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Is my NH-D14 Faulty? [nearly resolved] - Page 7

post #61 of 103
Well, there you are. Your heatpipes do wick properly.

I would use a bit more TIM next time, though. But don't go hog-wild.

And +rep for doing the test and getting the data.
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post #62 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
Well, there you are. Your heatpipes do wick properly.

I would use a bit more TIM next time, though. But don't go hog-wild.

And +rep for doing the test and getting the data.
Thanks for your help, but i still didn't get the info i needed. I know its not the heatpipes, or the orientation. So what do i test now? I want to know for more reasons that getting a refund or replacement, not to say i want to keep this POS NH-D14.

Could you take a look at your NH-D14 and compare the base to the one i have. The pictures of it were in the conclusion of my test. I'm thinking the base isn't transferring the heat from the IHS to the heatpipe the way it should.

Should the TIM cover most or all of the IHS without going over the sides? And how many *C lower should i expect with proper TIM application?

What do you think about this test:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wishmaker View Post
I think you should take the mobo out and run it outside the case. Test for stability then and post your results. Maybe your Raven does indeed impede airflow.
I know it would be a major pain in the ass.
post #63 of 103
Quote:
For my test i will take note of my room temp then run Prime95 small FFT's 40min The OC im using is 4.6GHz, 1.35V, 0.040 offset, high LLC(50%), VCCIO+VCCSA normal, PLL 1.71875, 1.03 PCH, HT+EIST+C states enabled. . . . 21*C ambient . . . The case is in its normal orientation. Average core temp was 68.456*C . . . ase laying on its right side with books underneath to keep it off the ground. Average Core Temp was 66.87*C, so lets say 67*C.
This is actually a pretty good result. You are getting 67 - 68c TOA (temp over ambient) with a Vcore of 1.35v, and with TIM looking too thick and not spread over the entire ihs (integrated heat spreader) of the cpu. Granted, you are using Prime95 and not the LinX, IBT or OCCT Linpack solutions, but Prime95 is a respectable stress test. The problem, of course, will come as you scale Vcore up to raise your OC from 4.6 to 5GHz.

I just looked at my D14. From what I could see (obscured by mb; set up for test runs and if I remove/remount the heatsink my prior fan tests will not be comparable to the future tests) there was solder at both sides. So maybe it's not the heatpipes but the soldering that is a step down from prior builds. Good job taking those pics.

I'd suggest:

1. Clean remount. Make sure the braces are fully tightened to the backplate.
2. Use the TIM that came with the D14 or another low viscosity TIM like GC Extreme. About 3 rice grains, side by side.
3. Before you put the screws in, push down firmly on the heatsink and rotate back and forth. You will get about ten degrees play in either direction. Just enough to make sure the TIM is fully spread out.
4. Tight the screws alternately until they stop, so you have max pressure.

Then test again with full fanspeed. If you get no better results, write again to Noctua, this time with the two pics showing the details of where the heatpipes go into the heatsink.
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post #64 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
This is actually a pretty good result. You are getting 67 - 68c TOA (temp over ambient) with a Vcore of 1.35v, and with TIM looking too thick and not spread over the entire ihs (integrated heat spreader) of the cpu. Granted, you are using Prime95 and not the LinX, IBT or OCCT Linpack solutions, but Prime95 is a respectable stress test. The problem, of course, will come as you scale Vcore up to raise your OC from 4.6 to 5GHz.
Note to self: New OC + Posting on Forum =
It's not a good result if you consider im using Sandy Bridge. And if i compare to this review(which i did, look at first post) it is a pretty bad result. They used 1.48V

They also mentioned the NH-D14 result was from the third one they got, and all three seemed faulty. It should perform between the Silver Arrow and Super Mega. And the temps i got from the recent test was not TOA. It was the core temp. So TOA would be 46-47*C.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
I just looked at my D14. From what I could see (obscured by mb; set up for test runs and if I remove/remount the heatsink my prior fan tests will not be comparable to the future tests) there was solder at both sides. So maybe it's not the heatpipes but the soldering that is a step down from prior builds. Good job taking those pics.
I was thinking that the heatpipes were not making enough contact on the one side, therefore reducing performance.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
I'd suggest:

1. Clean remount. Make sure the braces are fully tightened to the backplate.
I did this a few days prior to my recent test. I may have overtightened though, could this be a problem? Should i remount again when i do the next test or is it fine? Also, when i did try to remove the backplate, it was stuck on. I ended up putting a ziptie through one of the legs and pulling fairly hard to get it off. It left some marks on the back of the mobo from the foam feet. And somehow when pulling it off, i sliced a piece of skin of my middle finger. I guess it didn't want to go back in it's box.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
2. Use the TIM that came with the D14 or another low viscosity TIM like GC Extreme. About 3 rice grains, side by side.
I've never heard of this TIM application method. Could you post a pic or a link? And i still have some NT-H1 left.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
3. Before you put the screws in, push down firmly on the heatsink and rotate back and forth. You will get about ten degrees play in either direction. Just enough to make sure the TIM is fully spread out.
4. Tight the screws alternately until they stop, so you have max pressure.
I tightened them 1 turn each until they "stopped", then went a little bit further.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
Then test again with full fanspeed. If you get no better results, write again to Noctua, this time with the two pics showing the details of where the heatpipes go into the heatsink.
The fans only go fullspeed. I dont have a fan controller, and my mobo doesnt seem to have voltage control(or it's because of Y-Splitter).
Edited by nawon72 - 5/21/11 at 8:58pm
post #65 of 103
Well, it seems your results are consistent with the ones above. This drop in the ability of D14's is most puzzling, but it seems you have been bitten as well. Perhaps D14's don't cool SB's very well.

