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post #5811 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by imaweirdo159 View Post

Just to clarify,I am not not abandoning SWTOR. I just received a copy after I already had the game so i'm selling my extra copy.

I love your avatar.

Question: Has anyone else been getting booted from groups for the easier HMs for being a fresh 50? This has happened to me multiple times already on my Merc BG... I REALLY hope this isn't a sign of things to come. mad.gif
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post #5812 of 8091
Masked - Has Bioware given any consideration to a website which tracks personal/guild valor rank + weekly valor gained by server etc, similar to Mythic's Camelot Herald? That was one thing I loved about DAOC was being able to follow your own character/guild and other guilds progression in realm ranks as well as to see who was pvping actively etc.

I didn't read all the posts in the thread as it is huge, but is there any thing in the works about combat logs? There are times in pvp where I will wonder what hit me because I went from 90%-30% life in the span of a couple seconds, and it is nothing more than a guess on if it was a huge crit, multiple people attacking etc.

I have a valor rank 66 sorc on Sanctum of the Exalted (I know it is a carebear RP PVE Server but almost all my RL Friends are on it so I rolled there). I was the 4th player to hit Battlemaster on the server and currently the highest valor ranked Imperial side player. I have pretty much not done any pvp the last 3 weeks due to burnout. I contemplated cancelling my subscription because the pvp was very unfulfilling in the game but decided to give the pve content a try. I will definitely say that the game has had the most content out out of any game I have played on release (which is quite a few MMO's) I have been enjoying the pve content and it has kept me satisified with the game for now. Definitely one of the better games at release.
post #5813 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cantii View Post

Question: Has anyone else been getting booted from groups for the easier HMs for being a fresh 50? This has happened to me multiple times already on my Merc BG... I REALLY hope this isn't a sign of things to come. mad.gif
This is one of the reasons I've brought up the "WoW mentality" over the past few weeks because, du nu nu nuuuu, it exists rampantly in SWTOR.

The thinking is, if you're a fresh 50 you have bad gear, if you have bad gear you can't DPS, if you can't DPS, you're BAD.

For instance, my Sorc atm is 50/50 in Mystic and Force-whatever; I swap it out for normal groups -- Got an invite to DPS for a normal last night...Was promptly booted because I was "bad dps"...Oh really?

For those of you saying this doesn't happen already; you're crazy -- The WoW mentality came over and as I've said MANY times DPS forces a gear dependency...If you don't have the gear you don't have the DPS and if you don't have the DPS, you're just not worth having around.

And you guys think a damage meter is going to make the above situation better? Ummmmm huuuh....

I told you so.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aawa View Post

Masked - Has Bioware given any consideration to a website which tracks personal/guild valor rank + weekly valor gained by server etc, similar to Mythic's Camelot Herald? That was one thing I loved about DAOC was being able to follow your own character/guild and other guilds progression in realm ranks as well as to see who was pvping actively etc.
I didn't read all the posts in the thread as it is huge, but is there any thing in the works about combat logs? There are times in pvp where I will wonder what hit me because I went from 90%-30% life in the span of a couple seconds, and it is nothing more than a guess on if it was a huge crit, multiple people attacking etc.
I have a valor rank 66 sorc on Sanctum of the Exalted (I know it is a carebear RP PVE Server but almost all my RL Friends are on it so I rolled there). I was the 4th player to hit Battlemaster on the server and currently the highest valor ranked Imperial side player. I have pretty much not done any pvp the last 3 weeks due to burnout. I contemplated cancelling my subscription because the pvp was very unfulfilling in the game but decided to give the pve content a try. I will definitely say that the game has had the most content out out of any game I have played on release (which is quite a few MMO's) I have been enjoying the pve content and it has kept me satisified with the game for now. Definitely one of the better games at release.

Consideration; yes...Beyond that I can't answer. thumb.gif
post #5814 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

This is one of the reasons I've brought up the "WoW mentality" over the past few weeks because, du nu nu nuuuu, it exists rampantly in SWTOR.
The thinking is, if you're a fresh 50 you have bad gear, if you have bad gear you can't DPS, if you can't DPS, you're BAD.
For instance, my Sorc atm is 50/50 in Mystic and Force-whatever; I swap it out for normal groups -- Got an invite to DPS for a normal last night...Was promptly booted because I was "bad dps"...Oh really?
For those of you saying this doesn't happen already; you're crazy -- The WoW mentality came over and as I've said MANY times DPS forces a gear dependency...If you don't have the gear you don't have the DPS and if you don't have the DPS, you're just not worth having around.
And you guys think a damage meter is going to make the above situation better? Ummmmm huuuh....
I told you so.

