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[Ars] Small areas of the brain go to sleep when we're up too late - Page 6

post #51 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by GiaA View Post
I hate it when something in the animal study stage is reported as though it has much of any bearing on humans at all. So they found that Rats sleep small clusters of their brain while sleep deprived while outwardly remaining active and alert. Big whoop. Dolphins literally sleep one HEMISPHERE of their brains at a time and sleep with one eye open to remain aware of their surroundings.

Not saying this isn't fascinating, but at the moment the only thing it really tells us is what rat brains do when they're tired, nothing should be extrapolated to the human brain until further studies can actually find evidence for such phenomena.
I don't think you understand why we even bother testing with mice in the first place then. We share 98% of our DNA with laboratory mice.
post #52 of 66
I always believed that the sleep time is used to organize the data stored/released in our brain, that's why we dream. Some kind of brain defrag LOL
post #53 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by _Chimera View Post
I always believed that the sleep time is used to organize the data stored/released in our brain, that's why we dream. Some kind of brain defrag LOL
I don't; here's why.

I've had reoccurring dreams before. Days, months, or even years apart. Surely, I've never had the same "daily data load" twice. Also, why don't people who lucid dream develop artifacts of some sort?

Exactly. Bam.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
I don't think you understand why we even bother testing with mice in the first place then. We share 98% of our DNA with laboratory mice.
I don't think you understand the significance of a 2% different in DNA . The guy you quoted is absolutely right.
Edited by dzalias - 4/30/11 at 8:38pm
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post #54 of 66
Double posts! Double posts errywhere!
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post #55 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzalias View Post
I don't; here's why.

I've had reoccurring dreams before. Days, months, or even years apart. Surely, I've never had the same "daily data load" twice. Also, why don't people who lucid dream develop artifacts of some sort?

Exactly. Bam.


I don't think you understand the significance of a 2% different in DNA . The guy you quoted is absolutely right.
Why would a lucid dreamer develop artifacts? (what do you even mean by that...) Also, reocurring dreams could be easily explained. Why can't you just have stimulated the same part of the brain, causing "similar" memories to appear/surface in your dream? This would give the illusion of the same dream just slightly different (probably with the current day's input). You could even say that maybe there is an issue that you are having, something you don't understand that your brain is trying to fully comprehend.

Take traumatic events, they are known to produce the same dream (or close to the same) over and over again. This is just one side-effect of a traumatic event, as if it's bad enough we seem to have difficulties understanding what happened. That's to say it isn't a surprise for denial to be going on even while the person believes they have already accepted what happens. Could be a range of events, or something that consciously you are ignoring but is surfacing in your dreams. Physical stress could be manifesting this way, who knows. Either way, due to current theory on how memories themselves work, you aren't exactly in the same dream. That's mainly because you never have the same memory either.

You could even dare say that your brain is wired to process certain events in a certain pattern. Lets say your brain uses a certain pathway to store a specific type of information. If it's activating those parts of the brain to store data you might just get an off side effect of stimulating the surrounding memories causing them to surface and you to dream. That gets into some new ideas on how we store information and memory, closely related to the statement on how you never have the same memory either.

I don't think your statement holds much weight, if any, towards the idea that this isn't a significant find.
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post #56 of 66
I have come to some conclusions.
I feel more sleepy when I have slept less than when I have slept good enough (8-10+hours).
When I go to bed at midnight and I have only 5-6 hours to sleep before school, I don't feel tired at all until Friday. When Friday (**** REBECKA BL) comes, I always feel sleepy at like 9PM (unless I am hanging out or partying etc.).
During the summer, when I don't have any important things to do and I have all the time in the world to sleep, I always go to bed really late (well, during morning 4-5AM) and then even 9 hours are not enough for me.. lol

so yeah, if I don't sleep at least 8 hours I get tired the next day or after some days. but this seems really true to me - The more I sleep, the more tired I get.. i bet there are articles about thiis anyways
    
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post #57 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by mushroomboy View Post
Why would a lucid dreamer develop artifacts? (what do you even mean by that...)
Look at the context of my previous post. I was logically refuting that dreaming is the organization / assimilation of data gathered throughout the day. If someone were to lucid-dream often, and dreaming is directly associated with data processing, it would wreak havoc on their memories.

Quote:
Also, reocurring dreams could be easily explained.
I agree. Random program entry.

