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[CW] AMD not pursuing ARM license, sticking to x86 - Page 2

post #11 of 29
ARM has many licensees of its technology. Nvidia, Texas Instruments, Qualcomm... the amount of competition in the ARM space between various manufacturers means that it will be difficult for a new competitor to compete effectively the space without any pre-requisite competitive advantages (for Nvidia, it's graphics, for example.)
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post #12 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Track;13331818 
No. Not again.

They split into graphics - that was 5 years ago and they're still picking up the pieces.

When BD annihilates IV, then I'll be okay with this.

Buying up ATI was a brilliant decision. After the AMD purchase ATI quickly returned to competitive shape to fight nVidia. Hell, they even beat nVidia for the first time in years. Today ATI designs are being merged into AMD's CPUs for the big picture stuff like Fusion. Plus AMD has stated the ATI brings in a large portion of their income. "Picking up the pieces" isn't a good way to describe the situation that AMD is counting on to give it an edge.
Quote:
Originally Posted by XX55XX;13331890 
ARM has many licensees of its technology. Nvidia, Texas Instruments, Qualcomm... the amount of competition in the ARM space between various manufacturers means that it will be difficult for a new competitor to compete effectively the space without any pre-requisite competitive advantages (for Nvidia, it's graphics, for example.)

AMD has graphics as well, but they also have CPUs, and they have chipsets. They have experience in making the entire platform excel as a whole.

Sent from my Evo 4G using Tapatalk.
Edited by Licht - 4/30/11 at 12:17pm
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post #13 of 29
Well I'd love to see a Fusion APU in a tablet, but it has to be at least 2GHz Dual Core, or 1.5GHz Dual Core w/ DX11 to compete, but all in all, I am sure they will do fine, but not ruling out ARM would be nice, AMD would earn more money with ARM alongside x86, therefore it would make much more sense to use it. But of course ARM would benefit as well, and we all will as consumers will, if only I was an advisor to AMD and AT&T....
post #14 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Licht;13331925 
Buying up ATI was a brilliant decision. After the AMD purchase ATI quickly returned to competitive shape to fight nVidia. Hell, they even beat nVidia for the first time in years. Today ATI designs are being merged into AMD's CPUs for the big picture stuff like Fusion. Plus AMD has stated the ATI brings in a large portion of their income. "Picking up the pieces" isn't a good way to describe the situation that AMD is counting on to give it an edge.

I don't think your recollection of history is too good.

AMD purchased ATi in the end of 2006.
Before that, ATi was succeeding very well with their X1900 series.

At the same time, nVidia launched their G80 GPU - the first DX10 GPU. AMD will not recover from this fully until 2011.

Scrambling to make something sell-able, having no cash left, they created the half-assed R600, a complete failure and 7 months too late.

They then took another 6 months and created the Rv670, a simple die shrink.

In 2008, they made the R700, the HD 4870, which saved them a lot of grief.

But it wasn't until 2011 that ATi gained the performance crown for the first time since being bought by AMD, with the HD 6990 defeating the GTX 590.
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post #15 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Track;13332105 
I don't think your recollection of history is too good.


At the same time, nVidia launched their G80 GPU - the first DX10 GPU. AMD will not recover from this fully until 2011.

Scrambling to make something sell-able, having no cash left, they created the half-assed R600, a complete failure and 7 months too late.

They then took another 6 months and created the Rv670, a simple die shrink.

In 2008, they made the R700, the HD 4870, which saved them a lot of grief.

But it wasn't until 2011 that ATi gained the performance crown for the first time since being bought by AMD, with the HD 6990 defeating the GTX 590.

I think it's you whose recollection is poor.

You're forgetting 2009 and the 5870, good sir.

AMD have been at the top pretty much since then.
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post #16 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by Track;13332105 
I don't think your recollection of history is too good.

AMD purchased ATi in the end of 2006.
Before that, ATi was succeeding very well with their X1900 series.

At the same time, nVidia launched their G80 GPU - the first DX10 GPU. AMD will not recover from this fully until 2011.

Scrambling to make something sell-able, having no cash left, they created the half-assed R600, a complete failure and 7 months too late.

They then took another 6 months and created the Rv670, a simple die shrink.

In 2008, they made the R700, the HD 4870, which saved them a lot of grief.

But it wasn't until 2011 that ATi gained the performance crown for the first time since being bought by AMD, with the HD 6990 defeating the GTX 590.

Maybe you forget that each GPU design takes ~2 years. ATI had *already* designed R600 and R700. rolleyes.gif Have you also forgotten R700 had taken everyone by surprise offering very good price:performance products edging out over NVIDIA. You *ALSO* seem to be forgetting that AMD had the performance crown with the 5970 because NVIDIA had no competing product...? That was back in 2009. So yeah...
Edited by MrAlex - 4/30/11 at 1:06pm
    
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post #17 of 29
LMAO, this entire thing started because of ARM, and now AMD is spending a bunch of time retracting statements they never even made in the first place.
     
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post #18 of 29
Not surprised by the news. It didn't make any sense. ARM was defending itself by attacking. They know that as the manufacturing processes get more efficient and AMD and Intel further develop x86's power efficiency, the practical advantage of ARM will diminish in the coming years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Licht;13331925 
Buying up ATI was a brilliant decision. After the AMD purchase ATI quickly returned to competitive shape to fight nVidia. Hell, they even beat nVidia for the first time in years. Today ATI designs are being merged into AMD's CPUs for the big picture stuff like Fusion. Plus AMD has stated the ATI brings in a large portion of their income. "Picking up the pieces" isn't a good way to describe the situation that AMD is counting on to give it an edge.

