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How to decide on a case for air cooling (warning - pics) - Page 4

post #31 of 2110
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Inverse;13979380 
Outside of the statement of a second fan on the top~ you've said absolutely nothing about its capacity for air cooling on an air cooling thread in an air cooling forum.

There was no reason at all for the OP to blast all Antec cases. Hell based on post history he even owned one.

OP~ you do great things for the forum. I can tell, but just because you had an ill experience with one of your cases, think long and hard before just slamming an entire brand for the purpose of a degree or two celcius~ especially when you don't really have any just cause for it.

Some of you are going to have to really tell me the issue with cable management as well. Are you guys experiencing only the first version of some of these cases? The Antec 900-2 has more holes than I know what to do with. Not having a dual-top fan is mitigated by the fact that the 200mm fan at the top is flippin' awesome.

It's not perfect, but it's a midtower case. The only negative I have with it is having to unscrew drive bays to get to my dust filters. I wouldn't tell people to boycott Antec because of that. lol (I'm just teasing here~)

The Beta Evo is a nice case for instance, it's got the exact same cutouts for cables as the Antec 900-2 and it's way cheaper. Then again it doesn't come with anything but the front fan for cooling so it better be.

Sorry~ just set my trigger off a bit with that. *laughs*

Anyway if you want to use ehume's unorthadox, but very practical method of CPU cooling, you're obviously going to need a no-nonsense case that can be modified with things like forward facing top fans. I just think it's funny that you have a thread celebrating negative pressure and then have this one dictating positive pressure as the way to go.

I did that negative pressure thread to make a point, not outline a practical cooling method. I was demonstrating the power of entrainment.

As for my "unorthodox" airflow recommendations, I note that since the original bottom-up plan was formulated the insides of computer boxes have greatly changed. In the past the motherboard was full of chipsets that needed to be cooled. The cpu was not so difficult to cool. Often passive heatsinks did the job.

Now it is the cpu heatsink that is hot. RAM is down to 1.5v. The northbridge is on-die the cpu. The memory management is now on-die. More and more, the motherboard components can make do with passive cooling while the cpu must be cooled actively.

Nowadays when those mobo components cool themselves they warm the air around them, and the received wisdom on bottom-up airflow would have us ingesting that warmed air into our coolers, compromising their effectiveness. More and more, the cpu needs to get its air directly from the outside.

As for Antec cases, I look at them very carefully. It's not just my own NSK 4480-II that sucked. What I'm seeing is old designs given trivial updates, and still being sold to unwitting, trusting buyers who can't really tell they are buying an outmoded case. It's really disgusting that they are still selling those things, IMO. They get away with it because people keep buying them. Why change when you don't have to? It's as bad as vendors selling 1.5v RAM with huge ego-combs for heatsinks.

That's why I don't like Antec cases. That said, their DF-85 tests out as being an effective cooler of its innards. I haven't studied its cable management, though. That's an element where Antec cases traditionally suck - and I'm not talking about air, now.
Edited by ehume - 6/23/11 at 6:03pm
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post #32 of 2110
Keep in mind, unorthodox isn't meant as an insult. If anything it's praise for discovering something out of the norm.

I definitely see the point of your setup. The more I looked at it the more I wish this setup was adopted by more cases. Having a fan blowing cool air in a position where the cpu can get it most is very smart. I'll admit, I'll definitely be looking for cases with the capacity to have two fans (like many of the Lian-Lis) in the future.

Do you see this as effective enough that it should become a new 'norm' for case design? Like, if it had to have one top fan~ that it be set in the center, or front~ and be used as an intake from default?
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post #33 of 2110
Thread Starter 
I'm working on concepts ATM. But I think that case makers should look more at delivering fresh air to heatsinks.

Lian Li, for example, has a case where air can come directly to the heatsink. The motherboard is inverted, so the heatsink is at the bottom. The air comes in from the back. Right now it exits from the front, but one user modded his to have an exhaust port at the top: the case was getting hot inside, despite a front exhaust.

I wish more manufacturers would build their cases with no rear grill.

Stuff like that.

When I'm done thinking I'll post my ideas.
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post #34 of 2110
So just for fun, last night I decided to try a few different orientations for my P183.

Originally I had 2 x frontal intake, 1 x rear exhaust, 1 x top exhaust as per the default layout. My 2600K was peaking 79C during the hottest times of day running 4.7 @ 1.384v. I changed the top exhaust to an intake and had only the rear exhaust as an exhaust. In addition, I changed the orientation of my Cogage Arrow from vertical to horizontal. Both of these changes combined now allow me to find my 2600k folding bigadv happily at 67C max. With close to 12C difference, I'm beginning to wonder if my initial installation was done properly or not. There's no way such a simple air flow change could lead to 12C in temperature differences.
post #35 of 2110
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Velathawen;13987306 
So just for fun, last night I decided to try a few different orientations for my P183.

Originally I had 2 x frontal intake, 1 x rear exhaust, 1 x top exhaust as per the default layout. My 2600K was peaking 79C during the hottest times of day running 4.7 @ 1.384v. I changed the top exhaust to an intake and had only the rear exhaust as an exhaust. In addition, I changed the orientation of my Cogage Arrow from vertical to horizontal. Both of these changes combined now allow me to find my 2600k folding bigadv happily at 67C max. With close to 12C difference, I'm beginning to wonder if my initial installation was done properly or not. There's no way such a simple air flow change could lead to 12C in temperature differences.

