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post #871 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

go ahead if you really think there's something wrong with it...
How is it a fanboy statement? And how am I supposed to prove my opinion? I've played both, put about 10 hours so far into DotA 2 and I realize that it is still a long way from a releasable product, but as of now HoN is by far the superior product, in my opinion, of course.

How so? I am not bashing/trolling/anything else, I am just curious. What are the aspects that you feel Dota 2 is lacking compared to HoN or what makes HoN the superior? I am just looking for details. I love insight and to hear what others think smile.gif
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post #872 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldMold View Post

How so? I am not bashing/trolling/anything else, I am just curious. What are the aspects that you feel Dota 2 is lacking compared to HoN or what makes HoN the superior? I am just looking for details. I love insight and to hear what others think smile.gif

DotA 2 is slow biggrin.gif
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post #873 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by dezahp View Post

Main reason I'll be playing Dota over HoN is because of S2 heroes. S2 heroes are garbage

RAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!
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post #874 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by OldMold View Post

How so? I am not bashing/trolling/anything else, I am just curious. What are the aspects that you feel Dota 2 is lacking compared to HoN or what makes HoN the superior? I am just looking for details. I love insight and to hear what others think smile.gif

1. There are more heroes. I realize there are 104 dota heroes, with about 60 yet to be ported. I have a feeling some of those heroes (ie: invoker) may not get ported at all. Invoker is a nightmare for the developers. But, all these heroes are old, and will not offer anything new over the old DotA. This is supposed to be DotA 2. HoN had several new heroes created in beta to go along with the ports.

2.Itemization is more refined, and there are more items to chose from. DotA 2 will not be adding new items for a long time... Probably not until beta is over. Unless they already have and I'm not aware? Also, I prefer the way the shops are set up in HoN compared to DotA 2.

3 Hero skins. These are just a fun part of the game that I'm not sure DotA 2 will implement or not... Hopefully... it makes the game more interesting, and aesthetically pleasing. It wouldn't be a big deal if they didn't though.

4.HoN is faster paced. The game, naturally has the potential to go on for a long time, but DotA 2 seems to plod along at a slower pace than HoN. Could just be me...

5. 3v3. I love 3v3, and it is incredibly fast paced, exciting, and dynamic. DotA 2 has nothing like this so far, but they should definitely create a 3v3 map. The 3v3 HoN map is very fun, and well thought out - much more successful than the other 2 maps they made.

Anyway, I know DotA 2 is still in beta... And with team they have at Valve I have no doubt they will do everything in their power to deliver a superior product. In fact, I suspect DotA 2 will be a much better, refined game by the time it is released. These are things I've noticed so far, and I'm sure I'll come to enjoy DotA 2 more the more I play it. I'm not bashing DotA 2 or being a HoN fanboy. I enjoy both games actually.
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post #875 of 17107
I also prefer the HoN UI, and the matchmaking system seems to be faster.
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post #876 of 17107
I've played HoN since it was in the very early stages of beta and Dota's beta has been far, far better than HoN's beta stage in almost every aspect. And the pace of a game is however you want to play it. Some people think it's slow but they're just being complete asinines because if you pick heroes who farm then of course it is going to slow. Pick some pushing heroes and the pace of the game incredibly changes.
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post #877 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

1. There are more heroes. I realize there are 104 dota heroes, with about 60 yet to be ported. I have a feeling some of those heroes (ie: invoker) may not get ported at all. Invoker is a nightmare for the developers. But, all these heroes are old, and will not offer anything new over the old DotA. This is supposed to be DotA 2. HoN had several new heroes created in beta to go along with the ports.
2.Itemization is more refined, and there are more items to chose from. DotA 2 will not be adding new items for a long time... Probably not until beta is over. Unless they already have and I'm not aware? Also, I prefer the way the shops are set up in HoN compared to DotA 2.
3 Hero skins. These are just a fun part of the game that I'm not sure DotA 2 will implement or not... Hopefully... it makes the game more interesting, and aesthetically pleasing. It wouldn't be a big deal if they didn't though.
4.HoN is faster paced. The game, naturally has the potential to go on for a long time, but DotA 2 seems to plod along at a slower pace than HoN. Could just be me...
5. 3v3. I love 3v3, and it is incredibly fast paced, exciting, and dynamic. DotA 2 has nothing like this so far, but they should definitely create a 3v3 map. The 3v3 HoN map is very fun, and well thought out - much more successful than the other 2 maps they made.
Anyway, I know DotA 2 is still in beta... And with team they have at Valve I have no doubt they will do everything in their power to deliver a superior product. In fact, I suspect DotA 2 will be a much better, refined game by the time it is released. These are things I've noticed so far, and I'm sure I'll come to enjoy DotA 2 more the more I play it. I'm not bashing DotA 2 or being a HoN fanboy. I enjoy both games actually.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

I also prefer the HoN UI, and the matchmaking system seems to be faster.

