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[TC Magazine] Leaked roadmap shows 10-core AMD desktop CPUs in 2012 - Page 29

post #281 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usario View Post
The X6 was around $300 at launch but went down because Intel dominated it, so I don't see what the problem is.

Also I expect the quad-core BD ($190) to be about as fast as the X6 in rendering and much faster in single threaded (35%+ depending on the program and variables in the architecture that we're uncertain of right now).
You sure have high hopes and expectations.
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post #282 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post
You sure have high hopes and expectations.
Lots of amd fans do on here.
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post #283 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post
You sure have high hopes and expectations.
A 35% increase in IPC still puts it behind Intel, so idk what you're trying to get at. If I had to speak in all honesty though the difference could be more than 50% in certain things. Especially with the new FMA instructions.
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post #284 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usario View Post
A 35% increase in IPC still puts it behind Intel, so idk what you're trying to get at.
I thought it was obvious.

You sure have high hopes and expectations.
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post #285 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2010rig View Post
I thought it was obvious.

You sure have high hopes and expectations.
They're not high. Looking at the architecture AMD has done something terribly wrong if IPC increases by less than 30%. And we don't know how scaling with the pipelines and execution units has improved, and we also don't know exactly how much of a difference FMA will make.
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post #286 of 352
Being that all these things have to do something about dirt, I feel this has something to do with Codemasters...
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post #287 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mit Namso View Post
right

with most all games still only using 2 cores, 10 cores is useless for a gaming rig

AMD needs to make a gaming chip
Pretty much all new games coming out use more than 3 cores now.

And gaming isn't the only use for chips...Folding, Transcoding, Compilation, Encoding, etc all use 10 cores easily.
Plus the improved FPU in BD could take to gaming quite well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by born2bwild View Post
Most games are optimized for 3-4 threads. Not 4+. Only a handful of games are able to even use 6.

It seems that AMD is unable to challenge Intel in single core performance, and has changed its strategy to more cores. And although it is a fine idea for servers and multimedia use, it presents no advantage for gaming and the vast majority of day-to-day applications.
Due to consoles, it seems that the vast majority of games are and will remain lightly threaded, and so will not utilize even half the cores on this planned CPU.

Long story short, a chip like this should be a server/workstation CPU and not a consumer desktop one.
The vast majority of day-to-day applications are ran fine on a E-350, AMDs going for servers and workstations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by downlinx View Post
will the 10 core finally be able to stay up with sandy bridge, the world may never know!!!
The 8 core is meant to compete with SB, this 10 core would be for the 6 core SB-e.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 45nm View Post
FMx in this case became FM2. Apparently it will utilize a LGA rather than a PGA.
About time, it looks like the first BD chips will be like the first Phenom II chips, on the older socket.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SectorNine50 View Post
Computing is becoming more and more threaded VERY rapidly, I personally think AMD is doing the right thing going for more cores. I feel that people need to stop looking at what programs are doing right this second, and look at where the trends are headed.

However, I haven't seen any evidence that Intel can't follow suit, just that they haven't. Although, Intel hasn't hit the core count AMD has on their server platforms, so who knows.
Indeed, once physics takes off CPUs will have a massive load on them that can be easily split into as many threads as needed, unless its PhysX.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Theory View Post
Since FM1 is already out, FM2 I would believe would take FM1 processors just saying. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16813131769
Not necessarily, it might not even be FM2 by the time its released.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
Doesn't really even matter anyways. You need a new mobo for the new chipset features regardless. I wouldn't want to gimp my new SB on an old chipset that's missing a bunch of features.
For the most part you don't though, the difference between say, P45 and P55 is only that P55 works for 1156 CPUs while P45 doesn't, not much in the way of performance improvements.

The only time a new chipset is needed is for new SATA, PCIe or USB revisions, IMO.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
Exactly. For desktops, if I want graphics, I buy a separate graphics card. APUs are for cheap HTPCs and portable devices.
In gaming: Fewer cores with higher IPC > more cores with lower IPC.
There's some use for it, say I have a desktop I retire or upgrade and want to put the chip into a HTPC? Done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
It works perfectly fine for an HTPC. I use only it for QuickSync when encoding videos. Not sure why a desktop system would care about the iGPU.
Quick sync should provide one reason.

Some compute stuff runs faster on GPUs than on CPUs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post
I don't see how they wouldn't be just as good with a SB iGPU. The office worker, family member, etc would get more benefit out of the 95% single threaded apps they use with a higher IPC chip. The iGPU in both work perfectly fine for 1080P movies and light gaming so why not get the one with better single/dual threaded performance?
If AMD gets a quick sync like thing going, the AMD solution would be a lot faster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BizzareRide View Post
If you think Intel won't always hold the IPC crown then your rationale will also accept that AMD won't always hold the graphics crown. If not then you only expose your bias and aren't really looking to be swayed by objectivity.

