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[TH] Tom's CPU Architecture Shootout: 16 CPUs, One Core Each, And 3 GHz - Page 12

post #111 of 223
While the utility of comparing individual core performance is limited, I am literally astounded that people are doubting the basic results.

None of this should be even remotely surprising.

I have owned at least one example of every architecture on that chart, and these results correlate closely with my own, and more importantly have been widely known by damn near everyone since the introduction and original benchmarking of the respective architectures.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Am* View Post
These processors all have different HyperTransport/bus speeds
Completely irrelevant.

Hypertransport speed has almost no impact on the performance of anything, outside of multi-socket workstations/servers.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Am* View Post
They're using 4 DDR2 memory modules in their older setups, which would stress the crap out of the IMC on both of the older AMD dual cores, yet they're using the optimal 3 modules for the tri-channel 1366 CPUs and 2 modules for dual-channel CPUs.
Also largely irrelevant.

More "stress" on the IMC does not reduce performance, only the ability to OC, and usually only by a small amount.

My sig system, at the same core/uncore clocks would match the 980x almost exactly, regardless of QPI bus speed, and despite the fact that I have six DIMMs.

The only difference four DIMMs vs two would have likely made on the DDR2 boards is T1 vs T2 command rate, which would have been a negligible difference in these tests.
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post #112 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by Am* View Post
Uhh no...

Clock for clock means just that: a comparison done at identical clock speeds. If you're going to make an article beyond just another "mock-up/draft", bus speeds are just as important as the core clocks, and same goes for the memory (downclock it to 800MHz across the board, then we'll talk about who has the best architecture instead of a bandwidth advantage).

Even if putting all this aside, for them to use 4 memory modules on a dual-channel DDR2 IMC is a step too far. "Normal user" setups are irrelevant here, as they would take no interest in this article.
Why would someone care how their system performs with a cut-down FSB or memory speed when they'd never run it like that in the first place?

The goal wasn't to determine the raw calculations-per-clock cycle that a CPU is capable of--you can get that number from the manufacturer. It's to cut down the cores to one and see where the performance gains/differences are in various applications. There's no relevance in changing the bus speeds away from stock to match across platforms if a user would never run their rig like that. One might argue "why would someone run their rig with only one core enabled?" Well the significance is that some applications are still not parallel-threaded, or cannot take advantage of multiple cores--so that IS relevant. But anything else? No. Think about it this way--if you were giving someone advice on what CPU they should get, do you think they would care how their system performs with a FSB of 200mhz when it should normally be operated at 300mhz?

There is no relevance in testing real-world applications on configurations that people will never use.

Again, like I said, if people are so concerned about raw CPU-only power, just monitor small-set superpi calculations, or something where virtually nothing has to leave the CPU to be calculated--I guarantee you that the trends would almost mirror what's shown in this Toms study. Oh, right, then people will complain that the calculation-to-cache communications within the CPU aren't the same either... Or that one CPU doesn't have L1/L2/L3 cache...or that the inter-CPU latencies aren't the same...or some other inane thing to nit-pick and gripe about. Take it at face value.
    
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post #113 of 223
Seems like bad timing to release this now without Llano @ 3ghz included. I understand testing takes time, and articles need editing before publication but I want to see exactly were something like the A8-3850 stacks up single thread performance-wise.
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post #114 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryDemon View Post
Seems like bad timing to release this now without Llano @ 3ghz included. I understand testing takes time, and articles need editing before publication but I want to see exactly were something like the A8-3850 stacks up single thread performance-wise.
Whats the point? Unless it totally massacred SB all of the whiners in this thread would just spout off about how "Tom's is biased" and "this is a stupid article"....
post #115 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryDemon View Post
Seems like bad timing to release this now without Llano @ 3ghz included. I understand testing takes time, and articles need editing before publication but I want to see exactly were something like the A8-3850 stacks up single thread performance-wise.
This has already been tested elsewhere.

Llano is core for core, and clock for clock, very similar to the Athlon IIs, as expected.
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post #116 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post
The only difference four DIMMs vs two would have likely made on the DDR2 boards is T1 vs T2 command rate, which would have been a negligible difference in these tests.
Not in WinRAR, I get a 300-400KB/s increase on my Phenom II going from 2T to 1T.

Compression in general is very RAM limited.
    
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post #117 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blameless View Post
This has already been tested elsewhere.

Llano is core for core, and clock for clock, very similar to the Athlon IIs, as expected.
I'm sure it has, I think I remember reading that article too. But it would be nice to have it included in here, to see just how incremental the improvement is.
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post #118 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryDemon View Post
I'm sure it has, I think I remember reading that article too. But it would be nice to have it included in here, to see just how incremental the improvement is.
I think his point was that it would perform right between the Phenom II and Athlon II, which has a very small difference between the two already.
    
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post #119 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brutuz View Post
Not in WinRAR, I get a 300-400KB/s increase on my Phenom II going from 2T to 1T.

Compression in general is very RAM limited.
This is true, but the difference shrinks the fewer cores are used and the less memory performance becomes a factor.

I do think there could have been some improvements in the testing methodology, but the final results are unlikely to change to an appreciable degree.
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post #120 of 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by BallaTheFeared View Post
I think his point was that it would perform right between the Phenom II and Athlon II, which has a very small difference between the two already.
There is a bigger gap between Phenom II and Athlon II in gaming scenarios.

We already know AMD CPUs tend to not do as well in synthetic benchmarks. The architecture is just older. They need to come out with something newer.
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