It's not going to make it worse, that's what we're saying. It happens regardless, so why deny a tool from those who want it for legitimate reasons? A lot of people see theorycrafting as one of the cornerstones of endgame, and SWTOR doesn't let us test our theories.
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post #5815 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Apocalypse- View Post

It's not going to make it worse, that's what we're saying. It happens regardless, so why deny a tool from those who want it for legitimate reasons? A lot of people see theorycrafting as one of the cornerstones of endgame, and SWTOR doesn't let us test our theories.

...You really think it's not going to make it worse than it already is? ~ I disagree.

I think having a meter is going to make it much worse.

SWTOR is unique in that while you do critical 1/4 of the time -- I can essentially look at your profile and guess your DPS...And in a damage meter, you're now labeling a certain amount of gear.

You're not labeling the player, you're labeling his gear...If he has bad gear, he's a bad player -- This is the current mentality in the game.

Now you're giving those pugs a tool to prove that bad gear = bad player...Regardless of if they are, or not. -- That's the issue.

If you threw out the packet issues, the hacking and everything else, you'd still have the elitist mentality that made wow a flaming box of crap...And you want to bring that here? Wrapped with a shiny bow on top?

I just don't see that as being a rational choice for the community at large -- Guilds, maybe but, for the individual, it's a precursor to changing the dynamic completely to WoW.
post #5816 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by digitard View Post

Finally completed Act I on my Sith Sorcerer.
Man, that fight... that... *******... fight.
I haven't been using Khem as I'm lightning spec'd and with the static barrier I've been rolling same level elites. Well... that ended fast. First I have to use him, and he's under geared so I picked up what I could, and then on top of that. At 32 that ***** is HARD!
I wiped twice, and decided to make it easy. So I hit up a 50 who was on the planet anyways, and he burnt her to the ground. MUCH harder than the Jedi Sentinel fight I had for Act I.
Such a good story, though, so far and I'm loving my Sorc far more than my Sentinel. Dark Side For Life... or until they improve my Sentinel and make me want to play him again. 50 and never used.
I went tank spec'd Assassin for that fight. She was almost tough. Almost. Tank spec rolls everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by allikat View Post

Meh, Talos Drelik for the win, every time. My favourite companion, and with good gear, and 10k affection he keeps my Deception spec Assassin going through thick and thin. Love it.
Amen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

...You really think it's not going to make it worse than it already is? ~ I disagree.
I think having a meter is going to make it much worse.
SWTOR is unique in that while you do critical 1/4 of the time -- I can essentially look at your profile and guess your DPS...And in a damage meter, you're now labeling a certain amount of gear.
You're not labeling the player, you're labeling his gear...If he has bad gear, he's a bad player -- This is the current mentality in the game.
Now you're giving those pugs a tool to prove that bad gear = bad player...Regardless of if they are, or not. -- That's the issue.
If you threw out the packet issues, the hacking and everything else, you'd still have the elitist mentality that made wow a flaming box of crap...And you want to bring that here? Wrapped with a shiny bow on top?
I just don't see that as being a rational choice for the community at large -- Guilds, maybe but, for the individual, it's a precursor to changing the dynamic completely to WoW.

Except it's not, because WoW is a "flaming box of crap" for far more reasons than just having DPS meters. If you really want to improve the situation, you should take away the ability to inspect people's gear and make everyone just GUESS as to what other people are capable of. If a person has bad gear, they aren't capable of doing excellent DPS. It's how gear progression works.

If someone is sitting there in a full set of greens at level 50 with no oranges or mods, I'm not going to carry him to his Columi in hardmodes. Without doing any 45+ flashpoints (only questing), I had a full set of oranges with max level mods when I hit 50, so when I stepped into hardmodes, I facerolled my way to becoming my guild's favourite flashpoint tank. If you don't want to put effort into getting any gear at all, why should we be putting effort into a group with you? On the other hand, if you have some oranges and a few Tionese pieces and aren't dying to enviro, come get your free loots while I'm grinding out for my last couple of Columi pieces.

Stop blaming the entire community for the actions of a few people. Meters and information are a tool to be used responsibly. Just because some people don't use them that way doesn't mean we shouldn't have them. After all, just because some people drink and drive doesn't mean that the government stops selling alcohol, or letting people drive, now does it?
 