Try the temps again, this time with the side panel off. Then remount your SA pointed south-north again, and again test temps with the side panel off to equalize the testing environment. When you're done you will know if there is a difference between orientations of the SA: vertical vs horizontal. Be sure to test results.
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post #36 of 2110
Hey ehume,

Very interesting article and videos. I'd love to give the positive pressure cooling a try but my current case isn't the best for that concept.

With my Bitfenix Survivor I'm soon going to remove the rear grill and see if flipping the top 200mm fan yields positive results. The way it is currently with a 200mm intake, and a 200mm/120mm exhaust gives my case negative pressure which forms a heat pocket sometimes under my Gigabyte GTX 560ti which exhausts directly into the case.

But for way down the line (year or so) I've been looking at the Xigamatek Elysium as a true Monolith of a case. What do you think of this case for positive pressure cooling?
http://www.xigmatek.com/product.php?productid=122&type=specification
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post #37 of 2110
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Siegfried262;14159380 
Hey ehume,

Very interesting article and videos. I'd love to give the positive pressure cooling a try but my current case isn't the best for that concept.

With my Bitfenix Survivor I'm soon going to remove the rear grill and see if flipping the top 200mm fan yields positive results. The way it is currently with a 200mm intake, and a 200mm/120mm exhaust gives my case negative pressure which forms a heat pocket sometimes under my Gigabyte GTX 560ti which exhausts directly into the case.

But for way down the line (year or so) I've been looking at the Xigamatek Elysium as a true Monolith of a case. What do you think of this case for positive pressure cooling?
http://www.xigmatek.com/product.php?productid=122&type=specification

So close!

I love the fact that they have two stock "4 in 3" units to put 120mm fans in the 5.25 bay. This gives them wonderful flexibility in the front plane.

I love the bottom mesh - it's ready for any combination of fans or rads.

I like seeing such flexibility at the top - lots of possibilities for fans. But is the top set up with filters to allow for intake fans up there?

The case is 230mm wide. Is there room for an Archon? Or a Silver Arrow with the front fan riding up over medium-tall RAM like Ripjaws?

No mention of space behind the mb. Will have to wait for a review to know.

Still has a rear grill. What'sUpWithThat? (I think it's time for a new acronym - WUWT. Hmm. Urban Dictionary already has it.)

Overall, a supremely flexible case. My quibbles are just that - quibbles: the case ain't perfect. But it is a worthy competitor to the HAF X.
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post #38 of 2110
Thanks for the input!

My thoughts with the Elysium would be to load the front spots (additional 5.25" to 120mm adapters where applicable) with fans for intake, load the top spots for intake (Either two 200mm or three 140mm depending on how the 200mm fans sound) and remove the rear fan/grill and see how that in itself performs. Though given the size of the case I wonder if adding any fans would be beneficial.

It'd be fun to do a thorough write-up of the case though, even if that's a number of months away with lots of testing.
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post #39 of 2110
Hi ehume,

Sorry to bother you a bit.. I have a couple question to ask.

1. Right now I own a Corsair 600T and I'm ordering H60 mount with 2 Gentle Typhoon AP-15 as push-pull and 2 more GT's AP-15 as top fan exhaust. Front intake is still that lame 200mm stock fan *sigh* (can you help me with better fan to replace this "thing"?), my room is a non-air conditioned.
The question is: I want to make this lovely case into positive pressure, what and how should I do to make it happen?

2. My friend keep teasing me to replace this 600T into Silverstone FT02, and keep the H60 with the AP-15 as push-pull setting. As all we know, Silverstone FT02 is a decent positive pressure case.
The question is: Should I do this? (Considering the cost of modifying number 1 question is maybe higher than buying this Silverstone FT02)

I really like the idea of this positive pressure and i want my case become dust-less or minimum one. Really appreciate your comment/feedback..
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post #40 of 2110
Quote:
Originally Posted by g.androider;14167924 
Hi ehume,

Sorry to bother you a bit.. I have a couple question to ask.

1. Right now I own a Corsair 600T and I'm ordering H60 mount with 2 Gentle Typhoon AP-15 as push-pull and 2 more GT's AP-15 as top fan exhaust. Front intake is still that lame 200mm stock fan *sigh* (can you help me with better fan to replace this "thing"?), my room is a non-air conditioned.
The question is: I want to make this lovely case into positive pressure, what and how should I do to make it happen?

2. My friend keep teasing me to replace this 600T into Silverstone FT02, and keep the H60 with the AP-15 as push-pull setting. As all we know, Silverstone FT02 is a decent positive pressure case.
The question is: Should I do this? (Considering the cost of modifying number 1 question is maybe higher than buying this Silverstone FT02)

I really like the idea of this positive pressure and i want my case become dust-less or minimum one. Really appreciate your comment/feedback..

The new RV03 cools better than the FT02/RV02-E. And you can also remove the gold strips if you don't like them.

And why are you getting a H60? a Antec Kuhler 920 gets the job done better
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