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post #41 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by lordikon;13814366 
The point of this article was that people are forming incorrect opinions. If your opinion of what a console port consists of is really anything other than I described, then you opinion would be incorrect. Now, I don't mean that to sound harsh, what I'm trying to say is that "porting" is a defined term in which a program designed for one system is re-written partially or wholly to run on an entirely different platform. If it doesn't fit that criteria, then it's not a port, period.

People need to find a new term to describe what they're talking about, because "console port" just isn't correct. I've heard the term "consolitis" flying around, for example.

You are refering to the definition of a console port in the year 2000. All languagues are living and can change. I just recently learned about another one. DLC is now being use to describe anything that is downloaded and adds game content. In the year 2000 this was called a patch, update, or bonus content and when the first time the term DLC was used a couple years ago it was only used to refer to something that had a price tag.

And even going by your opinion; A game is made for a console and then in the last two months before release the PC version is made from the console version...does that not make it a console port?

Then take a game like the Witcher 2 that is fairly obviously designed to be ported to a console as soon as they get the backing to do so. Throughout the entire development a console was in the minds of the developers. So what we got was exactly what we would have gotten had they made a console version and then ported it to PC.

These are still console ports, the order of operations is just mixed up a bit.

The only thing I am getting sick of that people will imeadiately associate "Console Port" with "Bad Game". Console ports can be good to. I am pretty sure if there wasn't such a thing as console gaming that games would still have the "dumb down" trend we have been seeing in the majority of games in later years. Being a console port may not have anything to do with that as developers are just wanting to give the instant gratification to a gamer to get more gamers playing their game. UIs that I don't like is another matter though
Edited by Vagrant Storm - 6/10/11 at 11:04am
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post #42 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by VulcanDragon View Post
Yes, you said it...but I have no idea what you mean by it. Are you trying to imply that consoles made games somehow more than mainstream? That we wouldn't even have games if we didn't have consoles?
I'm saying that consoles made gaming bigger than what it has ever been before.

Quote:
Honestly, both you and the person you were responding to are off on this. Maybe you're all too young to remember, but arcade games are what put video games "on the map" (meaning everyone knew about gaming) and mainstream (meaning everyone played games). The holy triumverate of Space Invaders, Asteroids, and then big daddy Pac-Man put video games front-and-center in the public eye. Everyone played video games in the arcade...young, old, geek, chic...EVERYONE. Every corner store, restaurant, bowling allet, everywhere had a video game machine or three to try and get in on the action. It was a cultural phenomena unlike any other...and then one day *poof*, it was all but gone.
I am not too young to remember Space Invaders, Asteroids, Scramble, Pong, and Pac Man, among others (Street Fighter was a favourite of mine when I was at secondary school). Arcades made people notice, sure, but they didn't define the industry as we see it today. They didn't make it as popular as it is, or as widely accepted. They have their place in history, but not in what gaming has evolved into within todays industry.

Quote:
Well I'm even older, and consoles don't predate me. So there!
Hello 1960's nice to meet you.

Quote:
But those startup projects are being funded not for artistic vision purposes, but to try and find the next profitable franchise that can be milked for a half-dozen iterations.
That my friend is greed.

There are companies out there that are genuinely trying to be innovative with their products. Not many of them, but they're out there. Arenanet is one of them. They're using an established franchise yet creating an entirely different game to the original, within the same market.
Edited by Lifeshield - 6/10/11 at 12:45pm
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post #43 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vagrant Storm View Post
DLC is now being use to describe anything that is downloaded and adds game content. In the year 2000 this was called a patch, update, or bonus content and when the first time the term DLC was used a couple years ago it was only used to refer to something that had a price tag.
Not to quibble...but "DLC" has meant "DownLoadable Content" from the first day the acronym was coined. While true that "DLC" generally implies paid content, there was never anything inherent in the term that mandates that. But for marketing reasons, it makes sense to identify "free DLC" as such because most of us still assume (correctly) that most DLC is paid content.

And I would also argue your point that patches/updates fall under the umbrella of DLC. They don't, they are not content...they are bug fixes and/or tweaks/corrections to the game engine or existing content. If anyone refers to a patch as DLC, you should correct them...there is a very distinct and obvious difference.

Finally, prior to the DLC concept, there actually was previous little "bonus content" out there. Unless you mean the free stuff that was fan-made, I suppose...there was always plenty of that, I've made some myself. But the professionally made paid content was generally sold as add-on packs in retail stores. All DLC did was remove the retail store from the equation for the professional content.

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The only thing I am getting sick of that people will imeadiately associate "Console Port" with "Bad Game".
Agreed, QFT.
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post #44 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by VulcanDragon View Post
All DLC did was remove the retail store from the equation for the professional content.
And in some cases the content aswell seems it has been known to be on the disc before, lol.
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post #45 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifeshield View Post
I'm saying that consoles made gaming bigger than what it has ever been before.
Well...okay...the problem I guess I have is that consoles have always been the leading game platform. Even way back when, Atari 2600 and Intellivision were what "normal people" played games on...PC gamers have always been a gaming minority, despire their collective belief to the contrary.