First and foremost I must state that HoN was created in an attempt to create a standalone DotA game that is trying to be the same as Dota but different at the same time. The S2 developers want it to be so similar that they have been ripping Dota changelogs since the games creation and that will probably never change. Yet they want it to be different so they mix and match some Dota 1 heroes and abilities, while adding entirely new heroes and items at the same time. It doesn't work for me. Pick one. Either create a standalone Dota clone (which fails without IceFrog at the helm) or create an entirely unique game such as LoL.

1. Of course there are ~60 heroes that are not in the game yet and you've got absolutely no clue whether all of them will make it or not. You've also got no idea if new heroes will make it into the beta and you shouldn't assume that none will. Also, OF COURSE there will be new, original heroes in Dota 2, give them some time to get that far. The existing heroes are more important than creating entirely new ones at this point.

2. Again, new and old items is another attempt by S2 to be exactly like DotA but different at the same time. There are not any new items in Dota 2 yet (every Dota 1 item is in the game) and you have no idea when IceFrog/Valve will be adding new ones so that point is moot. Not to mention there is already a ton of stuff to choose from. I happen to like the shop system in Dota 2 a lot, I can quickly and easily find and buy what I need.

3. I read something about Valve considering this option but that was a while back and cannot be sure about it one way or the other. Something about a similar system to TF2.

4. Typical Dota 2 games last anywhere from 25-45ish minutes, but some can go over 60 minutes. In older versions of Dota it seemed as if every game was 50+ minutes but that is no longer the case.

5. Again I've hear rumors about there possibly being other maps than the standard 5v5 map.

Finally, the matchmaking system finds game very quickly especially since the beta has expanded. If it takes a while you may be in the leaver pool.

Your points are too heavily based on your opinion for them to carry any weight.
Edited by Zulli85 - 12/19/11 at 6:54pm
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post #878 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zulli85 View Post

First and foremost I must state that HoN was created in an attempt to create a standalone DotA game that is trying to be the same as Dota but different at the same time. The S2 developers want it to be so similar that they have been ripping Dota changelogs since the games creation and that will probably never change. Yet they want it to be different so they mix and match some Dota 1 heroes and abilities, while adding entirely new heroes and items at the same time. It doesn't work for me. Pick one. Either create a standalone Dota clone (which fails without IceFrog at the helm) or create an entirely unique game such as LoL.

I think it works fine. Why does it have to be an exact clone or something totally different?
Quote:
1. Of course there are ~60 heroes that are not in the game yet and you've got absolutely no clue whether all of them will make it or not. You've also got no idea if new heroes will make it into the beta and you shouldn't assume that none will. Also, OF COURSE there will be new, original heroes in Dota 2, give them some time to get that far. The existing heroes are more important than creating entirely new ones at this point.

I believe I already mentioned everything you've already mentioned. And you're right, I have no clue. All I know is that it's going to be hell getting invoker to work. really, I don't get your point... I've already admitted that DotA 2 is still in beta. I'm just saying that HoN had both old and new heroes during beta. You think they would want to showcase something new and exciting, something that can utilize the new engine...
Quote:
2. Again, new and old items is another attempt by S2 to be exactly like DotA but different at the same time. There are not any new items in Dota 2 yet (every Dota 1 item is in the game) and you have no idea when IceFrog/Valve will be adding new ones so that point is moot. Not to mention there is already a ton of stuff to choose from. I happen to like the shop system in Dota 2 a lot, I can quickly and easily find and buy what I need.

