[TechCrunch] Sony packs more power into its compact cameras with the RX100 V and a6500 - Page 2 - Overclock.net

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post #11 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Just a nickname View Post

Smart phone will never rivalize with big inconvenient camera.

The reason why is physical. The optics that focus the light takes a lot of space. The light beam cannot magically be focused over a tiny distance.

If you want quality picture with a smartphone, you will be pretty limited with what you can do. With a good camera you can change the optics to get what ever effect you want.

Smart phone are more than enough for 99% of the population. They are getting better and better. Its not just the glass and optics. Smartphone have much better image processing power because of their SOCs.

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post #12 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Xuvial View Post

Phones have already killed the camera market and made it into an extremely niche thing. Think about it - there was once a time when practically every single household owned a pocket Kodak/Nikkon/etc for photos and a Sony handycam for videos. That era is long gone thanks to smartphones.

I agree there will always be a gap between smartphone photo quality (even the best) compared to what a proper DSLR camera can do. But the average consumer just wants something that takes clear crisp photos that capture the moment. And photos/videos are ALL about capturing the moment, for which 99% of the population simply won't bother carrying around a separate bulky camera for when a phone does the job just fine.

Nowadays the only reason someone will buy a dedicated camera is if they are legitimately interested in photography and/or unsatisfied with what phone cameras can do...i.e. for the extremely niche <1%.

Even then if i say im gonna go out one day to take some pics when my phone wont do, I can just carry a reasonably priced digital camera (In my case my fuji x a2) Has most the advanced features i need if not all, I can change lenses if i break the one i have, but also i can get pictures into a 21:9 resolution with just a %7 crop heh

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post #13 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Xuvial View Post


I know it's hard to accept but...



It's not the most detailed graph, but the point stands.

As smartphone sales have skyrocketed, camera sales have been dropping like a ROCK. It's not a coincidence.

No, of course smartphones will never truly "kill off" the camera market. There will always be some photographer out there who needs a DSLR, just like here are companies that buy $4000 Quadro cards. But that's just what it is, a super-niche thing that 99.99% of consumers need not bother with.

 

I'll quote my post again...

 

 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xuvial View Post

Phones have already killed the camera market and made it into an extremely niche thing. Think about it - there was once a time when practically every single household owned a pocket Kodak/Nikkon/etc for photos and a Sony handycam for videos. That era is long gone thanks to smartphones.

 

They have killed the cheapo pocket compact camera market.

 

The enthusiast/prosumer market is on the rise and has been for quite a while.

 

 

That graph does not discern camera types. By far the highest volume of sales (in terms of sold units) was the el cheapo PnS market, not prosumer/professional cameras.

 

Point still stands.


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post #14 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 04:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

I'll quote my post again...


That graph does not discern camera types. By far the highest volume of sales (in terms of sold units) was the el cheapo PnS market, not prosumer/professional cameras.

Point still stands.

I bought a Entry Level DSLR because starphone cameras were not good back in 2012. Now I never use my DSLR. Its about the place/subject/moment and smartphone is walsy with you.

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post #15 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 06:17 PM
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If you bought an entry level DSLR and now you never use, then you never even needed a DSLR in the first place.
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post #16 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 06:42 PM
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If you're bringing up a smartphone....you're in the wrong thread.
Clients call me regularly to take photos at events for great money, and they aren't expecting me to walk up with an iPhone.

You gotta be kidding thinking there's some argument to be had between this amazing a6500 and mere smartphones.

Less casuals buying pro equipment for their childs birthday party? Hmmm you don't say!

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post #17 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 06:52 PM
 
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Originally Posted by xartic1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by djsi38t View Post

I don't know, I think this camera is aimed at a crowd that wouldn't consider using a smartphone for the camera they want.

I don't think that smartphones will kill the digital camera market anytime soon,if ever.

Unless they can put 40x optical zoom in a smartphone, then I could not see this taking over. In fact, I will be buying my SO a dslr this weekend.

Even with 500x, it won't be the same...
Every advancement the smartphones tiny sensor has, the camera's 100 times bigger sensor have. The bottleneck is in the physical side of things (sensor area, tiniest detail the lens can resolve per its area, number of photons reaching each photodiode), so "bigger" is always better. ALWAYS.

