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[Official] DotA 2 Information and Discussion Thread. - Page 884

post #8831 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Toxsick View Post

edit ; Qaus/Exort , cant live without euls scepter, i feel invoker needs it.

Well, if you want to be sure to hit your Chaos Meteor, with 1 point of wex, you can have Cold Snap and Tornado buffered in the spell slots - throw a tornado, then a Cold snap and quickly invoke a meteor while you keep hammering the enemy hero, who's under the effects of Cold Snap. That should be enough in most instances, since it's quick and hard to defend against.
I really never go only two of the three - I always have a "backup" point in wex, just to be sure in the mid-game. As for early game though - not really any point in going anything but quas/exort - especially if you're the midlane.
    
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post #8832 of 17117
Q/E Orb also lets you pick your starting items differently. I like the E starting builds better than Q.
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post #8833 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timeofdoom View Post

I can never quite understand people going Exort Invoker from the get-go. The extra damage from the E-orbs is nice and all, but the Exort spells are pretty easy to dodge.
I pretty much always go quas-> invoke (Cold Snap, good against early agressive mids, like a classic pudge vs invoker) -> exort (Forge Spirit, can be used for farming/harass, while picking up runes (I always go bottle -> Brown boots -> Midas -> PhaseB -> Force staff ->drums ->Necronomicon (invoker is OP push))) and go on with more quas/exort/invoke untill the TF's start happening, and then I'll pick up a Wex for Blast and potentially a Chaos Meteor in the mix.
Methodic, but it Works like 80% of all games - if we lose it's certainly not because I lost mid (unless I'm dealing with a Puck or OD - annoying!).

As you said, Exort is taken at level 1 for increased damage. Players taking Exort first are looking less at the spell they get first and more at the CS they will gain from having +11 damage (2 INT, 9 Exort damage). If Invoker starts with a different orb he will only have 38 base damage. His attack animation/projectile is not stellar like a hero such as Sniper, and last-hitting will be a challenge. Many players aren't willing to sacrifice the decreased lane control from having that much less attack damage and will wait until level 3 to take Quas because mid levels come fairly quickly and they may be confident that the enemy mid will not show the level of aggression that demands Cold Snap response until then.

A side point; you might consider taking one level of Wex in your first 5-7 levels. Going back to the point of enemy mid aggression, Ghost Walk is likely your best ticket out of a sticky situation, especially when conventional mids hit 6 and get their playmaking spells. You also gain early access to alternative disables/interrupts (Blast, Tornado, EMP) if you know that Cold Snap is currently on cooldown.
Edited by JoeWalsh - 3/6/14 at 10:23am
post #8834 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timeofdoom View Post

Well, if you want to be sure to hit your Chaos Meteor, with 1 point of wex, you can have Cold Snap and Tornado buffered in the spell slots - throw a tornado, then a Cold snap and quickly invoke a meteor while you keep hammering the enemy hero, who's under the effects of Cold Snap. That should be enough in most instances, since it's quick and hard to defend against.
I really never go only two of the three - I always have a "backup" point in wex, just to be sure in the mid-game. As for early game though - not really any point in going anything but quas/exort - especially if you're the midlane.
Yes, thats true, tornado is not worth throwing out under level 2-3. for the metoer combo. x2 in wex is decent enough to do the combo i feel.
i always get one point in wex early , its pretty simple, you coldsnap , suntrike and push him in. its kinda a stun every hit.

coldsnap->suntrike->defeaning blast, seems to help alot. but it all depends, sometimes i go 4-1-4 or i go full exort with some qaus/wex.
for the euls combo that is.

but ofcourse the fun really starts when you have alot of levels, Agha's,Refresher, you have many ways to go for the combos.
Edited by Toxsick - 3/6/14 at 10:28am
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post #8835 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Timeofdoom View Post

I can never quite understand people going Exort Invoker from the get-go. The extra damage from the E-orbs is nice and all, but the Exort spells are pretty easy to dodge.
I pretty much always go quas-> invoke (Cold Snap, good against early agressive mids, like a classic pudge vs invoker) -> exort (Forge Spirit, can be used for farming/harass, while picking up runes (I always go bottle -> Brown boots -> Midas -> PhaseB -> Force staff ->drums ->Necronomicon (invoker is OP push))) and go on with more quas/exort/invoke untill the TF's start happening, and then I'll pick up a Wex for Blast and potentially a Chaos Meteor in the mix.
Methodic, but it Works like 80% of all games - if we lose it's certainly not because I lost mid (unless I'm dealing with a Puck or OD - annoying!).

If you have a teammate with a lockdown like net from naga or any reliable stun, it's pretty much the way to go as sunstrike can help significantly in every team fight.
post #8836 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeWalsh View Post

A side point; you might consider taking one level of Wex in your first 5-7 levels. Going back to the point of enemy mid aggression, Ghost Walk is likely your best ticket out of a sticky situation, especially when conventional mids hit 6 and gain their playmaking spells. You also gain early access to alternative disables/interrupts (Blast, Tornado, EMP) if you know that Cold Snap is currently on cooldown.

Very true, but as for most games, I start leaving mid lane at about lvl5 to gank bot or top - while I leave my 2/2 forge spirit to apply some pressure on the lane and get last hits.
And you might ask how I can do that this early - but that would be because it's the way I had been playing the most of the game already - in most cases the enemy midlane doesn't really consider me going ganking, most tend to just be content with staying mid and farm, while I go top/bot (usually I go where our carry is), because they're probably thinking I'm going for another rune (which I do tend to pick up on the way.
Example: my last game started off pretty good with me picking up a invis rune earlier for my bottle, I hit lvl 5 (picked up another quas) later in mid, resummoned my spirit, then ran down to bot rune, where I found a haste rune. I procc'd the haste rune, used the invis and went down to clean up bot (which, in most cases, let's you hit lvl 6 for another exort).
Bam! Pressure gone in bot, while mid haven't really been pressed that much because my 2/2 is still there (they last 30 secs at 2 quas, plenty of time) to lasthit or drag creeps off the tower. Sometimes it's luck with runes, sometimes it's just having predictable or lazy/greedy opponents (who don't buy wards)...

Of course above scenario is if I'm actually hitting the levels when I want to and if their mid haven't been getting me very early.
While I do agree with the usuability of a point of wex, it just doesn't really pay off untill you start seeing your team or the enemy team revving up for a TF, since, by then, you can do significant amounts of damage with the early exort or let your team pull out of a bad spot with a strong quas ice wall.
    
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post #8837 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by TFL Replica View Post

4v5 is winnable. That said, I wish Dota 2 would add a concede option for certain situations.

Why can't you dodge in hero select? :/
post #8838 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by FranBunnyFFXII View Post


Why can't you dodge in hero select? :/

 

It used to be allowed, but Valve decided to change it so that dodgers get an abandon (partly due to the huge number of complaints regarding dodgers). Have you tried Captain's Mode yet?

post #8839 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by TFL Replica View Post

It used to be allowed, but Valve decided to change it so that dodgers get an abandon (partly due to the huge number of complaints regarding dodgers). Have you tried Captain's Mode yet?

Nah Im just soloing in standard match making.

I'm just trying to adapt my mechanics from LoL to DoTA2.
post #8840 of 17117
Quote:
Originally Posted by FranBunnyFFXII View Post


Nah Im just soloing in standard match making.

I'm just trying to adapt my mechanics from LoL to DoTA2.

 

Just out of curiosity, what made you ditch LoL?

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