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Steelseries Kana - Page 14

post #131 of 503
If I could choose one thing I would of liked from the sensei would be 0% acceleration/inconsistent accel cause the shape and build quality is awesome only thing missing to me.

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post #132 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
No, I don't think that. And yes, there was a request from a large customer, in one specific area of the world, to do a "pro" version of Kinzu so we did that. It sold just okay. With little to almost no demand from the rest of the world, so little demand that we didn't even launch it in a number of regions.

Should I choose between a double braided cord and TTC/Omron switches right now, I would go with the cord.
I mean this as an absolute genuine question but: Why a braided cord over more durable switches? I would tend to think that higher rated switches would be more appealing even to the casual/general audience.

Edit: I should clarify, I know you stated why in the first part of your answer to the other question but you guys have your Diablo 3 mouse that's advertised with "10 million clicks", and trying to walk in the shoes of the general buyer I would still prefer more clicks over a braided cable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FatPirate View Post
If I could choose one thing I would of liked from the sensei would be 0% acceleration/inconsistent accel cause the shape and build quality is awesome only thing missing to me.
It's something they can't fix, and that's something some people fail to understand. I can understand people complaining about stuff like their firmware (I've had a lot of trouble with 1.4.2 on the Xai, hence why I use the stock 1.2.179) but complaining about the sensor when they can't really do anything about it is pretty lame. While this is highly opinionated, I would agree in saying that they've chosen the best laser sensor on the market. And no, I'm not a SteelSeries fan boy (I've been bouncing between a DeathAdder and a Xai for the past 6 months).

And yes, I completely agree, if the Xai/Sensei didn't have any acceleration and had reasonable perfect control speeds all the way up to 5001/5700 CPI (Xai/Sensei), SteelSeries would have a near perfect mouse.
Edited by sixxxxxx - 9/19/11 at 11:25pm
post #133 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixxxxxx View Post

And yes, I completely agree, if the Xai/Sensei didn't have any acceleration and had reasonable perfect control speeds all the way up to 5001/5700 CPI (Xai/Sensei), SteelSeries would have a near perfect mouse.
Oh yeah 100% agree I just have never been able to stick with a mouse that has accel long enough to even know if I'd get used to it like this shape so much though haha. I guess I can wait and see about the Kana.
post #134 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by sixxxxxx View Post
I mean this as an absolute genuine question but: Why a braided cord over more durable switches? I would tend to think that higher rated switches would be more appealing even to the casual/general audience.
I would think that more people probally requested braided cables, as he said no one complained about the TTC switches.




Quote:
Originally Posted by sixxxxxx View Post
And yes, I completely agree, if the Xai/Sensei didn't have any acceleration and had reasonable perfect control speeds all the way up to 5001/5700 CPI (Xai/Sensei), SteelSeries would have a near perfect mouse.
The perfect control speed on the avago 9500 sensor is the highest rated, and that doesn't change on the different dpi levels. It does however have some inconsistent positive acceleration but if you have the right mousepad its quite minimal
post #135 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by HaiiYaa View Post

The perfect control speed on the avago 9500 sensor is the highest rated, and that doesn't change on the different dpi levels. It does however have some inconsistent positive acceleration but if you have the right mousepad its quite minimal
I think he meant on certain cloth surfaces where the perfect control and malfunction rate is a joke. (not SS's fault)
post #136 of 503
So if I was to get this mouse what cloth pad should I get for it I got the Talent right now.
post #137 of 503
Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
I am 36 years old, I barely finished elementary school. I am just a nerd who really likes gaming.
Now you're just being rude. Obviously i know who you are, i thought it's important for you to know who you're talking to.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
We don't try to cover "the whole market" with our products.
What i meant was you're making products for all kinds of ppl, with different grip styles, personal tastes etc. I didn't mean you're producing cheap mice to cover "the whole market". Sure some are cheaper than others and of lower quality and that's because some ppl don't like spending 100$ on a mouse. You can try to deny that all you want, but it's just how things are done in real world. You fail to realise i have a life also, i work in marketing, i know exactly what THIS is all about. Otherwise give me a reason why kinzu has no side buttons, why you don't use omrons for it, why you sell them with plastic skates instead of teflon. Don't tell me some ppl prefer cheap plastic skates over teflon ones. That's the "whole market" you're trying to cover. The guys who don't have a clue what teflon skates feel like, who don't know how omrons feel and sound compared to TTC and prefer spending only 35$ on kinzu. That's why Samsung is releasing LED TVs of different sizes, contrasts, different image quality and design. Some don't care about design, others don't care/want about a big screen so they prefer to spend less money. Doesn't mean the smaller, uglyer Samsung TV LED it's not the best in its class.
But this is completly off topic so let's just forget about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
I am not following. If you are making a point about preference and personal taste, I completely agree: a mouse is by far the peripheral most subject to personal preference. But I still don't understand your point.
My point was you said glossy surface is cheaper. So why isn't Xai RUSE cheaper than the black rubberized one? Im not talking about the sides.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
I didn't say it didn't matter. I told you, very honestly and openly, it is price point decision. And after that I said that we have received zero negative feedback from the players we have testing the mouse.
Why don't you make a poll like you did with Mouse1.1? If the feedback of pro players is all you need think again about who's buying your mice. Im pretty sure f0rest will play just as good with a brick instead of kinzu, so i can't say pro players are the best ones for giving feedback. You're saying you wanna make mice for players, well GeT_RighT will play just as good with a ball mouse. The acceleration in Xai and Sensei is no problem for him because he plays like 24/7 and he got used to it. Normal gamers play 3-4 hours a day and they don't have time to adjust to it. Another thing i know for sure is most of these guys play with a high sensitivity and acceleration is not a big problem in this case. But when you play with 400 DPI and 1.9 ingame like me you constantly hit the malfunction speed on cloth pads with Xai.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
No, I don't think that. And yes, there was a request from a large customer, in one specific area of the world, to do a "pro" version of Kinzu so we did that. It sold just okay. With little to almost no demand from the rest of the world, so little demand that we didn't even launch it in a number of regions.
If Kana turns out to be what im hoping for then be prepared for a "pro" edition no matter the costs. I'm trying to help you know? I can't help you just by praising you're products, the best thing i can do for us all is pointing out the issues so you can fix them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
Should I choose between a double braided cord and TTC/Omron switches right now, I would go with the cord.
Why not both? What is the price you're aiming for? I refuse to think Kana is gonna cost the same as kinzu, so in my opinion the side buttons is difference enough. I won't even tell you alot of guys feel that a non-braided, thin, ductile cord is even better than a braided one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
And, I repeatedly said that you and you guys - meaning visitors to this forum - are not the market. That has nothing to do with calling you paranoid or anything to that effect. You are on a hardware forum. Visited by hardware enthusiasts. If I wasn't clear on what I was saying, apologies, but with this clarification, go back and re-read what I wrote. You are not representing the general market in your request, you are not representing the players we normally test our products with. This is not an insult, this is a fact. I have presented our mice products to some 300+ journalists who write about hardware, all over the world. I have been asked about switches by a total of 4 or 5 persons (all of them China, Japan or Taiwan).
We are not the market? What is the market then kimrom? The journalists? The so called pro players? Only China and Japan count? Correct me if im wrong but my best guess is 50% of your profit comes from US and EU. You keep implying that pro players are best for giving feedback but you are so wrong. And even if you care only what pro players think, why are you talking like you know who i am? Who we are? I used to play CS in clan TeG from Romania in 2002. Back then we played with ball mice. I played on Clanbase and many other international competitions when i was younger. I was there when the first optical mouse was born. I think your attitude here is wrong. Basically what you're saying is only the ppl who like your products are THE MARKET. What about the rest of us who find faults in SS mice?