Track is right. AMD is still picking up the pieces purely because a merger has a lot of implications. You don't fuse two independent companies to work seamlessly overnight and act as one. Heck, they only now dropped the ATI brand from GPU's (starting with the HD68xx series back in November).

The ATI aquisition made sense, but it was a long term bet. And it wasn't cheap to begin with.

And as to GPU's yes, you are wrong. ATI had a great X1900 series GPU, and then was aquired and then Nvidia released the famous 8800GTX. ATI took some months before releasing the HD2900XT, which was manufactured in the wrong process (80nm), was hot, and slower than an 8800GTS 640MB.

Then they transitioned the manufacturing of that chip to 55nm, introduced a few improvements and called it the HD3800 series. They really didn't design this chip from the ground up. It still had 320 shaders, and the HD3870 was still not faster than an 8800GTX. In fact, it wasn't even as fast as an 8800GT.

Only with the HD4000 series did they correct all the problems and more than doubled their processing power and caught Nvidia off-guard in the price/performance segment. THe HD4850/70 were great cards for the money. Not the fastest, but plenty fast for the time. This was in 2008. So, yes, it took them two years to get back into the spotlight.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Track;13332105 
I don't think your recollection of history is too good.

AMD purchased ATi in the end of 2006.
Before that, ATi was succeeding very well with their X1900 series.

At the same time, nVidia launched their G80 GPU - the first DX10 GPU. AMD will not recover from this fully until 2011.

Scrambling to make something sell-able, having no cash left, they created the half-assed R600, a complete failure and 7 months too late.

They then took another 6 months and created the Rv670, a simple die shrink.

In 2008, they made the R700, the HD 4870, which saved them a lot of grief.

But it wasn't until 2011 that ATi gained the performance crown for the first time since being bought by AMD, with the HD 6990 defeating the GTX 590.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pursuinginsanity;13332274 
I think it's you whose recollection is poor.

You're forgetting 2009 and the 5870, good sir.

AMD have been at the top pretty much since then.

Yep, right on that one, he forgot the HD5000 series which had no competition for 6 months before the GTX480 and GTX470 were launched.
Edited by tpi2007 - 4/30/11 at 1:47pm
 
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post #19 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryDemon;13330958 
I don't think AMD should go exclusively ARM but I don't think they should rule it out completely either.
Agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Licht;13331700 
I really wish AMD would at least pick up an ARM division. Wouldn't hurt.
Agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Track;13331716 
wth.gif

You want them to take money away from their Bulldozer division?

nVidia has only GPU experience, Tegra2 is faster than all the other ARM chips in that segment.

Considering AMD has made APUs before, imagine what they'd do with ARM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Licht;13331925 
Buying up ATI was a brilliant decision. After the AMD purchase ATI quickly returned to competitive shape to fight nVidia. Hell, they even beat nVidia for the first time in years. Today ATI designs are being merged into AMD's CPUs for the big picture stuff like Fusion. Plus AMD has stated the ATI brings in a large portion of their income. "Picking up the pieces" isn't a good way to describe the situation that AMD is counting on to give it an edge.

iirc the x1950XT beat the 7900GT but couldn't overclock as high, so while it was faster, the overclockers preferred the 7900GT because it could OC better.

Just saying, the HD2900XT and HD3xx0s were the only times ATI wasn't competing easily with nVidia.
And I think the HD4xx0s started before AMD bought ATI, but there's definitely AMD influence there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Track;13332105 
At the same time, nVidia launched their G80 GPU - the first DX10 GPU. AMD will not recover from this fully until 2011.

What? They recovered with the HD4xx0 series, they weren't going for the halo effect (The highest performing card) but they damn well got near it and sold a lot of cards, if they'd tried to go for the performance crown then they'd have killed nVidia with the HD4870.

And they lost against G80 not because it was a half-assed, rushed chip, but because G80 was literally a monster in terms of performance increases over the previous generation, they made a few bad decisions with RV600 (Eg. Going on the 80nm overclocking process instead of the smaller 65nm process) and that nailed the chip in the coffin, the fact that the HD3870 and HD3870x2 sold fairly well and competed fairly well is testament to this.

Add in the fact that the HD5870 was usually doing stuff the GTX 470 could do in nearly half the wattage with nearly none of the heat output...Yeah, ATI definitely was ahead before the GTX 590 was a colossal failure.
    
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post #20 of 29
AMD "recovered" with the R700 architecture, and they were indeed great cards (my HD4870s can still rock just about every game out there on max settings or close to it).

But they didn't really gain back the marketshare they lost to Nvidia until the HD5000 series, and they may not have even succeeded then except for the colossal catastrophe that was the Fermi launch. Nvidia launched its product more than six months late with huge power consumption, high price tags, and they still didn't get a clear win for the performance crown. Meanwhile AMD made huge amounts of revenue with the HD5700 and HD5800 series and actually took a majority of the market for the first time since 2006. 2009 saved AMD's butt, and if it weren't for all the revenue from the HD5000 series, not to mention all the publicity that earned them, they'd be in deep crap right now.
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