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AMD FX 8150 all the good ! - Page 41  

post #401 of 513
Quote:
Originally Posted by gooface View Post
I said this in another forum:

Quote:
the 1600/1333mhz ram isnt bottlenecking the BD, it would have to max out the bandwidth to do that. heck the LGA1366 cpus ran fine with dual channel they didnt need the triple channel, especially in gaming. being a experienced AMD overclocker, AMD CPU's dont care about RAM speed, they never have, they probably never will, they are all about latency, the lower the latency the better with AMD, and Intel has always been the faster RAM speed, and latency never has really effected them.
was I wrong in saying this? because I am talking to someone that said this in reply to that:



someone help me out! he is telling me that BD didnt perform because they didnt test it out with 1866mhz ram like its rated for.

I asked him for a source, and he has never given me one backing up his claim.

tbh Faster ram might give it 1-3% more fps if that. he doesnt understand that and he thinks its affecting the scores with BD.
You're right and wrong all at the same time. AMD and Intel both benefit greatly from more memory frequency and tighter timings. Well ever since Intel got AMD inside (integrated memory controller).
You are correct that AMD's do benefit greatly from tighter timings. However, since the introduction of the i CPUs' for intel, they also benefit greatly from tighter timings. For instance, 1066 CAS 5, will be noticeably faster than 1600 CAS9. This applies to both intel and AMD.
Your statement of "Intel has always been the faster RAM speed, and latency never has really effected them" is outdated. That applies to LGA 775 and before.

As for timings affecting results, I can say that fine tuning my memory frequency and timings on my C2 AM3 increased my 3Dm06 score by almost 2500 points. Approximately a 14.5% increase in performance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by PvtHudson View Post
...

What part of my post do you not understand?

OP is using this 100% COMPLETELY NEGATIVE REVIEW OF BULLDOZER THAT FAILS EVERY SINGLE BENCHMARK EXCEPT FOR ONE OF THEM as part of his organized propaganda campaign stating that this processor is a good one.

I'm not cherry picking the review or anything for that matter because the OP HIMSELF PICKED IT AND POSTED IT!

All I did was simply took the REST OF THE RESULTS in the review and pasted them as well.

This is his original post:


And the reason why the discrepancies are so large is because Tweaktown are using 3 6970s in Trifire to completely eliminate any GPU bottlenecks possible to see the actual CPU performance when it comes to gaming.

As for the whole retarded "lawl Asus board sux lawl" debacle here is a bench using an MSI board:


I cannot believe how low people are stooping to defend it.

As for the whole "lawl BIOS not optimized for Bulldozer." You'd have to be a complete fool to think these reviews were done in a single day. The reviewers had plenty of time to test the CPU out. They had the CPU and the motherboard for weeks. Do you really think AMD or Intel supply reviewers faulty CPUs and non-working motherboards? How does that make any sense whatsoever? You really think the reviewers get the CPU and motherboard the day they start being sold in stores? Do motherboard manufacturers not have BIOS ready and prepared???

As for the whole "lawl quads sucked when they first came out so it's ok that 8 cores suck". How come the 6 cores didn't suck?

Neither is the dual core > quad core statement true. The only reason dual cores performed better than quads at gaming was because dual cores were already clocked at 3.0+ ghz and most applications and games at that time were single threaded. When quads came out they were at a lowly 2.0 ghz. Once people started overclocking them and faster quads were released, the quads would get the same if not better performance in those applications.

Look at the 6 cores. At single threaded applications they perform, at the very worst, the same as quads. The same thing applies here. It's not like 6 cores sucked hard when they came out.

Bulldozer, on the other hand, is SLOWER in these applications despite being clocked higher. It performs worse than my 3 year old CPU in single threaded applications. When you release something that is slower than old obsolete technology, that is a problem. Bulldozer only does decently in extremely highly threaded applications (which is why it's pretty much a server CPU, not a consumer one) and even then the 2600k still beats it most of the time with it's 4 virtual cores against 8 real cores.

That is the issue with Bulldozer.

It's single threaded performance is slower than 2-gen old hardware while it's multi-threaded performance is barely a step above Thuban while costing the same amount as Sandy Bridge.

There is 0 reason to get a Bulldozer when a Sandy Bridge rig will cost the same amount of money and deliver higher performance.
Look I really don't give a crap, I've read the same reviews that you did. I was merely pointing out that you always bring this crappy Civilization BM into it --where BD did the worst. The reason why it's stupid is because they're basing it off of gameplay. Which is ridiculous because the test for each run is NOT going to be IDENTICAL. For a benchmark to be called as such, it has to be the exact same every time. That's why the BF3 beta BM wasn't a good one either.

I understand what you're trying to say with the single threaded performance. However, mutlicore CPUs' have been out for quite a long time. It's time for software dev's to step up. Although, I did read through some other stuff on the net, specifically, about the scheduler in win7. It does work pretty badly with BD, no doubt about it. As a matter of fact, it could also be the reason that BD is so power hungry. Instead of the scheduler sending it to a couple of cores that could easily do the work, it sends it out across the modules. So the CPU is utilized in an extremely inefficient manner, hogging power, and adding cycles, hence slowing it down.

