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post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
sorry if this is wrong place for thread!

Background info:

I may assemble a pa system for a friend (tech guy for a company that is contracting a hall) depending on if his company really wants it, he asked me to get some parts and numbers crunching
(this system is going to be used for two huge halls 100ft by 50ft by 75ft)
note: also would prefer help from a dj that has dealt with external amps

parts:
mixer: Yamaha MG32/14FX
deckioneer ddj-s1
mic box:VocoPro UHF-8800 + VocoPro UBP Wireless Mic Pack (if the need arises to use head mics)
speakers: Yamaha SW218V, Yamaha S215v x4
amp: Yamaha P5000S


set up:
audio sources (mics, pc, ipod, deck) --->mixer--->amp---->speakers

now for the question:
the amp it self can power 2600watts (1300x2); and basically i need and amp for each speaker, total 5 amps (13000w system). Is this right? i am not sure how mixer to amp exactly works but if this is right i only have two final stereo outputs from the mixer, is it safe to get a splitter to send the final channels to all five amps?

Other notes:
these are pretty much the final parts and I have dj'ed in the past but never worked with equipment that uses external amps =0; also i know the amp is 600w over max but i will make sure not to blow ***** up!

thanks in advance!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Edited by BadAssClocker - 8/14/11 at 11:24pm
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post #2 of 20
Ok first
Whats your budget?
Second
Are you brand limited or will you take some suggestions?

Now i will go though you list and toss some ideas at you.

Mixer: Are you sure you need 32 ch and are you sure you want analog as digital consoles will give you some more bang for your buck that 32 is about $1200 the best cheap digital that gets close to 32 ch is a presonus studiolive 24 at about $3K but it would give you gate/comp and better eq control for every channel. There are others i can recommend if you are willing to go with some other brands of analog consoles. If you only need a few channels the presonus studiolive 1642 is the board im using now and can be picked up for about $1800

Deck: I have no suggestions here as i am a front of house engineer and not a DJ.

Mics: Those are a good deal. But quality wont be great good for general announcing not for vocals and a good wireless mic costs about $400 a mic so budget is a big deal here.

Speakers: First you need 2 double 18s (Trust me i have my PA set up with 3 18s a side in a 40*60ft room you will miss haveing it right away). You have 4 of the 215s already planed so that's fine. Ill post my alternatives further down as this will be the longest one.

Amps: I suggest 3 brands of amps crown,qsc and for the budget crowd carvin. That being said crown and qsc are way better amps than Yamaha carvin is a bit above par vs the Yamaha's. Also the rating is 1300*2 at 2ohms the 18s are 4ohms bringing the wattage down to 750watts*2 so you ether have to bridge the 5000 and get 2 one for each double 18 or get a 7000.


Now you are missing some stuff first off the 18s need a crossover and your gonna need a bunch of spekon and xlr cables as well as mic stands and racks to put the amps in. I would estimate the finale cost of the stuff you posted at about 6k + about 2k in cable,outboard gear,ect so you need at least a working budget of 8k.

Now i said i would post my suggestions for your speakers. If you really have some capital than get JBL's easily 10X the quality both in build and performance. I dont know if you would be willing to bend on parts as you said that was your final list but if you were willing to look at some other stuff i will post links if requested.


Anyway ill keep an eye on this thread or you can pm me ill explain stuff more in depth if you want
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post #3 of 20
Thread Starter 
sorry forgot to mention budget; 10k after taxes and shipping so around 9k before tax and shipping; also i have already got a list of cables: 8x xlr, 5x 16 ga speakon; and i am not brand named base very much still up for suggestions

yeah i did look into digital mixers, but roughly i am going to fur sure need 22 inputs mono and two stereo, if there are better ones out ther for about 25-30 inputs let me know

for mics yeah i heard that the quality is it not the best but it will do for the amount of mics i need; if you know of any cheap but good wired mics i am down for that just will need a lot more cables or it might be a good idea to get a cable box.

speakers, i kinda like the price for the speakers right now if there are better ones for same or less i am up for suggestions; the only jbl i see that are out the same priced are the JRX125, better or worse?

amps yeah the plan was to bridge it; still up for better suggestions, i am looking at the DCM2000L or QSC RMX2450? any thoughts

sorry for the noob question, can you explain the crossover needed for the 18s

for the etc stuff like mic stands and all of that is pretty standard stuff that i can but for real cheap locally; for the racks i was going to custom build three (one fore the amps, one fore the mixer, deck and pc and one for the mics which will be placed above the technicians box) at home depot (will end up a lot cheaper i am hoping) and i will place huge fans on the front and rear or each rack just to keep everything cool
Edited by BadAssClocker - 8/15/11 at 5:02pm
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post #4 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadAssClocker View Post
sorry forgot to mention budget; 10k after taxes and shipping so around 9k before tax and shipping; also i have already got a list of cables: 8x xlr, 5x 16 ga speakon; and i am not brand named base very much still up for suggestions

yeah i did look into digital mixers, but roughly i am going to fur sure need 22 inputs mono and two stereo, if there are better ones out ther for about 25-30 inputs let me know

for mics yeah i heard that the quality is it not the best but it will do for the amount of mics i need; if you know of any cheap but good wired mics i am down for that just will need a lot more cables or it might be a good idea to get a cable box.

