, there is a rubber "bumper" that was pushed up against the HDD. Originally I installed the HDD with the PCB down, and it was pressed up against the "bumper" and so when I flipped it over for easier access to the numbers on the drive, I wasn't able to get the drive assembly to sit right. I removed the bumper and noticed that it was notched where the HDD had pressed into it. I don't think that the removal of the bumper will have much effect on the sound dampening, and so far that seems to hold true. But it caused problems with my HDD. I'll see if I can post a picture later to show the issue - my camera battery needs charging...

BIOS Update (opens up extra BIOS settings? use at own risk) Search for M3A78-EMH (EM just above - has BIOS 407, 1103, 1203, 1302, 1401 as of Feb 25, 2009).

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WAMUBU's build log for the <$300 dual-screen capable PC (just the box, no OS, monitor, keyboard, or mouse).
3DMark06 (untweaked listing from various sites): < 1200
3DMark06 (Vid@700MHz): 1674 :: SM2: 546 :: SM3: 644 :: CPU: 2328
3DMark06 (Vid@850MHz): 1766

I did Latty's Linux Challenge and I now have tried Linux!