To be more precise, a iPhone 7 and equivalent cameras have a 1/2.6" sensor I believe, that is 45.6mm^2 area.
A APS-C camera (like the A6xxx series from sony) has a 368mm^2 and a FF camera has around 864mm^2. So its roughly 10 times and 20 times bigger respectively. And infront of those much bigger sensors, you have those .5~1Kg lenses concentrating light onto the sensor...instead of a 2gr 3-4mm thick lens on the smarphone...yeah, it cannot be the same. EVER.

Whomever has a DSLR from 2012, or even 2006, and cannot do better than a iPhone 7 / S7 does, I am not sorry to say you are incompetent. Even if "all you have is an entry DSLR / kit lens".

Now, in the cheap compact side of things, camera manufacturers have lost most of the market-share they had to smartphones.

Thus all the new cameras that come out that have a chance to make good money for them, are 1" diagonal sensors (like the RX100 series) or bigger.

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post #18 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 07:06 PM
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Stares....darn, that is a nice small camera. Considering you can still put glass on those too.

But yeah, the normal consumer not looking to buy these bad boys.

Though, I'm with the group of, yeah, smartphone takes somewhat decent shots, but when I want to take some very nice shots. I lug my old D90 around. Plus, trying to take picture of aircraft in an airshow with a phone or tablet is probably not going to go over well.

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post #19 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 07:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artikbot View Post

By far the highest volume of sales (in terms of sold units) was the el cheapo PnS market, not prosumer/professional cameras.

Point still stands.
It's hard to define what "prosumer" means, let alone stack up their numbers (which you don't have). Lets see it from another angle...

http://arstechnica.com/gadgets/2016/01/shootout-redux-smartphone-camera-vs-tricked-out-dslr-one-year-later/
Quote:
Ultimately, the winner here is the smartphone, not the DSLR. The DSLR triumphs technically, and it will produce better images under almost any circumstance, but it’s just hella hard to stack it against the iPhone’s portability and "good enough"-ness.

Is the smartphone better? No. The DSLR and its lenses, even in my unskilled hands, produce higher-quality images, period. They’re higher resolution, and they contain more detail. It’s impossible for the iPhone’s little 8.5mm-ish sensor to grab as many photons as the DSLR’s big 35mm full-frame sensor. The DSLR wins every time, and the iPhone’s output, while good, isn’t as good.

But that’s the thing: the smartphone may not produce the same massive, high-detail 22MP images as the full-frame DSLR, but the smartphone does manage to be good enough. Under most lighting conditions indoor or outdoor, the iPhone produced images that were perfectly acceptable—more than good enough to post on Facebook or e-mail to friends and family. If you're taking photos for print publication, a DSLR is the way to go; for personal use, a smartphone is perfectly fine. Even if cost is no object and dropping $9,000 on a DSLR and a bunch of lenses doesn’t faze you, the smartphone is still good enough for just about anything.

So rejoice, casual photographers—that smartphone in your pocket is almost certainly more than enough camera to capture just about anything you’re likely to encounter, day or night, indoor or outdoor. Unless you specifically need it—and you’d know it if you did—you don’t have to lug a DSLR around to take amazing images.

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post #20 of 100 Old 10-06-2016, 07:50 PM
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Even bringing up a smartphone camera in this thread is an insult to any true photographer, amateur or pro. I bought a Nikon 750D with 4 lenses(macro being my passion, paid highest for a great Sigma) last year and it set my back over 8K. Did I need it? No, not really, but I will never look at photo's the same again. Don't get me wrong, phones do a great job of taking pictures to put up on Facebook and other quickie type images and some are pretty impressive considering the lens size. But if you really love photography, those just don't cut it. You put the same pictures side by side taken by someone that has at least minimal knowledge on how to use a pro/prosumer camera and it's instantly noticeable why these camera and lenses exist and cost so much.
I dove in head first with no knowledge and it has taken me a full year to just understand all the terminology and get used to taking it off of the dreaded "Auto" mode, heh. But after I learned just some very simple tricks and tips from a friend (she is a true pro, owns her own studio, has some impressive magazine spreads and awards under her belt, all at the age of 35) I was amazed at what a good lens allowed me to produce. I am hooked and yeah I can't help but get snobbish when it comes to pictures, especially ones from a smartphone. I fell into the crazy world of prosumer photography and I can never unsee just how terrible your average picture is from a phone. And I'm not even remotely good yet with my setup. Most people won't understand and that is OK. Crazy expensive equipment isn't for everyone and you really, really have to love pictures to put that kind of investment into it.
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