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post #11 of 29
Just put the stock cooler back on, if you do it correctly, they won't be able to tell.. If you have the original invoice, rma is free, unless you are out of USA. Also athlon micro is located in California, not sure why they have you ship to hnk.
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post #12 of 29
http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bu...#Magnuson-Moss

Send them that, tell them it's illegal to require certain branded products to be used to retain warranty, and see what they say. While the entire graphics card including stock fan could be considered the entire product, it usually isn't in this case. If they still don't take it, try filing a complaint with the FTC; you can find a link at the page above. It's kind of a grey area, and I don't think the FTC has made any ruling on the subject, but it's a shot, even if it's in the dark.
post #13 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioxbliss View Post
http://business.ftc.gov/documents/bu...#Magnuson-Moss

Send them that, tell them it's illegal to require certain branded products to be used to retain warranty, and see what they say. While the entire graphics card including stock fan could be considered the entire product, it usually isn't in this case. If they still don't take it, try filing a complaint with the FTC; you can find a link at the page above. It's kind of a grey area, and I don't think the FTC has made any ruling on the subject, but it's a shot, even if it's in the dark.
What?

Modifying the card is perfectly valid reason to void warranty. The cooler+card are one unit in this case. If they required you to buy a new stock cooler or something to rma, that would be different, but here the product was clearly modified by the end user.
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post #14 of 29
Thread Starter 
to be honest guys I was super gentle,just bad luck....
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post #15 of 29
Thread Starter 
thanks for the replies, anyways athlon wants me to send it to them. Then they ship it to HK to be fixed. I guess they outsource it to another company.
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post #16 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
What?

Modifying the card is perfectly valid reason to void warranty. The cooler+card are one unit in this case. If they required you to buy a new stock cooler or something to rma, that would be different, but here the product was clearly modified by the end user.
That logic does not hold up given past cases. There's a reason why companies like Dell can't void a warranty on an entire computer just because the end user put in new RAM or a new hard drive. Or why car manufacturers can't void the warranty on an entire car just because the end user put an aftermarket exhaust on. In both these cases, the warrantied item is made up of multiple working parts and sold as ONE product. Also, the law puts the burden of proof on the manufacturer, NOT the user. In effect, in this case, Sapphire would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the modification directly caused the problem. In this case, unless there was physical damage from the installation or more modifications made other than the cooler, they would have to prove that the particular cooler used wasn't sufficient or in some other way flawed. Courts have taken this law to be pretty broad consumer protection of late, and companies rarely have the stones to cross it. It's the best shot for anyone who modifies a product and needs to use warranty channels to get something fixed.
post #17 of 29
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioxbliss View Post
That logic does not hold up given past cases. There's a reason why companies like Dell can't void a warranty on an entire computer just because the end user put in new RAM or a new hard drive. Or why car manufacturers can't void the warranty on an entire car just because the end user put an aftermarket exhaust on. In both these cases, the warrantied item is made up of multiple working parts and sold as ONE product. Also, the law puts the burden of proof on the manufacturer, NOT the user. In effect, in this case, Sapphire would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the modification directly caused the problem. In this case, unless there was physical damage from the installation or more modifications made other than the cooler, they would have to prove that the particular cooler used wasn't sufficient or in some other way flawed. Courts have taken this law to be pretty broad consumer protection of late, and companies rarely have the stones to cross it. It's the best shot for anyone who modifies a product and needs to use warranty channels to get something fixed.
thanks man, I really appreciate your knowledge and suggestions.
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post #18 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by audioxbliss View Post
That logic does not hold up given past cases. There's a reason why companies like Dell can't void a warranty on an entire computer just because the end user put in new RAM or a new hard drive. Or why car manufacturers can't void the warranty on an entire car just because the end user put an aftermarket exhaust on. In both these cases, the warrantied item is made up of multiple working parts and sold as ONE product. Also, the law puts the burden of proof on the manufacturer, NOT the user. In effect, in this case, Sapphire would have to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that the modification directly caused the problem. In this case, unless there was physical damage from the installation or more modifications made other than the cooler, they would have to prove that the particular cooler used wasn't sufficient or in some other way flawed. Courts have taken this law to be pretty broad consumer protection of late, and companies rarely have the stones to cross it. It's the best shot for anyone who modifies a product and needs to use warranty channels to get something fixed.

It has been this way for YEARS now. If you screw up a product yourself, it is your fault, not theirs. The warranty only covers manufacturing defects, not user error. Every computer component manufacturer in the industry does not cover user error. AFAIK, XFX is the only company to explicitly state that you are allowed to replace the stock cooler without voiding your warranty. For other companies, MSI for example, they will still issue an RMA, as long as you return the card to a stock state before sending it to them.

Back to the car example (note i do not know much about cars), if you replace the tires with something not designed for your car, and you end up ruining your wheels, the car manufacturer is NOT going to warranty that. You screwed it up.

If you were to attempt to challenge this in some sort of court, you would probably win anyways because i doubt that AthlonMicro/Sapphire Tech are willing to pay for a lawyer to come and deal with you...
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post #19 of 29
I think if you have the original invoice they don't ask for a charge.. well at least thats how I remember it. And don't tell them you took the coolers off. If you don't tell, they may never know or suspect it.

Just put it all back on as carefully as you can.
    
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post #20 of 29
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
It has been this way for YEARS now. If you screw up a product yourself, it is your fault, not theirs. The warranty only covers manufacturing defects, not user error. Every computer component manufacturer in the industry does not cover user error. AFAIK, XFX is the only company to explicitly state that you are allowed to replace the stock cooler without voiding your warranty. For other companies, MSI for example, they will still issue an RMA, as long as you return the card to a stock state before sending it to them.

Back to the car example (note i do not know much about cars), if you replace the tires with something not designed for your car, and you end up ruining your wheels, the car manufacturer is NOT going to warranty that. You screwed it up.

If you were to attempt to challenge this in some sort of court, you would probably win anyways because i doubt that AthlonMicro/Sapphire Tech are willing to pay for a lawyer to come and deal with you...
Regardless, they need to prove that the modification caused the problem directly. I use non-approved tires on my car, yet when my axle snapped and my car hit the pavement, Honda still covered the warranty. There was no way for them to directly prove the tires caused the issue. Nowhere in their warranty does it state user modification is not covered, but they held the warranty regardless, because they have to. Courts aren't necessary for this type of thing as the FTC handles complaints quite well.

If Sapphire were to challenge it, their argument would go something like, "The part in question is sold as one complete unit and is expected to be used as such." FTC's rebuttal would go something like this, "What makes the cooler so special that it MUST be used and cannot be replaced with something else? What makes this cooler so different from other parts being replaced in a whole computer?" At this point, it would become very difficult for Sapphire to argue their point as there's so much data that the cooler itself can be replaced without issue. Thus, they would switch tactics and say the user caused the problem during installation, at which point the new counter-argument would be lack of physical damage. At that point, they're stuck, as they have zero precedence and zero proof. Their legal department would see this coming before any official proceedings for sure. Physical damage (that they can prove was caused by the user) would be their only bet in this case.

Of course, all you'd really need is the threat. There's no way they'd risk any kind of government intervention or legal action over one RMA. For a pair of 6990s, what's the cost to them? $1200 max, I'd say. That's about 1 hour with a good corporate lawyer. So, I'd make the threat either way, whether I plan to follow through or not.
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