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Getting Back Into It - Questions

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
I'm thinking about getting back into water cooling again. I dropped it for an air cooler a few years back due to a fatal error on my part where I forgot to plug my T-Line reservoir and well...you know where that's going. Needless to say, it was an extremely costly mistake.

Anyway! I've got two 120mm DangerDen Black Ice radiators with ½" O/D fittings laying around in a box in my basement, and that's about it.

I only plan on cooling my CPU with this loop. I guess the question is going to be what pump do I need? I'd prefer not to spend $100 on just a pump...that seems excessive.

Also, back when I was WC'ing my Pentium D 805 (yeah, ancient!), I found that the most effective setup was having a radiator in the front and rear of the case, so that coolant coming from the radiator at the front of the case was being fed to the block, then to the exhaust radiator, then the reservoir, then back to the front radiator. Sound about right?

Also, do you guys figure that the radiators will still be usable after sitting around in a box for several years? They weren't used very long...heh.

Anyway! Let me know what you think! Suggestions are more than welcome. ^_^
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post #2 of 10
Thread Starter 
Oh, I forgot to ask: is there another place to LIKE Danger Den that is reputable and sells things like tubing, coolant, and blocks/pumps? Thanks!
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post #3 of 10
I would definitely recommend washing out your radiators with a 10:1 water:vinegar solution, then rinse with distilled a few times, and probably dust off the radiators if not boxed and clean.

Good places to buy watercooling equipment these days are:
Jab-tech
Performance-pcs
FrozenCPU

I've purchased from all 3 and been happy with their service, prices, and speed of shipping.

Unfortunately pumps are rather expensive these days. You can check on HardOCP's for sale forum, there was a guy selling Swiftech MCP355s (I believe) for like $35 a pop cause he bought a ton of them for whatever reason. I dunno if he still has them though.

If budget is a concern, there are often great deals to be had on the used forum. I too used to watercool back in the day (P4 478 and AMD939 for me), but lost it for a while in school.

Also, recommended tubing these days is Tygon and Primochill Primoflex tubing, as they have less residue in them. And people are only using distilled these days, no more special fluid, as they often clog pumps and waterblocks. Only a silver "kill coil" to prevent bacterial growth.

Also, if possible, make sure your radiators are brass and not aluminum. If they are aluminum, you will need special coolant fluid, but as long as they're not, distilled and a kill coil and you'll be good to go.

The most common recommendation on radiators is exhaust for all, so you do not draw in hot air into your case and stress the other components. For the order of the loop, it doesn't really matter, as there is supposedly only a 1 degree celcius degree difference between the hottest and coldest part of the loop since the fluid is flowing so quickly, so it all cools fast enough for loop order not to be a concern. The only concern is a reservoir being before the pump so it never accidentally runs dry, burning it out.
post #4 of 10
Sorry, I was wrong about selling on HardOCP. They were actually listed here on OCN, and they'd be great for you.
post #5 of 10
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.GumbyM.D. View Post
I would definitely recommend washing out your radiators with a 10:1 water:vinegar solution, then rinse with distilled a few times, and probably dust off the radiators if not boxed and clean.

Good places to buy watercooling equipment these days are:
Jab-tech
Performance-pcs
FrozenCPU

I've purchased from all 3 and been happy with their service, prices, and speed of shipping.

Unfortunately pumps are rather expensive these days. You can check on HardOCP's for sale forum, there was a guy selling Swiftech MCP355s (I believe) for like $35 a pop cause he bought a ton of them for whatever reason. I dunno if he still has them though.

If budget is a concern, there are often great deals to be had on the used forum. I too used to watercool back in the day (P4 478 and AMD939 for me), but lost it for a while in school.

Also, recommended tubing these days is Tygon and Primochill Primoflex tubing, as they have less residue in them. And people are only using distilled these days, no more special fluid, as they often clog pumps and waterblocks. Only a silver "kill coil" to prevent bacterial growth.

Also, if possible, make sure your radiators are brass and not aluminum. If they are aluminum, you will need special coolant fluid, but as long as they're not, distilled and a kill coil and you'll be good to go.

The most common recommendation on radiators is exhaust for all, so you do not draw in hot air into your case and stress the other components. For the order of the loop, it doesn't really matter, as there is supposedly only a 1 degree celcius degree difference between the hottest and coldest part of the loop since the fluid is flowing so quickly, so it all cools fast enough for loop order not to be a concern. The only concern is a reservoir being before the pump so it never accidentally runs dry, burning it out.
Wow! Well thank you for all of this very useful information. I will definitely be checking all this out.

