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post #131 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by BallaTheFeared View Post
I'll agree, except Phenom II will still perform horribly in some games, like WoW, and SC2, and Crysis 1.
My sig rig plays all these games, fast and clean without any exceptions. Even when there's a lot of smoke or volumetric elements in the game.

Also. Aside from gaming, I do video encoding at work aside from graphic design, and those CUDA cores are a lifesaver (and timesaver).


Edit: that's not to say a nicely clocked or even stock-clocked SB wouldn't be better, I bet it would be, but I was just adding my experiences with the setup.
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post #132 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by BallaTheFeared View Post
Because even with a CHV a 1100T will perform the same way it does now on older boards?

I also don't understand why anyone is advocating an eight core cpu for gaming, it must be in another galaxy where that would actually make sense.
I don't think anyone was advocating just any old 8-core cpu for gaming. I think the concern/point was that the architecture behind said 8-core cpu might be worth considering.

Everyone likes to point out that there are hardly any games that successfully utilize 4 cores, and I wholeheartedly agree. However, say you play a game that's 2- to 4- threaded, like StarCraft II, and lets also say there are two cpus available to you, one a quad and the other an octo, and let's ALSO say the octo's architecture allows it to perform better than the quad (in this particular game). Would you still be throwing the "it doesn't need all 8 cores, that's a waste of money" comments?

Again, I don't think anyone is saying "JUST WAIT A FEW MORE WEEKS! 8 CORES RULE 4!" I believe they're talking about the architecture behind the 8-core cpus.


I'd also like to point out that worse =/= horrible; please don't equate the two.
Edited by onoz - 6/21/11 at 10:23pm
 
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post #133 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by onoz View Post
I don't think anyone was advocating just any old 8-core cpu for gaming. I think the concern/point was that the architecture behind said 8-core cpu might be worth considering.

-snip-
How many other 8 core cpus do you know of for consumer desktops?

From what I've read, and seen discussed the per core performance isn't something AMD focused on. Rather overall throughput at the same power draw was. Increasing the x8 bulldozers throughput over current x6 chips while using the same or less amount of power is impressive, but its still 6 vs 8, and nothing has been officially mentioned of its per core performance.

Per core performance isn't what AMD is after, they're after higher multithreaded throughput while meeting, or exceeding last gen power draws. I believe AMD has stopped trying to play the sheer performance game with Intel, and this will be the first architecture that really shows that change of mindset.

I think you'll be paying a lot for a small performance gain in the x4 BD vs the x8 when it comes to gaming. If there is any real performance gain to be had. I am assuming everyone will be disabling turbo and putting the chip to the limits on their own, turbo core aside.

For all we know it could be the same, or slightly slower per core. But it has two additional cores, and uses less power to produce greater results.

Edit: The point I was trying to make was that older motherboards didn't suffer a performance loss with the SLI hack.

As can be demonstarted here, from jprovido post here: http://www.overclock.net/nvidia/6708...l#post13842850

This is their 3dMark 11 run with a Phenom II 1090T @ 4Ghz



You'll notice when comparing just our gpu scores we're about dead even. So when there is no cpu demand the gpus seem to perform exactly the same.

The difference is in our cpus ability to do physics calculations, as well as do them and send rendering information at the same time.



You can see with my modest 4.8GHz overclock I was easily able to outperform equally performing GPUs by nearly 14 fps. I'm not a math genius, but I believe that is a 65% increase in performance 4 cores vs 6. When those 6 cores are reduced to 4, because that is all the game uses that advantage also increases (the 1090t loses 33% of its performance). And when both chips are reduced to two cores, like in Crysis, or WoW, or SC2, or The Witcher 2, or the numerous other dual threaded games the Phenom II x6s performance is reduced by 66%, whereas the i5-2500ks performance is reduced by only 50%.

With this information you can see why the i5 performs so much better than current AMD chips in cpu limited games, and 3Dmark 11 uses physics for its cpu load, a practice that is only going to grow in popularity in actual gaming.
Edited by BallaTheFeared - 6/21/11 at 11:03pm
    
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post #134 of 146
I just picked up an Asus M5A99X EVO from the Egg yesterday to put in my game box. It will do SLI and CrossfireX but I plan on doing neither. I will use all of my current hardware with it and when Zambezi FX is released in September I will pick up a dual module 4 core CPU built on a 32 nm process that will in all probability overclock like a banshee. My frame rates should be considerably faster than with my current 740 BE. Not going to buy Intel and its monstrous profits I'm going for the best value for my money and thats where AMD shines.
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post #135 of 146
Exactly what does that have to do with this thread?

As far as we know bulldozer will bottleneck 570s too.
    
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post #136 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by BallaTheFeared View Post
Exactly what does that have to do with this thread?

As far as we know bulldozer will bottleneck 570s too.
As far as we know...
We don't have solid Bulldozer numbers.
Gimped old engineering samples don't count.

I've already explained how BD's architecture can minimize performance loss with its modular design.