Quote:
Why can't you just have stimulated the same part of the brain, causing "similar" memories to appear/surface in your dream? This would give the illusion of the same dream just slightly different (probably with the current day's input). You could even say that maybe there is an issue that you are having, something you don't understand that your brain is trying to fully comprehend.
Because similar days (experiences) would yield similar dreams. Dreams are far more random in nature. In my own experiences, there's no apparent correlation between the quality of a dream, and the previous day.

Quote:
Take traumatic events, they are known to produce the same dream (or close to the same) over and over again. This is just one side-effect of a traumatic event, as if it's bad enough we seem to have difficulties understanding what happened. That's to say it isn't a surprise for denial to be going on even while the person believes they have already accepted what happens. Could be a range of events, or something that consciously you are ignoring but is surfacing in your dreams. Physical stress could be manifesting this way, who knows. Either way, due to current theory on how memories themselves work, you aren't exactly in the same dream. That's mainly because you never have the same memory either.
I agree, more or less.

Quote:
You could even dare say that your brain is wired to process certain events in a certain pattern. Lets say your brain uses a certain pathway to store a specific type of information. If it's activating those parts of the brain to store data you might just get an off side effect of stimulating the surrounding memories causing them to surface and you to dream. That gets into some new ideas on how we store information and memory, closely related to the statement on how you never have the same memory either.
Interesting notion, something I haven't considered; there would have to be concurrent networks interconnected with the memories themselves.

Quote:
I don't think your statement holds much weight, if any, towards the idea that this isn't a significant find.
It wasn't intended to, it was irrelevant to the main discussion.
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post #58 of 66
It looks like for me the "gaming parts" of the brain don't go to sleep, I can play FPS games just like everytime, and I can still play football/soccer (depends on what do you prefer) outside with my friends in a creative way. Maybe adrenaline keeps me focused.
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post #59 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by dzalias View Post
Look at the context of my previous post. I was logically refuting that dreaming is the organization / assimilation of data gathered throughout the day. If someone were to lucid-dream often, and dreaming is directly associated with data processing, it would wreak havoc on their memories.

Because similar days (experiences) would yield similar dreams. Dreams are far more random in nature. In my own experiences, there's no apparent correlation between the quality of a dream, and the previous day.

Interesting notion, something I haven't considered; there would have to be concurrent networks interconnected with the memories themselves.
You can lucid dream all you want, generally when you do so you only have one lucid dream per night. A dream lasts roughly 5 min, so 5 min out of your sleep cycle is no worse than getting up and going to the bathroom. You should worry about sleep deprivation more than lucid dreams.

The last to parts are related, mainly because memories are thought to be created via "networked" data. Memories aren't one solid piece of data but a network of smaller memories. Think of files and how we have system links, instead though think of having multiple data links for one memory. You store the audio parts in your audo cortex, stuff like that. You can take that even further, you remember hearing a bird and a dog, you might even borrow those events from other memories. Your brain won't create new data if it doesn't have too. The thought is that if you are processing the information that's related to those you might stir up those memories.

The Traumatic events thing is kind of different. Due to your braing having the urge to remember exciting events, they tend to get stored better. Mainly your compelled to remember, in detail, events that drastically impact your life. If your put in the fight or flight mode your more likely to remember what's going on at that time. If it's a huge event, and there's a lot of data, it might take days to months to process it. You might dream that same dream every night only to remember it occasionally.

[edit] Memories can also be thought of as fragmented, when we remember we sort through that and "re-create" the solid memory. Unfortunately we don't record every detail and our brains have a habit of filling in blanks.

[edit2]
Quote:
Originally Posted by CoreXE View Post
It looks like for me the "gaming parts" of the brain don't go to sleep, I can play FPS games just like everytime, and I can still play football/soccer (depends on what do you prefer) outside with my friends in a creative way. Maybe adrenaline keeps me focused.
I think that's due to two reasons... Either our brain starts making a new section dedicated to that or if something is required it won't turn it "off" until absolutely necessary. As I said earlier, eventually sleep dep will make you sleep.
Edited by mushroomboy - 5/2/11 at 9:46am
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post #60 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
I don't think you understand why we even bother testing with mice in the first place then. We share 98% of our DNA with laboratory mice.
And we share 60% of our DNA with BANANAS. Maybe we should start testing those too.
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