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[TS] Puget dissects vertical vs. horizontal chassis cooling - Page 9

post #81 of 93
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fuell View Post
I think your still not getting what he's saying. I think Purple means that this article is manipulating the data and only drawing attention to what they want to show to make a pre-assumed point really. The FT-02 was DESIGNED to be verticle case, so tipping it into a horizontal position just forces it to work in a way it wasn't really designed for. And the fact that a case purposely designed vertically absolutely decimated the temps of a purposely designed horizontal case.

So when you think about it, vertical still appears to be better, they just mask this obvious bit of info by tipping the case on its side (against the design) and say "see, no difference" while ignoring the fact that the reason its temps are far better than other cases is because of the design.

Although, one could say that it should have had worse temps when horizontal if the positioning mattered... So its all about layout/fans rather than vertical vs horizontal. I'm getting confused... too early in the morning...
Purple and you are looking at the variables differently from Puget and the way I see it. Puget was not comparing if case A was better than case B. They were comparing if rotated motherboard tray was better than traditional motherboard tray orientation.

In their tests, the orientation of the FT02 had negligible effects. It was just a case with good airflow. With the P180, "hot air rises" rotated motherboard performed worse than the traditional orientation. The P180's airflow is not that good.

The FT02 likely performed better because it had more airflow and more fans than the P180. It was not because the FT02 had a rotated motherboard. If the rotated motherboard was the difference, the P180 would have had better temps in that rotated config. Also the FT02 in the traditional horizontal config would have had much worse temps.

I would still get a FT02 for its aesthetics and other axillary benefits. The cooling "improvements" from a rotated motherboard would not be why for me.
post #82 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riou View Post
Purple and you are looking at the variables differently from Puget and the way I see it. Puget was not comparing if case A was better than case B. They were comparing if rotated motherboard tray was better than traditional motherboard tray orientation.

In their tests, the orientation of the FT02 had negligible effects. It was just a case with good airflow. With the P180, "hot air rises" rotated motherboard performed worse than the traditional orientation. The P180's airflow is not that good.

The FT02 likely performed better because it had more airflow and more fans than the P180. It was not because the FT02 had a rotated motherboard. If the rotated motherboard was the difference, the P180 would have had better temps in that rotated config. Also the FT02 in the traditional horizontal config would have had much worse temps.

I would still get a FT02 for its aesthetics and other axillary benefits. The cooling "improvements" from a rotated motherboard would not be why for me.
However, the entire design of the FT02 is made possible by its rotated configuration. Good luck fitting 3X 180mm fans along the front or back of a case. And if the motherboard had a traditional orientation with the fans on the bottom the 3D card would be acting like a wall inside the case blocking airflow. The 90 degree twist of the motherboard allows the length of the card to face into the airflow instead of the card being 90 degrees to the airflow.

The fact that the airflow is vertical doesn't really make any difference. However, I don't see how you could get equal performance in a horizontal layout. Where would you put the 5.25 bays without displacing one or two 180mm fans?

My conclusion is that the FT02's design is rock solid and well thought out even if convection has nothing to do with its performance.
Edited by Epitope - 8/15/11 at 8:11am
    
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post #83 of 93
Why is a French car company testing pc cooling?
trololololo lo lo lo lo
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post #84 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epitope View Post
My conclusion is that the FT02's design is rock solid and well thought out even if convection has nothing to do with its performance.
but that's also the article's conclusion - I'm not sure why so many people are arguing against it, or even bringing in how good of a case the FT02 is. The article was to show that rotating to allow convection doesn't mean squat at these temps and airflows - and it did that well.

Now as to whether rotating allows a better cooling layout - well that's a different article.
post #85 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_beast View Post
but that's also the article's conclusion - I'm not sure why so many people are arguing against it, or even bringing in how good of a case the FT02 is. The article was to show that rotating to allow convection doesn't mean squat at these temps and airflows - and it did that well.

Now as to whether rotating allows a better cooling layout - well that's a different article.
That's just it though. People giving their drive-by opinions about how this article apparently meant to them that the vertical layout is useless was causing a hive mentality to form.

