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[Official] DotA 2 Information and Discussion Thread. - Page 545

post #5441 of 17124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sisaroth View Post

You must have never played a game with techies in it.
biggrin.gif:D well played sir
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post #5442 of 17124
Hi, can i get an invite for the ocn dota 2 club. Ive been playing a more dota 2 lately.
My steam id is gianz900.
TY.
post #5443 of 17124
WALL OF TEXT INC I apologize in advance.


HarrisLam it's fine, everyone is entitled to their own play style I wasn't bashing you I just saw your comment and wanted to use it as an example for a concept that I know many people are suffering from - I used to be the same myself until I realised the reality of the situation, and I'm pretty sure you awesome people want to step it to the next level? The point when you do make this transition, when you stop yourself from the mentality of "wanting to play another hero" just because of an enemy pick, is the point where you will make a huge jump as a Dota player: from someone who does stuff based upon gut feeling and doesn't really know why, to someone who really thinks for himself and understands and knows the game - playing the game and knowing exactly where you stand, in your complete comfort zone and recognizing exactly what you need to do and having fun doing it.

There's nothing wrong with playing a hero only one way, but you are needlessly stopping yourself from one of the most fun aspects of Dota (IMO) - stuff like support spectre and sniper or carry puck. Mmmm.

But really it's not just having fun, understanding why stuff happens and not limiting your picks based on "definitions" you picked up, will make your picking and your playstyle so much more effective


So in all honesty Harris you are just a convenient example of what I mean, I don't mean to demean your play at all but if you want to be an awesome Dota player and fit right in to Very High games and all that good stuff then I'm pretty sure this will help.

For example Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
I meant nothing more than "not playing sniper against a slardar."

This my friend, is exactly what I mean. Sniper owns Slardar as much as Slardar owns Sniper. He tries to sprint at you and headshot rapes him, he tries to run and headshot slows him, when he is running away with sprint +damage assassinate will do tremendous damage; But on the other hand slardar can own a solo farming sniper.
  • So what can you do? You can not pick sniper and needlessly limit yourself, or you can pick sniper and adjust your playstyle from what is standard: be aggressively ganking that slardar and own him all game.
  • Don't think "Slardar owns Sniper", rather think "Slardar owns a solo farming sniper 1v1 for most of early and mid game because of amplify damage and sprint to close the distance and stun to keep him in place" and see how you can work around it.
  • "Slardar is squishy during sprint unless he went tank items, in which case he has less damage, and Slardar can only get the opportunity to initiate on Sniper if Sniper allows it by solo farming, in addition if slardar does not have a strong early laning phase he will be useless"


It's a similar story with Riki vs Slardar. Slardar counters invis, but if Riki initiates on slardar and smokes him, Slardar gets desssssstroyed. Both can work against the other, the one that comes out on top is the one who recognises their weaknesses and strengths - the one who knows why, not just "what".
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
Against luna I usually either pick PL because I can outfarm her that way, or Void because he is a harder carry. If they have those heros and my team already has like 3 carry heros, I'll just pick a semi-support lion and pray for the best.

If the other team has great teamwork I lose anyway, so I just try my best to account for what my team lacks, and what is the best against the other team, picking to have a solution to a potential problem, etc.

Accounting for what your team lacks is excellent playstyle, the point I am making is to do that, but don't do it needlessly based on "definitions" that you may have in your head. Rather do it based on reasons.

E.g. Your team has 3 agis who can carry and a strength (something completely random like AM safelane, Drow mid, Tide and Mirana hardlane), you need to lane with your hard carry bot and your brain is telling you "crap we need a pure support int or we'll lose", so based upon your "definition" you pick a hardcore support int hero like kotl or dazzle or even lion or whatever.

And you go support your carry bot, and what happens? You can't do anything about their offlane bounty hunter. He comes and kills the big creeps in your pulls and you can't stop him because he has stout shield and your attacks tickle. He uses jinada and invis strike to bring your HP down and bullies you out of lane (although your AM farms) and he gets tons of XP and basically wins his lane (just getting xp and not dying is enough for an offlaner to win his lane), and he smoke ganks mid and top at 6 despite your massive warding and dust and all that stuff and your team gets off to a bad start and lose the game.

