CoreTemp vs. RealTemp - Page 4 - Overclock.net

stumped · 03-09-08

Have none of you seen this News topic posted? Intel says that all the temp reading progrmas are wrong.

Quote:

More than a few programs have been released over the last few years, each claiming to accurately report these DTS values in real-time. The truth is that none can be fully trusted as the Tjunction values utilized in these transformations may not always be correct. Moreover, Intel representatives have informed us that these as-of-yet unpublished Tjunction values may actually vary from model to model - sometimes even between different steppings - and that the temperature response curves may not be entirely accurate across the whole reporting range. Since all of today's monitoring programs have come to incorrectly assume that Tjunction values are a function of the processor family/stepping only, we have no choice but to call everything we thought we had come to know into question. Until Intel decides to publish these values on a per-model basis, the best these DTS readings can do for us is give a relative indication of each core's remaining thermal margin, whatever that may be.

Link to thread

GigaByte · 03-09-08

Computronix's guide now says Tj max for M0 is 85c, after saying it was 100c for months and that M0 now has a 5c delta and I still don't believe that.

1. Why would the L2 stepping of Allendale cores with a 61c Tcase max spec have a Tj max of 100c when the M0 which has better thermal tolerances by having a Tcase max spec of 73c have a Tj max of 85c?

2. Even to get that proposed 5c delta to show itself is not working for M0, the only way to do so is to give a minus offset to Tcase, and doing that will put Tcase below ambient, problem right there.

3. RealTemp says my M0 E4500 has Tj max of 95c, while this is almost unheard of for M0, the calculations show it could "work" without any conflicts, unlike 85c Tj max.

Heres the kicker.. I did extreme thermal testing before with my E4500, Tcase was at 86c and Tj was at 97c (assuming Tj max is 100c) and it was beggining to throttle, at 101c I believe it shut down. Now, reguardless of what the Tj max is for ANY Core 2 or Quad, core temps (Tjunction) is always higher than Tcase, reguardless if its by a 5, 10 or 15c delta right? Right. Now, can someone tell me if Tj max for M0 is 85c, how is my Tcase at 86c and the processor is still running? Reguardless of what Tj max M0 is, the core temps was in the 90's at that time.

Untill I see some good proof on how 85c Tj max correctly fits in with M0 and how all those other "new" Tj max fit in with G0 and such, this is what I know:

B2: Tj max 85c
G0: Tj max 100c
B3: Tj max 100c
M0: Tj max 100c
L2: Tj max 100c
C0: Tj max 105c
C1: Tj max 105c
M1: Tj max 105c

PS: Is there anyone here that knows someone that works at Intel? They really need to make an offical statement about this battle..

**Retrospekt** · 03-09-08

I'm gonna figure this out one way or another. If realTemp is correct and my temps are really 46c...man am I pushing this processor farther.

ericeod · 03-09-08

Quote:

Originally Posted by JeremyFr

Coretemp is correct. The TJunction for allendales and conroes is 100Degrees not 85

I know coretemp keeps bouncing around on whether the M0s are 100C or 85C. I was only basing it off the max temps of the CPUs based on their revision. But I know my Conroe E6600 is a B2 core with a Tjunction of 85C.

I cant find anything definitive at Intel either. it seems like you go to one source and are told one thing, then you go to another and are told the opposite.

**Retrospekt** · 03-09-08

Quote:

Originally Posted by stumped

Have none of you seen this News topic posted?

Quote:

More than a few programs have been released over the last few years, each claiming to accurately report these DTS values in real-time. The truth is that none can be fully trusted as the Tjunction values utilized in these transformations may not always be correct. Moreover, Intel representatives have informed us that these as-of-yet unpublished Tjunction values may actually vary from model to model - sometimes even between different steppings - and that the temperature response curves may not be entirely accurate across the whole reporting range. Since all of today's monitoring programs have come to incorrectly assume that Tjunction values are a function of the processor family/stepping only, we have no choice but to call everything we thought we had come to know into question. Until Intel decides to publish these values on a per-model basis, the best these DTS readings can do for us is give a relative indication of each core's remaining thermal margin, whatever that may be.

Intel says that all the temp reading progrmas are wrong.

Link to thread

That is exactly what I read before and was talking about. TJmax can apparentally be different between processors and steppings. That stinks.

ErBall · 03-09-08

core temp .97, real temp 2.11, and HWMonitor all read the exact same for me.

iewgnem · 03-09-08

Does it really matter which one is correct? Both reads the correct, or close to correct "temp to tjmax", so really which ever TJmax you use, you will still overheat at a certain point regardless if it reads 50C or 60C. Not to mention with these 45nm chips temps are no longer an issue anyway.

GigaByte · 03-09-08

They are different between steppings as we all know, but NOT processors.

JeremyFr · 03-09-08

Quote:

Originally Posted by iewgnem

Does it really matter which one is correct? Both reads the correct, or close to correct "temp to tjmax", so really which ever TJmax you use, you will still overheat at a certain point regardless if it reads 50C or 60C. Not to mention with these 45nm chips temps are no longer an issue anyway.

What are you talking about ?!?!?! I mean granted Voltage will be a bigger issue due to the smaller process but temp is always gonna be an issue with any processor.

JeremyFr · 03-09-08

All I know is using a TJ max of 100 on my system I get Idle temps of 38 and load temps around 55 or so.

Now thats on an L2 E4400 at 3.0Ghz (300x10) 1.325V, with a Zalman 7700CPS. Chip is lapped as well. Also Ambient in my office is around 75F at all times (due to 3 computers and a laser printer in a 10x14 room) Now these temp's would seem to be about right for my setup and cooling, If I was to assume an 85 TJmax for my chip that would put my idles at 23 and my load at around 40, which would be unheard with a 50% overclock if you ask me.

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CoreTemp vs. RealTemp

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