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[Chiphell]Bulldozer Sample Benchmark Leaks - Page 23  

post #221 of 285
Once again, I will post this....

Quote:
Originally Posted by JF-AMD View Post
Beats the hell out of me. I am sitting on a patio overlooking the mediterranean and enjoying a cool drink.

All I will tell all of you is that if you are looking at benchmarks of engineering samples, just know that people who have their hands on samples are probably a generation or two behind. Sure, there are benchmarks, but they won't reflect production. Typically they get ahold of an old stepping as the OEMs get the new steppings.
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post #222 of 285
Ewww
post #223 of 285
Post by JF at XS

Quote:
Originally Posted by JF-AMD
Based on this conversation I have a feeling nobody here is in the semiconductor business, so let me try to explain it to you.

Engineering samples are designed to validate the design and for partners to validate their systems. They are not meant for benchmarking.

There are multiple steppings of samples, comparing one stepping to another tells you nothing unless you know WHY the stepping changed.

When we make engineering samples, we target the best yield, not the highest performance. Then we have more chips to work with. Typically you get a couple of the highest clock speed anyway, those typically stay in our labs, so it is unlikley that you see those out in the wild.

We don't even do any real performance analysis until we get the final silicon. Prior to that, we are totally focused on design validation.

Performance is determined based on the following:

1. The processor
2. The processor microcode
3. The BIOS
4. The Operating system
5. The drivers
6. The compiler code

So, unless you are looking at final silicon and you have all of the other pieces in place, making a statement about the performance of ES chips is completely pointless.

Which is why we just don't comment on those numbers. They probably aren't real. And if they are, they are not representative of what people will see when they get the real products in their hands.

Imagine making a cake. You start with a pile ingredients. You put it all in a mixing bowl. You stir it up. You put it in the oven. You let it cook. You take it out. You put frosting on it.

You are all looking at bowlful of batter and arguing about whether or not it is appetizing.
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post #224 of 285
no new BD rumor in a few days, AMD must have gave up on BD
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post #225 of 285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slappa View Post
Post by JF at XS
Nice, thanks. +rep
post #226 of 285
Pretty much what people have been saying all along. Regarding JF's quote.
post #227 of 285
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post
If BD was spanking SB, you would surely be hearing about it, and I doubt we'd ever hear the end of it.
Who knows? AMD may be waiting for release to start proclaiming BD as the new king of CPUs, I don't recall massive amounts of news about Athlon64 when it came out and destroyed the P4.

Granted, I have to admit I'm leaning towards Intel being the winner, but with AMD nearly catching up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceman23 View Post
These "modules" have nothing to with the Cinebench score. It has 8 real cores that are seen as just that, 8 cores, by Cinebench, and 8 threads are run simultaneously. A module is one core simply sharing resources with another core, that does not mean they are working "as one".
Except if Cine is hard on the parts that each Integer/the 256bit floating point pipeline share, then it'd get lower performance than on a program that isn't so hard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bossie2000 View Post
It's bull****.AMD allready earlier this year say Bulldozer will be 50% faster than Deneb.
And nVidia claims the GTX 590 is the fastest card on the planet due to 3DMark.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceman23 View Post
And Intel could produce chips that would blow those out of the water. Their R&D budget is in a different league, they're already putting out a consumer product with 3d transistors next year. It'd be pretty crazy to think they aren't holding some card up their sleeve.
R&D generally doesn't ensure better results, case in point, GF and IBM combined make Intel look tiny yet they're usually behind on process technology.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GaMEChld View Post
Hmm, this bit of speculation really seems plausible to me. But, at this point, is that even a sound tactic? Does AMD really have much to gain by being coy about the true performance if the performance is actually good? All they might be doing at this point is making people who would've waited for Bulldozer simply move on to Sandy Bridge to avoid the delay and remove the doubt. With Sandy Bridge they know they are getting a good chip, and they can get it now.

Then again, can we expect sensible corporate decisions WITHOUT A CEO?!
What we know, Intel knows.

Why let Intel realize "Oh, Bulldozer is going to destroy Ivy Bridge" and give them time to work out a way to fix that problem? I doubt it'd happen, but on the off chance it did, you'd want to stay quiet to ensure that the other company has less time to react.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post
I highly doubt they would do that, and give false impressions of what their processors are capable of.

With Llano's performance, they are flaunting it, if BD was dominating they'd be flaunting it too.

Bottom line is the B0 stepping chips are buggy, and are being fixed.
Except Llano is out, or at least very close to it whereas BD is still further away.

And Llano doesn't have much to compete with it, BD has IB and SB-E.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heavy MG View Post
The X6 Thubans already perform slightly worse than the 1st gen i7 in most tasks,if the 8 core still performs worse than Nehalem 1st gen i7,then Bulldozer isn't much of an improvement over K10, other than a quicker IMC with higher IPC.
Thuban only matches 1st gen i7 when all cores are used, if they match single core performance or come close to it, then when all cores are used, BD would be superior.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Clairvoyant129 View Post
Only in very highly multi-threaded scenarios, if not then Thuban is slower than Intel's Core 2 Quads.
Last I checked, it was equal or with Thuban pulling ahead very slightly depending on the app, or maybe it was Deneb? (Which is a bit faster than Thuban clock for clock due to tighter internal timings.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cssorkinman View Post
Maybe this program is AMD biased but the scores they show have the phenom 940 being competitive with the core 2 quads.
The 940 having the old Phenom I IMC and being a bit slower than the AM3 Phenom IIs for those who forget.
    
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post #228 of 285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post

R&D generally doesn't ensure better results, case in point, GF and IBM combined make Intel look tiny yet they're usually behind on process technology.
Sure, it doesn't ensure better results, but we already know Intel is ahead on process technology. Are you really trying to argue that AMD is ahead or just stating that hypothetically R&D budget doesn't always mean greater innovation? If the latter, why even bother?
post #229 of 285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post
--snip--
Is that a record for the most multi-quotes in one post?

I dug up an article I had forgotten about that 1st peaked my interest in Bulldozer.

I posted this on another thread, might as well post it here too. ( Check out the date of it, kinda puts things in perspective as to how long some of us have been hearing about the 2nd coming, I mean Bulldozer. )

Quote:
AMD is preparing an all-new PC processor with up to 16 execution cores. Due out in the first half of 2009, the new architecture is codenamed Bulldozer.
Quote:
Bulldozer is the name, crushing Intel is the game

But what about Bulldozer? The big news is that it will form the basis of AMD's first massively multi-core PC processor with up to 16 execution cores. Bulldozer will also be fully compatible with AMD's so-called M-SPACE modular CPU design
Quote:
How fast is she, mister?

It all sounds pretty impressive on paper. But how fast will this 16-core chip be in practice? Well, according to AMD, Bulldozer is designed to be nothing less than "the highest performing single and multi-threaded compute core in history".

If AMD is to be believed, Bulldozer will improve upon every metric of CPU performance. From performance per watt to outright multi-threaded performance and old school single-threaded oomph, it's promised Bulldozer will be the new king.


http://www.techradar.com/news/comput...or-2009-146488
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post #230 of 285
I'm not quite sure yet but I think the website is in chinese.
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