speakers, i kinda like the price for the speakers right now if there are better ones for same or less i am up for suggestions; the only jbl i see that are out the same priced are the JRX125, better or worse?

amps yeah the plan was to bridge it; still up for better suggestions, i am looking at the DCM2000L or QSC RMX2450? any thoughts

sorry for the noob question, can you explain the crossover needed for the 18s

for the etc stuff like mic stands and all of that is pretty standard stuff that i can but for real cheap locally; for the racks i was going to custom build three (one fore the amps, one fore the mixer, deck and pc and one for the mics which will be placed above the technicians box) at home depot (will end up a lot cheaper i am hoping) and i will place huge fans on the front and rear or each rack just to keep everything cool


So as you can probably tell im kinda a carvin guy my dad has been purchasing from them since the early 80s i can totally vouch for there build quality. I have run there amps in temps of 100+ and have had some of my cabs fall 6+ft unharmed. The biggest advantage the carvin amps have over the Yamaha's is the signal though so you can pass your main L/R send though the fist amp down to the next amp and so on. O and carvin has the best support ever mostly cause there here in america so your talking with someone who speaks English lol.

Now for mics if you go wired you will want at least a 24ch snake depending on where you want to mix from. Generally its about 75ft away from the mains so a 100ft 24*4 or 24*8 snake.

Now JBL's will sound better but for a similar model its gonna cost more. I will post pics of my setup in an edit as the pics in my gallery are super old. My new setup is much better about 20k watts.

Now the crossover is important because the 18s only need frequencies up to depending the the 18 and your personal taste about 120 hz im my case my front loaded 18s are at 85 and my folded are at 120.

Now if i were in your spot i would do one of two things
1. I would get this as it comes with all the cables and some mic's then i would add another amp and 2 more double 18s ether at the time of purchas or later
2. I would smae up a few more g's and get this. This gives you the amps and cables to tri amp the mains giving you a lot more control over the mains.

Ether way you can call carvin and talk to there reps they do custom systems to fit your room/budget and are super cool to work with they will help you every step of the way.


Anyway i will answer any more questions just post em.
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post #5 of 20
Thread Starter 
wow thanks help very much appriciated; i am definatly going for the package that comes with the 32 channel mixer

i will defiantly pm you if it goes through and send you the pictures!


oh one more last minute question can i use the XD88 X-Drive that comes with the package as a crossover for the subs?
Edited by BadAssClocker - 8/15/11 at 9:04pm
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post #6 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadAssClocker View Post
wow thanks help very much appriciated; i am definatly going for the package that comes with the 32 channel mixer

i will defiantly pm you if it goes through and send you the pictures!
Ya i have always loved carvin back in the 80s my dad would go to there facility with his rider truck full of gear and they would go though it all and make sure it was good to go. The packages give you more for the $ and carvin wont sell though retailers you can only get carvin gear directly from carvin. Ill pm you with some pic's of my system in action as i have show's the next two days.
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post #7 of 20
Thread Starter 
cool thanks and can you look at my above edit i have one more question
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post #8 of 20
So he wants to buy components?

If it's just for this one event, you can rent it.
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post #9 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by BadAssClocker View Post
cool thanks and can you look at my above edit i have one more question
The answer the that is 100% yes that's what its designed for. If your looking at the system i posted it will be tri amped so the internal crossover in the TRX215N is bypassed so you have individual gain control over the low mid and high of each cabinet the cable they give you for those is NL8 it has 8 wires in it i think there 12 gauge you run low/mid/high though each one and use the NL4 cables for the 18s. When you order it call carvin and talk to them they will help you understand the system and what you need to do to get it up and running they are really good about helping people out with there systems.


Quote:
Originally Posted by this n00b again View Post
So he wants to buy components?

If it's just for this one event, you can rent it.

From my understanding it is not just a one time thing and they will need the PA often.
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post #10 of 20
Well for the xover aka crossover, the right way to do it would be to get something like a dbx driverack.
Like so: http://www.sweetwater.com/store/detail/DriveRkPaPls/

If you're really on budget you could get a graphic EQ and just cut all the highs and mids.

Personally I recommend, if you can fit it into the budget, the PresonusStudio live 24 as the board as it is jam packed with many features like the acp88 compressor / gate on each channel. Also with this board has built in a graphic eq but is a 24 channel board.

Also I agree with darthspartan that carvin stuff is really great for the $$$. And with a low budget of 10k it's hard to get better.
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