Maybe I'm agreeing with you, I don't know. I just can't shake the feeling that you're thinking there's something different about the relationship between consoles and computer games in modern times than there was 20 years ago. I'm not sure that's true, except in raw numbers.

Quote:
Arcades made people notice, sure, but they didn't define the industry as we see it today. They didn't make it as popular as it is, or as widely accepted.
This is why I think what I just wrote...this implies to me that you're trying to invent something special about "today". What is "today"? There is nothing fundamentally different about the business of gaming now vs. the business of gaming in the NES era. The technology is different, the raw numbers (people and dollars) are higher...but the core concepts are pretty much the same.

And arcade games absolutely defined the industry today. Most consoles back then were purchased to play the (wait for it!)...PORTS...of the person's favorite arcade game! Did anyone on Earth own an Atari 2600 and not own Space Invaders? I think it was illegal.

And arcade games also invented the video game franchise that we're complaining about in this thread. How many different variations of Pac-Man were there? Donkey Kong? Super Mario Bros. was a spinoff of a spinoff, for pete's sake.

Quote:
That my friend is greed.
That, my friend, is business.

Quote:
There are companies out there that are genuinely trying to be innovative with their products. Not many of them, but they're out there. Arenanet is one of them. They're using an established franchise yet creating an entirely different game to the original, within the same market.
That's great, hats off to 'em. But they're taking a risk, and you know it. Taking an established franchise and straying too far from the formula can alienate the fan base and damage an otherwise lucrative franchise. Take too many risks that fail, and the company can go under.

Risk mitigation is not bad, it is not evil, it is not greedy. It is necessary. That doesn't mean you take no risks at all of course, but don't be stupid for the sake of "art" either.
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post #46 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lifeshield View Post
And in some cases the content aswell seems it has been known to be on the disc before, lol.
Yeah, okay, that's shady greedy bullcrap. I completely disagree with companies that do that, it's shameful. If it's done and on the disc, it should be part of the game, end of story.
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post #47 of 94
Quote:
Originally Posted by VulcanDragon View Post
What is "today"? There is nothing fundamentally different about the business of gaming now vs. the business of gaming in the NES era.
Quote:
The technology is different, the raw numbers (people and dollars) are higher.
You answered your own question here.

But it's also the social aspect, the ability to play online around the world against other people, along with commmunications. Technology plays a part in this, but it's the psychological aspect of it that's more important, the trend.

The impact that consoles have had on home gaming as technoloigy has improved have changed the industry entirely. Arcades are all but a thing of the past as gamers do battle in their living rooms via splitscreen or over the internet.

This is why the numbers get bigger and bigger.

Arcades did not do this.

Quote:
And arcade games absolutely defined the industry today.
No.

They have no bearing on todays attitudes and mentalities towards gaming. Gaming was a different beast back then.

I'll agree they have their place in history, and they helped evolve the industry to a certain extent, but in no way do I think that arcades made the industry as successful as it is today.

Quote:
That, my friend, is business.
Greed, business. It's the same thing to us both. No point in beating around the bush. Companies like Activision are greedy. Enough said.

Companies want to make as much money as possible. They will use whatever shady tactics they can to get away with it (as already highlighted with a key example in regard to key unlocks for content on discs).

There is only so long you can beat a dead horse before you realise you get no satisfaction from it.

Quote:
That's great, hats off to 'em. But they're taking a risk, and you know it. Taking an established franchise and straying too far from the formula can alienate the fan base and damage an otherwise lucrative franchise. Take too many risks that fail, and the company can go under.

Risk mitigation is not bad, it is not evil, it is not greedy. It is necessary. That doesn't mean you take no risks at all of course, but don't be stupid for the sake of "art" either.
Of course I know it, but the point here is that they have enough money, and backing, to take the risk, and not worry about going under if it somehow doesn't succeed (which it most likely will succeed judging by alot of impressions from journalists and public alike).
Edited by Lifeshield - 6/10/11 at 1:18pm
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post #48 of 94
What Lordikon says about Skyrim:

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So is a game like Crysis 2 or Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim a console port that was brought to the PC?

No.
What Bethesda says about Skyrim:

Quote:
We use the consoles as our lead SKU… So we develop towards the consoles and then porting to PC is usually not too bad actually.
Who do you think is right?
post #49 of 94
heh...yeah I had mentioned the Skyrim as well.

I believe it is the first case of a developer coming straight out and calling a PC game a console port before release.

The way I see it, any game that is made to run on a console with a controller and then modified to run on the PC is a console port. Wether that happens in development or after release is irrealavent. In both cases we get the exact same product on the PC. Though if it came after release we might get less bugs...I think it would be OK to let the console folks have it first. Though I am sure there would be less game even released for the PC if they had to actually go back and do something.
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post #50 of 94
What is this? Accurate and useful knowledge being posted on OCN? Are you sure you're on the right site?

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