As I mentioned earlier, I think it's still too early to tell. I'll probably get one though. I want to mess around with it for kicks and giggles.
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post #402 of 513
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackOmega View Post
It's time for software dev's to step up.
I'm a software developer. A modest one ok, but I'm tired of this argument. It's not always easy or even feasible to scale performance by "multithreading"
You have to realise that poor IPC/single threaded performance also ballasts multithreaded scenarios. but even if you have great threaded performance equipment, don't go blaming software for not taking advantage of 8743985634 cores. It does not work like that
Edited by dazz. - 10/15/11 at 8:27pm
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post #403 of 513
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazz. View Post
I'm a software developer. A modest one ok, but I'm tired of this argument. It's not always easy or even feasible to scale performance by "multithreading"
You have to realise that poor IPC/single threaded performance also ballasts multithreaded scenarios. but even if you have great threaded performance equipment, don't go blaming software for not taking advantage of 8743985634 cores. It does not work like that
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post #404 of 513
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazz. View Post
I'm a software developer. A modest one ok, but I'm tired of this argument. It's not always easy or even feasible to scale performance by "multithreading"
You have to realise that poor IPC/single threaded performance also ballasts multithreaded scenarios. but even if you have great threaded performance equipment, don't go blaming software for not taking advantage of 8743985634 cores. It does not work like that
I also agree. According to the logic of people supporting bulldozer, we are suppose to ignore performance in current day software and wait a couple of years for software to improve. I'm sure most people will agree that when the core i7-980x was released, it was ahead of its time, but it still performed fantastic in current day software that happened to be single-threaded and multi-threaded.
post #405 of 513
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazz. View Post
I'm a software developer. A modest one ok, but I'm tired of this argument. It's not always easy or even feasible to scale performance by "multithreading"
You have to realise that poor IPC/single threaded performance also ballasts multithreaded scenarios. but even if you have great threaded performance equipment, don't go blaming software for not taking advantage of 8743985634 cores. It does not work like that
Yupp


Not all code can be parallelized
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post #406 of 513
removed
Edited by julabask - 10/16/11 at 2:42am
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post #407 of 513
Thread Starter 
AMD Expects Windows 8 to Boost Performance of AMD FX Chips:

http://www.xbitlabs.com/news/cpu/dis..._FX_Chips.html
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post #408 of 513
Quote:
Originally Posted by dazz. View Post
I'm a software developer. A modest one ok, but I'm tired of this argument. It's not always easy or even feasible to scale performance by "multithreading"
You have to realise that poor IPC/single threaded performance also ballasts multithreaded scenarios. but even if you have great threaded performance equipment, don't go blaming software for not taking advantage of 8743985634 cores. It does not work like that

Its funny 15 years ago software developers were practically begging hardware makers to keep up. Now the tides have turned and instead of stepping up you are whining? Really?

It is time for software developers to step up. Especially in the gaming field, which most have. This isnt 1999. Everyone that owns a computer owns a dual core or better. Heck my parents who are almost 70 have a quad core i7. This is not a hard concept to understand that almost everyone runs multiple core computers now. So it seems only logical that software developers should make almost every program multithreaded so that they run more efficiently on these multiple cores.
 
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post #409 of 513
multithreading is the future, this chip may not perform to everyones taste. i think amd did a huge step forward thinking outside the box on this one....
I think they are on to something,where they did show up to compete they actually did very well.get the other in tow and the chip will be an enthuist dream. the tweaks and such are just down the road and the architecture will only improve as it ages, and GBF process get's improved.
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post #410 of 513
As a computer scientist at UMass parallel computing is still a very heavily researched topic and while limitations are believed, many laws that state these limitations like Amdahl's law and Gustafson's law are theories, we can't say programming wise we have hit these limitations yet. For going from 4 to 8 cores, their are still many ways that these limits can be improved upon with many programming methods. More importantly to say its not the software developers fault because of parallelism, is just ridiculous. To me it feels like a tough, but temporary wall, this was said many times over, when people said don't get amd athlon x2's go with amd fx you get not benefit with dual core, its a waste of money. Then I heard, Don't go quad core 45nm, dual cores overclock better and most games don't support quad core yet, (crysis 1 era). I have heard every time we move to more cores we hit limitations, the slow down usually is not the hardware but the time it takes new software to come out and support the hardware. AMD might be quite ahead of themselves, but intel plans very shortly to release 10 core processors for their servers and 8 core extreme edition i7 sandy bridges and as a software developer, to think that software will not be developed for 8-cores successfully, well I think you have a higher chance of falling behind then for the 8-cores to be unsuccessful in our short future, as history does repeat. More so their has already been successful 8 core apps programmed in linux for these processors and they show much more convincing results comparing to top intel 2600k processors then in all most popular used apps. In my belief I do believe amd am3+ cpu owners will see an increase in their processors eventually, I do also believe they will not have an 8 core that runs 800% faster then a single core like how our quad cores run practically 400% then a single core, because I don't think the memory on the cpus are perfected and I feel their is limitations by the socket compared to future 8 core cpu's, but I feel this is minimal. I think the real thing that will happen is by the time people see 8 core applications come out, it will be like the x2's their will be a very short amount of time till it gets replaced by a much superior intel 8 core, but if you remember x2's had almost a year where they were ahead of intel's and that was because eventually before intel went multicore we did create good dual core software for amd. So who knows wait a bit you might be surprised.
Edited by julabask - 10/16/11 at 3:20am
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