You're right about the TOA. I was thinking TOA but I wrote the actual temps. Granted it's a hot chip, but in order to get my 4GHz i7 860 (Vcore = 1.3125v) + D14 down to a TOA of 47-48c, I've got to put twin 120x38mm fans on the cooler. That's why your numbers look good to me.

I do realize that SBs run cooler, but it seems that your results are not far from what others are getting.

At this point, if you can't reach your OC goal, the next step would be to lap your cpu. I'd hold off lapping the heatsink. For one thing, lapping the cpu may solve your problems and lapping the heatsink will void the warranty.

Other ideas would void the warranty: hot solder (preceded by flux) down the empty spaces where there should be solder; lapping the heatsink.
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post #66 of 103
Thread Starter 
Could you answer the questions in my last post. That way i can do the testing tomorrow.

And i don't think that having a SB is causing my NH-D14 to suck. I know there are other people who have a good one on a SB. And if the reviewers got a better, but still faulty NH-D14 on their second try, then there must be a lack of quality inspection.

Edit:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
At this point, if you can't reach your OC goal, the next step would be to lap your cpu. I'd hold off lapping the heatsink. For one thing, lapping the cpu may solve your problems and lapping the heatsink will void the warranty.

Other ideas would void the warranty: hot solder (preceded by flux) down the empty spaces where there should be solder; lapping the heatsink.
Im afraid of lapping my CPU. Has anyone kill it by lapping or screwed up? And would the IHS or HS base rust or degrade?

I have no idea what the second thing is, but it sounds more difficult/risky than lapping.
Edited by nawon72 - 5/21/11 at 9:36pm
post #67 of 103
You asked a number of questions in your last post.

First of all, if you overtightened your screws you stripped the threads. Other than that there is no overtightening. In any case, I doubt you can put too much pressure on, since the pressure is applied by the springs.

(Hmm. Your TIM looked like it had not been squeezed hard enough. Did Noctua put the wrong springs on your cooler? How could you tell? Even if they could send you a replacement set, how would you install them? Hmm.)

Second, think of three grains of rice side by side. I say this because a thin TIM will slump. Here is an example, my first attempt on my D14:



Here is the cpu resulting:



You can see I put too much TIM on there. And here is the bottom of the D14:



HTH
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post #68 of 103
nawon72:

ehume's on to something.

That photo of the TIM-spread shows that insufficient pressure was applied.
The only ways that could happen is if the brackets are too high off the mobo, the socket is too low, the springs are too short/soft (doubtful), the bracket-studs are too long (doubtful), the nuts weren't fully threaded (doubtful) or the nuts have debris in them.

Are the Intel and AMD spacers the same length?

Do the nuts rest on the bracket-studs without applying pressure?
I had to push down slightly to get the nuts to engage the bracket-studs.

That TIM-spread looks like you just applied hand pressure.
post #69 of 103
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by ehume View Post
I'd suggest:

1. Clean remount. Make sure the braces are fully tightened to the backplate.
2. Use the TIM that came with the D14 or another low viscosity TIM like GC Extreme. About 3 rice grains, side by side.
3. Before you put the screws in, push down firmly on the heatsink and rotate back and forth. You will get about ten degrees play in either direction. Just enough to make sure the TIM is fully spread out.
4. Tight the screws alternately until they stop, so you have max pressure.

Then test again with full fanspeed. If you get no better results, write again to Noctua, this time with the two pics showing the details of where the heatpipes go into the heatsink.
Could you post a pic or link of the 3 rice grain method? I googled it and found nothing. And ill be using the included Y-Splitter for the fans, which should only increase the temps by 0.5 according to some reviews. Ill likely do the test in full tomorrow. Ive been busy with school project.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Steamboat Steve View Post
Are the Intel and AMD spacers the same length?

Do the nuts rest on the bracket-studs without applying pressure?
I had to push down slightly to get the nuts to engage the bracket-studs.

That TIM-spread looks like you just applied hand pressure.
Ill check when i get to the testing.

Ill check when i get to the testing. Just for confirmation, the bracket studs are what the NH-D14 screws into after installing the backplate and steel brackets?

It could look like that because i didn't apply enough TIM.
post #70 of 103
The pic I posted was about 4 long grains of rice, side by side. These days my drops look like three short grains, side by side.



I think you probably had enough TIM. It just looks like it didn't squeeze hard enough. If you look at the dollop I started with, and all the extra I had at the end, you will see why I use less now.
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