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Why is AS5 considered sub-par now days? - Page 8

post #71 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lemondrips View Post
I've used AS5 since building computers. I still think its one of the best.
Word.
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post #72 of 87
If I ever use up all of the containers of AS5 I have laying around my shop, I'd like to try some TX-3 or TX-4.
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post #73 of 87
I just got PMed by someone defending misinformation about AS5. Bring your proof that AS5 is not conductive. I will buy what ever PC item you need to prove AS5 can screw you I you spread it all over the PCB. OCN is full of non-informative people, and issues that come up from people who have not dealt with AS5 for the last 8+ years!! I spent my hard earne money on PC parts and will give my opinion as I see it, simple as that!

I deal with industry standards that are fail-safe. AS5 Is not fail-safe period, AS5 has cautions when it comes to PCB traces. I could could care less if a moderator wipes put my opinion, it's simply a "IMO" statement.
     
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post #74 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by ezveedub View Post
I just got PMed by someone defending misinformation about AS5. Bring your proof that AS5 is not conductive. I will buy what ever PC item you need to prove AS5 can screw you I you spread it all over the PCB. OCN is full of non-informative people, and issues that come up from people who have not dealt with AS5 for the last 8+ years!! I spent my hard earne money on PC parts and will give my opinion as I see it, simple as that!

I deal with industry standards that are fail-safe. AS5 Is not fail-safe period, AS5 has cautions when it comes to PCB traces. I could could care less if a moderator wipes put my opinion, it's simply a "IMO" statement.
Reach out with your emotions, young padawan.
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post #75 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by Farih View Post
Hmmm, still worth a try maybe.. the shop i go to doesnt even have shin etsu
wouldnt mind to try that either

or just stick to AS5 lol
I feel bad for saying

I'm sure it would be fine really. What we talking, 1 deg

But AS5 having to be replaced every 8 months, is just crazy
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post #76 of 87
MX-4 and MX-2 are better than AS5. Here for the comparative graphs.

As to those wondering the differences between MX-2, MX-3 and MX-4, this part of the above review might help:

Quote:
Viscosity is at 870 Poise for the MX-4, which is a little less than the MX-3, but a little more than what MX-2 offers. The density of the MX-4 comes in at 2.5 g/cm³, and again is less than the MX-2 by a lot, and just more than what MX-3 offers. What does this all mean? Well to me, just from the specs I see of these three compounds, I would guess that theMX-4 is a bit more easily spread than MX-3, but should offer similar temperatures, but we will let a huge series of tests do that math for us.

One of the biggest complaints I heard from MX-3 users, was the fact that the paste just wasn't spreadable. It seems Arctic Cooling has taken that into consideration with the new release.
On top of the customer base, it only seems right that a new product should not only be easier to use, but should also perform better. My previous thermal compound tests showed that even though they got the consistency wrong with MX-3, they did however make a better product.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kcuestag View Post
Nothing wrong with the AS5, although I never used it.

I always used Arctic Cooling MX-3 for the reason that it was the one OCN recommended me a year ago when I first built my first X4 965 + HD5850 gaming PC.
MX-4 is better, in fact, AC's site no longer even lists MX-3. See here. They only list MX-2 and MX-4. MX-4 comes pre-applied to the Arctic Cooling Accelero Xtreme Plus.

Quote:
Originally Posted by [CyGnus] View Post
Well i just run out of TIM and will try the new MX-4 lets hope its good
It is. I've used MX-2 before on my CPU, but was running out of it and bought a tube of MX-4. It's not that much better than MX-2 in all occasions, especially if you already have a good cooler, nice airflow, a low heat dissipation. At worst it's exactly the same (my CPU's idle temps are the same). Look the the graphs in the review linked above and you'll see the differences.

The AXP comes pre-applied with MX-4, However they only applied a small square in the middle, and I felt the enormous heatspreader on the GTX480 warranted for more than that, so I cleaned it and applied MX-4 from the tube.

At stock, the GTX480 idles at 35.º C, and goes to 61.º C with 99% GPU load. Pretty good stuff (both the MX-4 and the AXP )


Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSmurf View Post
Actually it needs to be replaced every 12 months according to their website. I've never seen it last more than 8 to 10 months before temps started climbing which is one of the many reasons I stopped using it altogether when Arctic Cooling MX-2 was released and haven't missed it at all.
That reason alone would be enough for me to disqualify it unless I already had a tube and no money to buy another TIM.

If you've got a main rig you update frequently, it's already off-putting having to wait a whole week 24/7 for it to cure, let alone if you also use it on your Media Center's CPU or media playback GPU, and forget you have to change TIM every so often.


Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
few reasons:
-doesn't cool as well
-takes forever to cure
-conducts electricity
-competitors don't cost much more
This.

As to those claiming it's not conductive, it has capacitance. The end result might very well be the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSmurf View Post
The problem with Shin-etsu X23-7783D is it's at least 5 to 8 times as expensive as MX-2 (you only get 1/2 gram of Shin-etsu X23-7783D compared to 4 grams of MX-2). That's what keeps a lot of people from using it, especially since it's only 1C better at most.
And MX-4 is 1.º - 2.º C better than MX-2 (review above), so no real reason to use Shin-etsu.

Quote:
Originally Posted by justarealguy View Post
No it doesn't. Take a multimeter, a dab of AS5 and hook it up. You will not see anything.
Take a tiny bit of AS5 and put it over two or four tiny caps that are very near each other on a MB PCB / GPU PCB / GPU Core. Report back. (Don't. Unless you have spare parts you want to experiment on).

Quote:
Originally Posted by justarealguy View Post
If the core has a heat spreader and you use too much, that could be problematic. Very rare, but some people really goob that stuff on. That's user error though.

The real problem is with exposed cores. It can potentially short out the chip. Extremely rare, but it can happen.
Exposed cores like in AMD GPU cores, which also have small caps nearby.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSmurf View Post
I have and it is conductive once you put it under pressure. Not HIGHLY conductive, but it is conductive.

Saw that more than once on socket 462 cpus. It wasn't that rare either.
This.


Quote:
Originally Posted by damric View Post
I have found that no matter the TIM, I like the credit card method of spreading my goo. I always seem to be able to use less like that, and when it comes to TIM, less is best
+1

Me too. Using tiny rice drops is not for me. I like to know exactly how it turns out, how evenly it spreads, where it goes and if it turns out to be the right amount or not. It takes more time to use a credit card to get an even, thin layer, but I prefer this method. And eventual air bubbles haven't prevented me from getting great temps.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PapaSmurf View Post
MX-2 has about the same consistency as AS5. I haven't tried MX-4, but from what I remember about using MX-3 it was thicker than MX-2, but it has been awhile since I used it. I never saw enough difference in temps to justify the extra cost of MX-3 compared to MX-2.

One of the reasons I recommend MX-2 to AS5 users is it's so similar consistency wise that they don't have a problem applying it like they would with some of the other TIM like IC Diamond. Getting good results is as much about application as it is the actual TIM used. Once you get used to applying one type it can take quite a while to get used to applying one that is significantly different and get the same results they did with the one they are familiar with.


Having used both MX-2 and MX-4, I'd say they have about the same consistency, perhaps the MX-4 is a little easier to apply, but I'd really have to test them both at the same time to be 100% certain.

Quote:
Getting good results is as much about application as it is the actual TIM used.
Exactly!
Edited by tpi2007 - 5/14/11 at 12:51pm
 
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post #77 of 87
I used to an AS5 man. I loved watching a nice lap job with AS5 smeared all over it.

I would only mount my equipment with good quality AS5. BTW, AS5 gets better with age. But not too old because it gets all cracky, dry, and flaky. You don't want old dry AS5.

I've since switched over to ICD-7. I find this stuff works better than AS5. With the application, you need experience and know how much to apply. AS5 would only need a small grain of rice, but ICD-7 needs a pea size.
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post #78 of 87
I haven't used AS5 in years because it's been years since AS5 was a good value.

You can get TIMs that cost half as much per unit of volume, perform slightly better, last significantly longer, have no appreciable cure time, and that cannot cause a short if you are sloppy with them.

AS5 isn't bad, it's just outclassed in every conceivable way, for less money.
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post #79 of 87
I use to use AS5, but now I use Noctua NT-H1. It works as good/better than AS5 without the need to wait 200 hours for it to cure.

AS5 does work well, but these days you can get thermal paste that works just as well or better without the need to wait for it to cure.

Though if you really want to get the best of the best though, the best thing you can do is just try them all and see if they work with your configuration. I've seen so many reviews stating some work better than others and vice versa. The one link in this thread shows Noctua NT-H1 at the bottom of the list and AS5 equal/better than it, yet a year ago I read reviews showing it was at the top and better than AS5.
post #80 of 87
Quote:
Originally Posted by tpi2007 View Post
MX-4 and MX-2 are better than AS5. Here for the comparative graphs.
I would not trust their thermal results as they use an artificial heat source and not an actual loaded CPU; this also does not allow them to demonstrate the difference between lapped and unlapped results, provided they conducted such testing in the first place.
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