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
Now, one of the reasons I am here, is because I would love to change this. I would love to make our products better. Listening to you (you, as in everyone here) and understanding your viewpoints, will only help me understand that and allow me to create those better products. Have recommendations for a flawless sensor? I am all ears. Have recommendations for switches? I am all ears. But please don't attack me or accuse me of lying, I am being open and honest.
This is what i'm trying to do. I'm just having a conversation, not trying to attack anybody. Just asking questions ... why you did that? why don't you do this? I never accused you of lying, i only said maybe you are wrong sometimes and the decisions you guys took can be improved.
Back on topic, i keep hearing about the PixArt sensor in Kana. What about Avago 3090? It's a prediction free optical sensor, no acceleration and more than enough IPS. There's only 2 mice atm with this sensor, one is a complete fail i hear and the other one is just too small. I would love to see this sensor in an ambidextrous mouse, cause i think it's got potential. The only problems are the DPI steps, but if anybody can fix that properly i think it's SS.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
Heck. I am even giving mice to community selected members of this forum, to give you guys a knowledgeable and unbiased sources for your information. I think I have demonstrated best practice and best intentions here?
Sure you did! And this means you care about the users on this forum and their opinions. Why would you say we are not your market when you obviously think we are? Im not even sure what "this forum" means. There are ppl here from all around the globe, different ages, different cultures etc. The only thing we have in common is the fact that we all care about mice a little above average, maybe more than we should.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
I am sorry we have different viewpoints, and you can keep taking stabs at me, but I haven't seen any reviews or heard any negative comments on the sensor on Xai - except from a very small minority. The Xai was the first laser sensor that my sponsored pro players gave the thumbs up. And the only laser sensor that is consistently winning tournaments, afaik.
That was a cheap shot, but you provoked me. Basicaly we all want the same thing. But you can't expect everybody to like a product. I've bought 2 Xais last year (Black one and RUSE). I can send you the SN if for some reason you don't believe me. So I AM one of your customers. The reason im not using either atm is the inconsistent acceleration of the sensor on cloth pads. Basically in a FPS i can't hit anything with it from a distance. I used it for 3-4 months trying to get used to the sensor. Otherwise the shape and build quality is perfect. I can see how it is the perfect mouse for RPG and strategy games, but for FPS i can't use it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kimrom View Post
That is why we went with it again. Not because we are evil, not because we don't care, but because its the best laser sensor we see on the market. Have recommendations? I am all ears. I am always all ears. We all are. We want nothing more than to build awesome stuff.
How is 9500 better than 6010? More DPI? Then we have a conflict of interests. The big companies making mice want higher DPI. What for? Nobody uses 11000 DPI. What you should care about is acceleration, prediction, jitter ... that's what makes a flawless sensor. Not billions of DPI. I would still be using the Xai if you guys went with ADNS 6010 instead of 9500. I'll take prediction over acceleration any day and 2000 DPI is more then enough for any resolution. The one that started this DPI war knew NOTHING about mice.
post #138 of 503
@kaingosu

Too lazy to answer on all of your post but are you aware of the pretty ****ty max. speed of the A6010?
post #139 of 503
ADNS 6010 is a crappy sensor with a VERY low malfunction and perfect control speed. I'm considering responding to your full post later since you are wrong in many aspects, but its sooo long
post #140 of 503
Can someone please tell me if the Kana will be optical or laser? I really want to buy a new mouse this month but if it's going to be optical i might just wait for it and see how it is.
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