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post #5817 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by DWSR View Post

Except it's not, because WoW is a "flaming box of crap" for far more reasons than just having DPS meters. If you really want to improve the situation, you should take away the ability to inspect people's gear and make everyone just GUESS as to what other people are capable of. If a person has bad gear, they aren't capable of doing excellent DPS. It's how gear progression works.
If someone is sitting there in a full set of greens at level 50 with no oranges or mods, I'm not going to carry him to his Columi in hardmodes. Without doing any 45+ flashpoints (only questing), I had a full set of oranges with max level mods when I hit 50, so when I stepped into hardmodes, I facerolled my way to becoming my guild's favourite flashpoint tank. If you don't want to put effort into getting any gear at all, why should we be putting effort into a group with you? On the other hand, if you have some oranges and a few Tionese pieces and aren't dying to enviro, come get your free loots while I'm grinding out for my last couple of Columi pieces.
Stop blaming the entire community for the actions of a few people. Meters and information are a tool to be used responsibly. Just because some people don't use them that way doesn't mean we shouldn't have them. After all, just because some people drink and drive doesn't mean that the government stops selling alcohol, or letting people drive, now does it?

Except at this point in the game, we are discussing players in full, max oranges, being booted because they're not max DPS -- Which is a community issue on the OF.

Meters are a tool to be used responsibly, however, they're not -- Just like they aren't in WoW...

Alcohol is a completely different topic as it doesn't leave the bank vault wide open for the common criminal thumb.gif
post #5818 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

Except at this point in the game, we are discussing players in full, max oranges, being booted because they're not max DPS -- Which is a community issue on the OF.
Meters are a tool to be used responsibly, however, they're not -- Just like they aren't in WoW...
Alcohol is a completely different topic as it doesn't leave the bank vault wide open for the common criminal thumb.gif

People are always going to get booted for reasons. Meters will provide another reason for that and I agree with Masked that it will increase it. I however still do want meters in some form. I want to be able to measure the performance of my fellow raiders and know who is doing what. In fact I don't care about dps, i want to know about damage taken, how much damage you actually do and where its going. I think a raid summary that would include what world of logs does would be fantastic.

Personally I don't think a meter would change things much more than they do now and meters didn't make wow nearly as bad as the people complaining about them make it out to be. Out of my years in wow I could count on my hands the number of times people were booted due to low numbers that were not significantly lower then where they should be. Usually it was 2-3k dps at 85 in a heroic. And most of the time it started off with a hey "xxx" your not really doing a ton are you afk? Then they proceed to mouth off.

As I have stated, just give personal DPS and information only smile.gif
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post #5819 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by Masked View Post

This is one of the reasons I've brought up the "WoW mentality" over the past few weeks because, du nu nu nuuuu, it exists rampantly in SWTOR.
The thinking is, if you're a fresh 50 you have bad gear, if you have bad gear you can't DPS, if you can't DPS, you're BAD.
For instance, my Sorc atm is 50/50 in Mystic and Force-whatever; I swap it out for normal groups -- Got an invite to DPS for a normal last night...Was promptly booted because I was "bad dps"...Oh really?
For those of you saying this doesn't happen already; you're crazy -- The WoW mentality came over and as I've said MANY times DPS forces a gear dependency...If you don't have the gear you don't have the DPS and if you don't have the DPS, you're just not worth having around.
And you guys think a damage meter is going to make the above situation better? Ummmmm huuuh....
I told you so.
Consideration; yes...Beyond that I can't answer. thumb.gif

I was the healer in an ops group that took down HM Gharj and I had full Champion gear minus one piece which was Centerion. I was able to keep them alive (with some help with others using medpacks) until the very end when I died but at that point Gharj was so weak they were able to finish him off.

So it just boils down to the people your playing with.

As for people on orange gear I don't think it would be a problem as long as they know the fights but I don't think I would take on the HM Ops quit yet.
 
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post #5820 of 8091
Quote:
Originally Posted by MoonTar View Post

So it just boils down to the people your playing with.
As for people on orange gear I don't think it would be a problem as long as they know the fights but I don't think I would take on the HM Ops quit yet.

I'm pretty sure the problem is exactly that. Folks who aren't geared to the max aren't necessarily unable to do the job, but elitists are too lazy to take the challenge of having a player that may DPS or heal slightly less than ideal.

Honestly, if the mentality is already there, I might end up dropping the game as soon as I hit max level. I'm not willing to deal with *******s who don't like a challenging raid and don't actually grasp the concept of teamwork. I am curious if the mentality is more common on certain servers. I'm willing to move again, to maybe a RP-PVE server if the people there are better. tongue.gif Number one reason I'll never roll on a PvP server is the ****-talking and attitude.
    
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