What your team actually needed was
1. someone who can keep their offlane BH out of XP range permanently
2. someone who can keep their snowball carries from snowballing by ganking actively
3. someone who can push towers or help to push towers to snowball your own team, give that AM time and space to farm

So if on the other hand you thought about what your team needs, which hero can do all that? Juggernaut comes to mind. Keep bounty hunter out with spin and sentries, keep their carries and mid laner down with his ganking skills, and taking lots of towers early with healing ward - and Jugg by the way is fine buying wards and dust and everything all game. And omnislash with tides ultimate can destroy teamfights. He would be an excellent pick for your team and amazingly he isn't a hardcore support int hero!

Just a strange example where you don't need a hard support int, because people seem to think every team must have one.


tl dr; think about what you do in Dota. Be the better player. Analyse what your team actually needs and pick based on that, not on the theory of hero counters or predefined ideas.
Edited by hamzatm - 6/1/13 at 7:41am
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post #5444 of 17124
I'd rather play against furion (prophet) than a lot of other heroes in the game. He is pretty squishy so all you need is like two people with a stun and you can kill him over and over. Even if he farms dps items you should still be able to own him because he is alone a lot of the time.
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post #5445 of 17124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sisaroth View Post

You must have never played a game with techies in it.

I mostly play captains mode whether in leagues or scrims. Techies is never seen in those games.

I hate Furion because I like running offensive trilanes with a safelane carry (particularly Lone Druid) then running heavy 5-man midgame with teamfight/push, and he is a very good hero against this strategy. Most of these days if I see a Furion I'll still run a similar strategy but with more counter split-push. I like putting a solo Antimage against him in lane as it works very well (AM will get freefarm past level 3 or so and get a 13 minute battlefury).
Edited by Deceit - 6/1/13 at 9:37am
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post #5446 of 17124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Deceit View Post

I mostly play captains mode whether in leagues or scrims. Techies is never seen in those games.

I hate Furion because I like running offensive trilanes with a safelane carry (particularly Lone Druid) then running heavy 5-man midgame with teamfight/push, and he is a very good hero against this strategy. Most of these days if I see a Furion I'll still run a similar strategy but with more counter split-push. I like putting a solo Antimage against him in lane as it works very well (AM will get freefarm past level 3 or so and get a 13 minute battlefury).

Techies isn't in Dota 2 yet and it would be imba there weren't strategies/heroes to counter your 5 man strat.
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post #5447 of 17124
Ugh, I need to stop collecting items and buckle down to get some practice in.

Feel like I'm getting worse mechanically with the more game theory I'm picking up.

Hopefully we'll have the next inhouse setup for next month!

I need somebody to yell me into Dota shape.
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post #5448 of 17124
Hey guys ...

I just wanted to find out if who the "best" Natures Prophet player is ... both for off-laning and Jungling ... ...

I am looking to mess around with NP for a bit seems my fave heroes got nerfed and it is between NP and Doom ... So I figured NP is more of a pro choice ... lol



::: EDIT :::

Just noticed my poor spelling ... ROFL
Edited by Emissary of Pain - 6/2/13 at 6:56am
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post #5449 of 17124
ROFL @ natures profit

Hey Ham, thanks for the advice!! I feel the things you said are of course possible, I just dont think I'm up for the challenge at this moment. I'm most willing to try out new heros when I'm with a team I can trust, even heros in different roles that people usually play them in. Just hard to have new strats work out with strangers, I'm sure you understand that.

Hey EF, for the above reason, MUST GO SAME LANE next time we play, lolz...




I'm going to go off my main tracks and pick random heros. Support necro now seems to be a decent choice tongue.gif

Is the new changlog with necro ult with scepter disabling buyback already in effect? I currently buy boots then go mek, scepter and sheep, wards in between, don't know what to do beyond that though.
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post #5450 of 17124
nope, but since icefrog pretty much released 6.78 for ti3 the patch should come along soon enough
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