Intel was able to bring an APU to the market 14 months before AMD was(Clarkdale) & increase their IGP performance 200% in just one APU generation.

Intel is looking to incorporate PowerVR graphics into Atom which already compete nice with IGPs from both AMD and Intel. The PowerVR6 core is ~ equal to a desktop 8600GTS... Not impressed? The PowerVR6 has just a 1/10th of a watt TDP.

Intel will lead in chip technology by virtue of the fact that they are able to outspend AMD. Conversely, AMD has far more experience, successfully, at making GPUs. Like I said, you're delusional if you think things will change any time soon.
Money has little to do with it a good amount of the time, AMD was beating/matching Intel with the Athlon Classics and even had the first 1Ghz chip, then completely destroyed the P4. Cyrix didn't even have access to good production facilities but still made great chips.

As for the graphics cores, yeah, it can go either way, AMD could win with core performance in the future and Intel could beat them in graphical performance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 996gt2 View Post
The comparison between AMD and NVidia is a flawed. One does not dominate the other in terms of resources at their disposal. Not the case with AMD and Intel in the CPU market.

Here's why it's not likely that AMD will catch up to Intel in IPC anytime soon:
(Notice I said not LIKELY instead of impossible).

---------------
AMD:
Revenue US$ 6.494 billion (2010)
Operating income US$ 848 million (2010)
Net income US$ 471 million (2010)
Total assets US$ 4.964 billion (2010)
Total equity US$ 1.013 billion (2010)
Employees 11,100 (2010)

Intel:
Revenue US$ 43.623 billion (2010)
Operating income US$ 16.045 billion (2010)
Net income US$ 11.464 billion (2010)
Total assets US$ 63.186 billion (2010)
Total equity US$ 49.430 billion (2010)
Employees 82,500 (2010)
-----------------


With such a big gap, it would take more than a new architecture for AMD to regain the performance lead. It will take a monumental failure from Intel at the same time (e.g. their decision to develop Netburst instead of the PIII architecture).
AMD was still earning a lot less when they were matching Intel before the P4.

WD, Seagate and Samsung were getting a lot less revenue than IBM, but still had HDDs that were nearly as good or better.

Money really doesn't mean much for R&D, its the engineers talents.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kyle7412 View Post
sigh..... when will they learn that more cores =/= faster processor.
Except it does, for encoders, folders, transcoders, etc, more cores does make stuff a lot faster.
    
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post #288 of 352
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Usario View Post
They're not high. Looking at the architecture AMD has done something terribly wrong if IPC increases by less than 30%. And we don't know how scaling with the pipelines and execution units has improved, and we also don't know exactly how much of a difference FMA will make.
Where Phenom II was meant to shoot out 6 IPC 3 from the ALUs and 3 from the AGUs it was stuck with only 3 pipelines

Where FX is meant to shoot out 6IPC 2 from the Execution Units, 4 from the AGLUs but has 4 pipelines

Unified Scheduler
  • EX0 -> Pipeline 0
  • EX1 -> Pipeline 1
  • AGLU0 -> Pipeline 2
  • AGLU1 -> Pipeline 3
technically equals 6 IPC (4 Integer, 2 Load/Stores)
Theoretically 6 but can it achieve it? (I don't know)

Vs
  1. Scheduler
    • ALU+AGU -> Pipeline 0
  2. Scheduler
    • ALU+AGU -> Pipeline 1
  3. Scheduler
    • ALU+AGU -> Pipeline 2
Theoretical 6 but can only achieve 3 IPC

Most people really only care about the "Integer" IPC

so 3 Ph2 IPC vs 4 "BD" IPC
Edited by Seronx - 7/30/11 at 12:34am
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post #289 of 352
AMD, pls increase CPU FSB, not cores. 6+ cores is pointless for 99.9% of population. We need faster HD's and CPU's, not more cores.
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post #290 of 352
Quote:
Originally Posted by whitingnick View Post
AMD, pls increase CPU FSB, not cores. 6+ cores is pointless for 99.9% of population. We need faster HD's and CPU's, not more cores.
lol..

U know very little of today, let alone yesterday. HD are almost irrelevant & cores are the future. To the point where nearly every thread running in Windows, will have it's own core.

But done within a heterogeneous arch.

Secondly, a BD chip will certainly handle any game today (when it comes out), but being of true design, they will also get quicker over time, as code gets more sophisticated, multi-threaded & 64bit.

Lastly, soon game won't have a limit to how many core it will use, it they will simple use them all.
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