Just a difference of opinion I guess. And again, for clarification: I know DotA 2 is in beta.
Quote:
Finally, the matchmaking system finds game very quickly especially since the beta has expanded. If it takes a while you may be in the leaver pool.
Your points are too heavily based on your opinion for them to carry any weight.
[/QUOTE]

Just a difference of opinion I guess. And again, for clarification: I know DotA 2 is in beta. Everything you're saying is you're opinion as well...Also I've only played about 6 games and haven't left one. It's noth that im in the leaver pool. Probably just not enough palyers.
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post #879 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

1. There are more heroes. I realize there are 104 dota heroes, with about 60 yet to be ported. I have a feeling some of those heroes (ie: invoker) may not get ported at all. Invoker is a nightmare for the developers. But, all these heroes are old, and will not offer anything new over the old DotA. This is supposed to be DotA 2. HoN had several new heroes created in beta to go along with the ports.
Well the thing about DotA is they don't make new heroes every patch or week, IceFrog always wanna balance the game (then came Rubik) I don't think Invoker is gonna be a nightmare for the developers, but it's gonna be a nightmare for people with old computers. DotA 2 doesn't mean you should add new heroes, it's just a different game (independent), using a different engine instead of the old-age WC3 crappy one. Think about it, adding new heroes every patch gonna change the top ban/pick in -cm mode, oens gonna be hot (Lycan, AM) and ones gonna be forgotten (Drow, Medusa)
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

2.Itemization is more refined, and there are more items to chose from. DotA 2 will not be adding new items for a long time... Probably not until beta is over. Unless they already have and I'm not aware? Also, I prefer the way the shops are set up in HoN compared to DotA 2.

DotA has a lot of items, and as I said above, balancing is always IceFrog's concern. He would have make a lot of items since DotA but Blizzard never contributed anything to his project (beside the game itself) I guess it's personal preference, but IceFrog needs to change the heroes, so it would be "ALL STARS" just like the name of the game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

3 Hero skins. These are just a fun part of the game that I'm not sure DotA 2 will implement or not... Hopefully... it makes the game more interesting, and aesthetically pleasing. It wouldn't be a big deal if they didn't though.

I like the basic models, plus they gonna change the models soon (IceFrog's survey), plus skins don't mean you're good at the game.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

4.HoN is faster paced. The game, naturally has the potential to go on for a long time, but DotA 2 seems to plod along at a slower pace than HoN. Could just be me...

I have to agree with this, yes, HoN is a faster paced game, because every hero has it's own "killer combo" and ganks are more essential.
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

5. 3v3. I love 3v3, and it is incredibly fast paced, exciting, and dynamic. DotA 2 has nothing like this so far, but they should definitely create a 3v3 map. The 3v3 HoN map is very fun, and well thought out - much more successful than the other 2 maps they made.

No comment on this...3v3 map sounds really fun though.

6.73 is coming this Saturday, gonna be 2-3 new heroes, so it's gonna be 107 in total.
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post #880 of 17107
Quote:
Originally Posted by grassh0ppa View Post

I think it works fine. Why does it have to be an exact clone or something totally different?
Quote:
1. Of course there are ~60 heroes that are not in the game yet and you've got absolutely no clue whether all of them will make it or not. You've also got no idea if new heroes will make it into the beta and you shouldn't assume that none will. Also, OF COURSE there will be new, original heroes in Dota 2, give them some time to get that far. The existing heroes are more important than creating entirely new ones at this point.
I believe I already mentioned everything you've already mentioned. And you're right, I have no clue. All I know is that it's going to be hell getting invoker to work. really, I don't get your point... I've already admitted that DotA 2 is still in beta. I'm just saying that HoN had both old and new heroes during beta. You think they would want to showcase something new and exciting, something that can utilize the new engine...
Quote:
2. Again, new and old items is another attempt by S2 to be exactly like DotA but different at the same time. There are not any new items in Dota 2 yet (every Dota 1 item is in the game) and you have no idea when IceFrog/Valve will be adding new ones so that point is moot. Not to mention there is already a ton of stuff to choose from. I happen to like the shop system in Dota 2 a lot, I can quickly and easily find and buy what I need.
Just a difference of opinion I guess. And again, for clarification: I know DotA 2 is in beta.
Quote:
Finally, the matchmaking system finds game very quickly especially since the beta has expanded. If it takes a while you may be in the leaver pool.
Your points are too heavily based on your opinion for them to carry any weight.


There is no substance in your reply because you simply repeated yourself over and over saying "I guess its a difference of opinion" and "I know its in beta."

I don't like how HoN is trying to be exactly like Dota yet different at the same time, its got an identity crisis if you ask me. If you want to play a Dota clone just play Dota 1 or 2. It doesn't deliver anything new that makes it worthwhile to switch.

Pretty sure nearly every hero shows off the engine, its not like they are reusing any of the animations from Dota 1.

Theres like anywhere from 15-20 thousand people online at any given time, you're probably too impatient to wait 20 seconds to find a game.
Edited by Zulli85 - 12/19/11 at 7:51pm
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