Oh wait, off topic.
If you guys don't want to bring BD into the discussion (understandably) then don't.
This includes the whole "8 core CPUs will suck at games" mumbo jumbo.
Edited by Evil Penguin - 6/22/11 at 2:23pm
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post #137 of 146
Quote:
As far as we know bulldozer will bottleneck 570s too.
NOT THIS^^^ lol
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post #138 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by BallaTheFeared View Post
Exactly what does that have to do with this thread?

As far as we know bulldozer will bottleneck 570s too.
Dude, what's with being the "that's off topic" police? It's not like the OP was complaining about anybody's responses, and a lot of the information is very pertinent to the implications of asking the posted question. Just because it's not directly answering the first question posted doesn't mean that the info isn't useful. Threads would be pointless if all people said in response to the posted question is "yes" and left it at that. It's common, and IMHO, very worthwhile for people to touch upon related things, opening the OP to more info than they normally would have gotten otherwise.
    
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post #139 of 146
Quote:
Originally Posted by BallaTheFeared View Post
Exactly what does that have to do with this thread?

As far as we know bulldozer will bottleneck 570s too.
Because the original question was about an 1100T and SLI which the new Asus M5A99X EVO supports along with the Nvidia Beta drivers released two days ago (but who would buy an 1100T to put into it? PII is almost obsolete now). I'm still trying to figure out if we've been punked by a troll. LOL Look how long this thread has gone on and the original author is nowhere in sight.
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post #140 of 146
To simply answer the question... yes a 1100T would bottleneck 570s in SLI. This is not debatable conversation closed.

But what I am wondering is why you would even consider going SLI with AMD unless you had low end GPUS? Right now if you have AMD the best GPU solution seems to be a single mid to high end card. I would recommend a GTX 460 1gb if you want to be cost effective and don't care about some extra FPS (basically if your very casual gamer). If you really want to max out an AMD CPU and possibly carry over your GPU to a future build get a GTX 560ti, a GTX 570, or AMD 6950. If your going to carry your GPU to a new system then of course you could get something even better.

But SLI? No I just don't see that as a reasonable choice with AMD right now for a GPU like the 570.

Maybe I am just simplistic and not hardcore enough with my performance needs. But honestly SLI just does not really appeal to me right now. I like my system to be simple, and effective. One GPU is more then enough for me and I do play A LOT of games.

I don't understand the talk that Phenoms are so bad for gaming. Sure Sandy Bridge is faster, but its not like Phenoms are a slouch. I guess it makes sense though to hold such high standards in an overclocking forum so that's fine.

But the only game I have which I have ever felt my computer was not performing up to par was when I tried to play Crysis on Very High instead of High settings. When I tried this I clearly felt my system was being bogged down. So clearly AMD does have specific examples of failing to perform. There IS technically a bottleneck.

But every other game I play like Starcraft 2, Fallout 3, Dead Space 2, Civilization 5, Dragon Age, Mass Effect, Witcher 2... they all perform EXTREMELY well on maxed settings.

I don't get why it's such a big deal to have your GPU at 100% load. It's like everyone thinks if its not 100% load your failing and have a huge bottleneck. But honestly I would rather not be at 100% load. It raises the temperature a lot, and is probably much more taxing on the GPUs lifespan. Most games I play I do not get 100% GPU usage, but in many games I use vertical sync because there is no reason to get more then 60 fps on a 60HZ monitor. When I am gettings 60 fps on pretty much every game and my GPU usage is somewhere between 40-80%, I don't consider this to be a problem. Do people ever think that maybe their GPU's are just so powerful that they own games at the max displayed FPS without even breaking a sweat? I like the fact that my GPU can destroy games below 100% usage, most seem to think it's a bad thing?

That being said when I run 3dMark 11, 3dMark Vantage, or a new game such as Witcher 2 my gpu usage does go up to 100%. So when I see my GPU not being 100% it pretty much tells me my GPU does not even need to work that hard, not necessarily that it is slowing me down. Now of course if I got rid of vertical sync perhaps many more of my games would be 100% or close to it.

Why do some games like Witcher 2 make my gpu usage 100% but games like Dragon Age its like 60-70%. It seems to me that older games just don't even really stress nice cards like this topics 570 or my 560 ti. Although this could be due to vertical sync why my usage is so low, why would I want to get more FPS then my monitor can even display?

So basically what I am saying is that a single mid-high end GPU is awesome for gaming with a overclocked AMD CPU. But just because its good does not mean its Sandy Bridge. Sandy Bridge is better for sure.

I am a pretty good/hardcore Starcraft 2 player, and I thought it would be fun to be able to stream my games using Flash Media Live Encoder on Justin.tv. But here is the problem with AMD... sure I can play Starcraft 2 just fine on maxed settings in giant 4v4 battles. But if I try to stream while gaming the processor fails big time. I can do it, but I must lower all the gaming and encoding settings.

So if your going to try to really just have no CPU limitations Sandy Bridge is way better then AMD. In a perfect world everyone would just get 2500k's overclocked with awesome GPU set ups. But for most consumers who do have budgets AMD will do just fine for gaming with a single nice GPU. SLI 570's? Definitely not.
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