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[Y!] Germany to scrap nuclear power by 2022 - Page 12

post #111 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by Phaedrus2129 View Post
Sigh.

Greenpeace idiots are fail.

It's the eco nuts and anti-nuclear folks who caused this whole mess, by stopping new, much safer reactors from being built, forcing utility companies to prolong the life of the far less safe first gen reactors. They're also the ones who have delayed and finally halted construction of nuclear waste storage sites like Yucca Mountain, forcing nuclear plants to store their waste on site, much less securely and safely than it would be stored in an actual facility built for that purpose.


Way to go guys. Way to go.
Greenpeace idiots are fail but it's actually safer to store the waste on site than trying to securely transport the material over public roads. Car accidents are far more likely than a terrorist attack at a nuclear site which will be secured against such attacks anyways. All it takes is one car accident and you have millions of people affected plus you make an even easier target for terrorists to try and attack.



Quote:
Originally Posted by ENTERPRISE View Post
If we actually put more R&D into better/greener/renewable energy sources then I am sure we can find something equal or maybe even better than Nuclear power.
There's nothing more efficient than Nuclear fusion. The energy lost in the conversion process at the center of the Sun is the the most efficient method due to the second law of thermodynamics: conservation of energy.
What we use today is fission though; splitting of the atom rather than fusing the nuclei together.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ENTERPRISE View Post
Erm, You must be trolling , please tell me you are not that misinformed.
tbh he's right, but it a very general way. The star that exploded before our Sun and planet existed provided all the heavy elements needed to produce life. But that's a different kind of "nuclear" than most people talk about in the news.

Nuclear Fusion is actually the future of energy. If something like what happened in Japan were to happen at a fusion power plant, it would simply turn off and the reaction would stop immediately. There is no danger of a run-away buildup. See: http://www.iter.org
Edited by PoopaScoopa - 6/1/11 at 11:59am
post #112 of 156
double post doh
post #113 of 156
The German people are heavily invested in alternative energy technology. Perhaps they will refine technology in the future to reduce costs. You may think nuclear is better, but it does have some drawbacks. People should just let Germany do what they believe is best for the interests of their country.
Edited by Riou - 6/1/11 at 12:32pm
post #114 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
Greenpeace idiots are fail but it's actually safer to store the waste on site than trying to securely transport the material over public roads. Car accidents are far more likely than a terrorist attack at a nuclear site which will be secured against such attacks anyways. All it takes is one car accident and you have millions of people affected plus you make an even easier target for terrorists to try and attack.




There's nothing more efficient than Nuclear fusion. The energy lost in the conversion process at the center of the Sun is the the most efficient method due to the second law of thermodynamics: conservation of energy.
What we use today is fission though; splitting of the atom rather than fusing the nuclei together.




tbh he's right, but it a very general way. The star that exploded before our Sun and planet existed provided all the heavy elements needed to produce life. But that's a different kind of "nuclear" than most people talk about in the news.

Nuclear Fusion is actually the future of energy. If something like what happened in Japan were to happen at a fusion power plant, it would simply turn off and the reaction would stop immediately. There is no danger of a run-away buildup. See: http://www.iter.org
I did not say there was anything as efficient or more efficient that Nuclear, perhaps there will never be but there are safer alternatives that can be looked into either way. Plus I was interested in Recent Fusion developments but not typical Nuclear Fusion.

Quote:
tbh he's right, but it a very general way. The star that exploded before our Sun and planet existed provided all the heavy elements needed to produce life. But that's a different kind of "nuclear" than most people talk about in the news.
Yeah he put it across very poorly if that was what he meant.
post #115 of 156
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
tbh he's right, but it a very general way. The star that exploded before our Sun and planet existed provided all the heavy elements needed to produce life. But that's a different kind of "nuclear" than most people talk about in the news.
I think he is talking about how all energy comes from the sun. Nuclear reaction in Sun > plants > *lots of time and preasure*>fosil fuels

Wind is made by air of different temperature...the temperatures is caused by the sun.

So in a way all energy is solar energy. Tidal power and geothermal is more of a stretch, but it all ties back to the sun as the water wouldn't be liquid without the sun's heat and the earth's core would not have formed with out the sun being where it is

But that is really reading between the lines.

This is a bad move though...I don't think we will develop good fusion without mastering fission and like has been said already there are so many people fighting or stalling fission research that we may take much longer to make any progress in nuclear power. However, once the coal mines start to "dry up" I am betting all of sudden we will have fission plants all over the place, so it probably isn't that big of a deal. However, I don't like to see any instance of regression in technology. If you think fission is unsafe, don't abandon it; make it safer. Don't go back to coal born steam power.
Edited by Vagrant Storm - 6/1/11 at 12:20pm
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post #116 of 156
solar pannels = EXPENSIVE and inefficient.
wind turbines = expensive, loud, murderers (to birds/bats), can screw with weather paterns.
coal = dirty
natural gas = poisons groundwater

so what are they gonna do now? get a fusion reactor? its not stable or effective enough yet :/
this was probably a bad idea. why shut down all of the reactors when they could just kill the old ones and get new and efficient reactors?
    
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post #117 of 156
Every time someone mentions "alternative" energy, you need to stop and think about how the materials used to build them(wind towers, solar cells, etc.) are made. It's the same problem with people thinking that buying a Prius is good for the environment. You don't think about how that materials used to build that car were made. All the raw materials such as copper, steel, iron etc. is melted down using coal. The amount of pollution put into the environment buy producing that single Prius is far more devastating than continuing to fix up and drive your 1970s gas guzzler for another 20 years is. Plus on top of that, it's still emitting an amount of pollution itself as you drive it.

There really isn't much more safety concerns to worry about operating a Nuclear Fusion plant than there is to operate a Geothermal plant. Fission often gets mixed up with fusion in the public.
Edited by PoopaScoopa - 6/1/11 at 12:23pm
post #118 of 156
The germans always seem to bounce back, they've lost 2 world wars and still the 4th strongest economy I think they will cope.
post #119 of 156

Your loss, Germany. I can't say it's the brightest idea ya'll have had but then again it ain't the dimmest either...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dromihetes View Post
Chernobal failed due to vodka and the japoniese ones because they should of been closed at the date when the disaster occured ,beeing obsolete tech.
So you can predict earthquakes the day before they happen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
Greenpeace idiots are fail but it's actually safer to store the waste on site than trying to securely transport the material over public roads. Car accidents are far more likely than a terrorist attack at a nuclear site which will be secured against such attacks anyways. All it takes is one car accident and you have millions of people affected plus you make an even easier target for terrorists to try and attack.
I'd love to see the hatchback that can punch a hole in a nuclear container that's in the middle of a convoy running on a private, closed off chunk of road.


Have you thought about it even once? Do you honestly believe they just throw a lead suitcase in the back of an '82 Tercel and trundle on down the road? NO! They have specifically designed containers they use to transport the stuff. These containers are....abused, shall we say, before they're ever allowed to be used.

Here's an example of just how much abuse they have to withstand...

Even after certification, they're not allowed to transport unguarded. most of the trip is made on a train full of armed guards, with any road sections having a quite heavily armed motorcade on either end of the truck carrying it while closing off the section of road the motorcade is on to public use.

Now stop being so damn paranoid. They test these things to the ends of the earth and back to make sure they won't fail.
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post #120 of 156
If we care so much about nature ,let s just use less energy .
Lets start use low wattage electronics and buy less electronics in general ,so the need for more power to be lower.
We have out fault here as we all like to use all kind of stuff that use this kind of energy.
Unfortunately the alternative sources are not present in all areas of the world in necessary amount so the exploatation to be efficient.
   
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