The short quips have to be dealt with, or we just end up with one false idea being replaced by another.
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post #86 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_beast View Post
but that's also the article's conclusion - I'm not sure why so many people are arguing against it, or even bringing in how good of a case the FT02 is. The article was to show that rotating to allow convection doesn't mean squat at these temps and airflows - and it did that well.

Now as to whether rotating allows a better cooling layout - well that's a different article.
Part of the community thought the article was an attack on their e-peen.
Now that everyone's calmed down (hopefully) and understood the conclusion they can stop calling the article fraudulent.
post #87 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by FLCLimax View Post
so they're not the best air cooling case due to vertical orientation, but rather because of the layout. so they're still the best air cooling cases and don't result in bent videocards? i can live with that.
^^^^this^^^^

Quote:
Originally Posted by HybridCore View Post
This. You can probably see that in most conventional cases, the hard drives are in front, thus making the cold air warmer resulting in higher temps. Basically, don't let your components receive air that's been heated by other components. I do believe the 90 degree rotation does have it's benefits. One that you've mentioned is not having bent/warped video cards or whatever else gets hot. Another is that the heat on the lower GPU won't be trapped between it and on the higher GPU if you have 2 that are mounted one right on top of the other.
^^^aha^^^^

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaldari View Post
That's just it though. People giving their drive-by opinions about how this article apparently meant to them that the vertical layout is useless was causing a hive mentality to form.

The short quips have to be dealt with, or we just end up with one false idea being replaced by another.
Exactly! A++++++++++

BTW I didn't think or even cared if the article or anyone on here was bringing the FT-02 into disrepute. Anyone who's owned the case will know it speaks for it's self. I can't see myself buying another case for, well maybe ever! try saying that about a HAF when you reach pubity! lol
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post #88 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_beast View Post
Please think about what you're saying, and what the article is trying to say.

It is not about which case or case layout its better.

The fact that the temps did not change when the FT02 was rotated quite clearly means it is not the rotation that is responsible for the low temps that case is capable of. It is the overall layout of that case. It is perfectly possible for someone to design a case that matches the FT02's performance but with the motherboard the 'right' way round - because they'd just have to use the layout shown in the 'rotated' view of that case.

The myth that has been debunked is the often-touted but completely irrelevant fact that hot air rises, so top should be exhaust crap. Not that the FT02 is a great, cool case.

Someone could come along and build a vertical-alignment case that cooled like crap - the motherboard alignment alone has little to do with the temps, it's the overall layout that's important.
I think the point is that you cant design a horizontally cooled case which cools as well as a vertically cooled case without major alterations to fundamental case design principles. You would need to shorten the depth and reposition both the 5.25" drives and hard drives while changing around some other key components.

Meanwhile, by simply rotating the motherboard 90 degrees, all you have to do is add a few extra inches of depth to accomodate the extra fans on the bottom. Much simpler while providing the same tangible cooling benefit.
    
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post #89 of 93
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epitope View Post
However, the entire design of the FT02 is made possible by its rotated configuration. Good luck fitting 3X 180mm fans along the front or back of a case. And if the motherboard had a traditional orientation with the fans on the bottom the 3D card would be acting like a wall inside the case blocking airflow. The 90 degree twist of the motherboard allows the length of the card to face into the airflow instead of the card being 90 degrees to the airflow.

The fact that the airflow is vertical doesn't really make any difference. However, I don't see how you could get equal performance in a horizontal layout. Where would you put the 5.25 bays without displacing one or two 180mm fans?

My conclusion is that the FT02's design is rock solid and well thought out even if convection has nothing to do with its performance.


Flip this on its side and you basically have FT02 like airflow. Albeit this only has 140mm fans. A similar can be done with 180mm fans in theory.
Edited by Riou - 8/16/11 at 11:28pm
post #90 of 93
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riou View Post


Flip this on its side and you basically have FT02 like airflow. Albeit this only has 140mm fans. A similar can be done with 180mm fans in theory.
I'm pretty sure Silverstone saw the ABS and Lian Li cases and decided to do that but with the fans facing the bottom. The 3 AP-181's can move a lot of air but get 4 high speed gentle typhoons and they should be the same.
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