So you're saying that people don't use coolant anymore? Shame. I bet you could use some high-grade (90%+) alcohol instead, since it supposedly has better cooling properties than water. What do you think?

Also, any idea how I can find out what material my radiators are made out of? They're the "Black Ice" series from Danger Den, and they say they're made out of copper, but as I said they're rather old.

Lastly, is there any way to safely color the water/coolant?
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post #6 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.GumbyM.D. View Post
Unfortunately pumps are rather expensive these days. You can check on HardOCP's for sale forum, there was a guy selling Swiftech MCP355s (I believe) for like $35 a pop cause he bought a ton of them for whatever reason. I dunno if he still has them though.
May I add that those pumps are black-top brandless DDC1 pumps.. not your everyday MCP355. Those things are noisy as heck I hear, and don't really come close to the performance of a DDC3.

I guess you can consider it a budget pump... $35 is still a decent deal! I wouldn't go for it though.
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post #7 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by KijanOZ View Post
Wow! Well thank you for all of this very useful information. I will definitely be checking all this out.

So you're saying that people don't use coolant anymore? Shame. I bet you could use some high-grade (90%+) alcohol instead, since it supposedly has better cooling properties than water. What do you think?

Also, any idea how I can find out what material my radiators are made out of? They're the "Black Ice" series from Danger Den, and they say they're made out of copper, but as I said they're rather old.

Lastly, is there any way to safely color the water/coolant?
Lol don't use alcohol..... It evaporates too quickly, probably has bad heat capacity (though I don't know), probably leaks a lot easier.... I'm thinking that you mean something like rubbing alcohol, though you could mean etheline glycol, which is a coolant, but again, tests find that you're better off with distilled rather than fancy coolant. Case in point:


If they say they're copper, and they're Danger Den, who are a generally reliable long-time watercooling company, they probably are. Though that sounds crazy because nobody uses copper only, usually bronze and copper since full copper is so damn heavy, but either way, I don't think they do copper and aluminum radiators, so you're very likely good to go. If you're still concerned, you can probably call DangerDen and ask them.

Finally, as for color, the usual recommendation is to go with colored tubing rather than adding color to the water. This comes from many people having "gunked up" or stained blocks from running these color additives. That being said, I've seen some respected watercoolers in this forum use Feser color additive, but it still isn't generally recommended unless needed. Your best bet is to get colored tubing from Tygon (for black or clear) or Primochill Primoflex, which comes in a variety of colors.

Diameter of tubing will depends on what fittings you'll have on your radiators, pump, and waterblocks. I've got G1/4" to 1/2" barbs on everything on my loop with 7/16" ID tubing (recommended for a tighter more secure fit), but I also went the extra mile and added hose clamps as well (screw-in worm drive clamps). If you get compression fittings, then you should get the tubing that fits them exactly, and no clamps are needed since they are effectively a clamp.
post #8 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by KijanOZ View Post
Oh, I forgot to ask: is there another place to LIKE Danger Den that is reputable and sells things like tubing, coolant, and blocks/pumps? Thanks!
They have a smaller selection than some places but I buy my water cooling stuff mostly here ... http://www.koolertek.com/

Always have had good service from them.
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post #9 of 10
Thread Starter 
Well I suppose. As far as the alcohol is concerned, I was mainly looking for something that's readily accessible, not that distilled water isn't. And I do happen to know that they use alcohol in place of water or antifreeze in automotive applications where water or antifreeze would otherwise freeze. Plus, I believe that alcohol won't cause corrosion like water will, but I guess it could.


I was considering purchasing either this, or the single 5.25 version:

http://www.koolertek.com/computer-pa...p-224p2235.htm

I'm assuming I don't need some massive pump/radiator configuration to keep just a single CPU cool.

Thanks for all your help guys.

PS, is there an additive that will help prevent corrosion?
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post #10 of 10
The alcohol, when in automotive application, does inhibit corrosion and prevent freezing, as it's ethylene glycol usually. That can be found in some coolant solutions since they're usually based somewhat on automotive coolant and somewhat (or you later add) distilled water.

Water doesn't cause corrosion, it enables it. Automotive coolant has the glycol solution to inhibit it (or other chemicals to inhibit it).

Either way, it usually isn't enough of an issue to be worth the money or potential issues of clogging blocks and whatnot.

That reservoir/pump combo is fine especially for a CPU only loop. Many people have it from the XSPC Rasa 750 kit, and use it in many different applications with many different components. And the price is right if I remember correctly (around $50?).

You shouldn't need any corrosion inhibitors, but if you really want, I'm sure any of the available fluids have it. As far as an additive, they're the same as the fluids in the graph above, so any of those should be fine.
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