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Plasma or LCD for 3D TV – recommendations require. - Page 3

post #21 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by airbozo View Post
The headaches are not just from the glasses and eye strain. It also does not go away with use but it does _seem_ to feel better once your eyes get accustomed to the shutter glasses effect.
Hi,
Have you a 3d setup?
Yes i did say one of the main causes is eye strain and that can be fixed by using the glasses for small amounts of time and then play for longer each time, the same basics of weight training ect are very similar to the training that goes on in the eye muscles.
failing to play 3d for a week or so can have affects that are again akin to weight training, you do'nt pump them weights you will lose your power very quickly.

Once you have well trained eyes you can game for as long as you like with zero after affects, i used to sit and 3d game/3d film for between 5- 20 hours a day for many many months with a active set and at the start the sore eyes and headaches was terrible, i played it so much in the first 2 weeks that i nearly had a breakdown, i could'nt see, my eyes was sunken and i felt mentally ill!
A few weeks down the line and i could go for longer and longer without strain untill i could do it for as long as i pleased.
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post #22 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by OcSlave View Post
Hi,
Have you a 3d setup?
Yes i did say one of the main causes is eye strain and that can be fixed by using the glasses for small amounts of time and then play for longer each time, the same basics of weight training ect are very similar to the training that goes on in the eye muscles.
failing to play 3d for a week or so can have affects that are again akin to weight training, you do'nt pump them weights you will lose your power very quickly.

Once you have well trained eyes you can game for as long as you like with zero after affects, i used to sit and 3d game/3d film for between 5- 20 hours a day for many many months with a active set and at the start the sore eyes and headaches was terrible, i played it so much in the first 2 weeks that i nearly had a breakdown, i could'nt see, my eyes was sunken and i felt mentally ill!
A few weeks down the line and i could go for longer and longer without strain untill i could do it for as long as i pleased.
I still have a 3d setup on my Workstation, but haven't used it for years. No real need anymore. When I was using the 3D setup in my labs many years ago, it was several hours a day. Still got the headaches and dizziness. Not as bad as when I first started, but still enough to affect me so I would have to relax a bit after a 3D session. This was also part of the study. They wanted to see if it indeed was like your analogy to weight training. The results indicated that some people would experience less effects of VR sickness after continued use but that the effects never completely disappeared. We even had one person collapse in an epileptic seizure during the study which was odd since she did not have a history of seizures. I was not there when it happened so I don't know what part of the testing they were in.

Here is a study written by one of the people that used my lab for testing:
http://www.hitl.washington.edu/publications/r-96-3/

I am looking for the others.


EDIT: BTW: Don't get me wrong, I love some of the 3D applications and would put up with the effects for a little while. I have yet to see a 3D movie that impressed me though. One of my favorite applications is written by a friend of mine that owns this company:
http://www.digitalartforms.com/home.htm
When he first started out he was using his software to design golf courses...

EDIT2: To swing this back on topic, I am also in the market for a new TV. I will be going LCD since one of the connections will be to my HTPC. Yesterday I went to Fry's to look at some models and could not tell the difference between the HDtv running at 120hz and the one running at 240hz. Back in my labs I never had anything that would go up to 24ohz so I have no baseline. The image on the tv's looked identical so I could not understand why the 240hz model was $800 more (except for that fancy chrome stand and bezel). Those of you that have 3Dtv's, can you notice it?
Edited by airbozo - 10/27/11 at 8:49am
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post #23 of 28
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mygaffer View Post
I'm curious, why do you want a 3d TV? Are you going to watch 3d movies or television? Or just for 3d gaming?
Only movies - my HTPC build not for games....
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post #24 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by trulsrohk View Post
In theory this would be helpful, but in practice....

TV's stock calibrations are often far from optimal, best buy showrooms are nothing like the lighting of your home, and best buy sales people generally aren't what you would call experts
Still, IMO, with 3D (not 2D quality image w/c I kept reading that showroom models in stores aren't properly setup for individual's household preferences) it's still a good idea.

Check for Moire effects, flickering (if you're sensitive to it), tilting, dimming, ABL in 3D, Horizontal Bands, etc.

So no, I don't think what you said really applies to 3DTV testing worth doing.

Again, not talking about those calibration thingy.. I want the OP to test out the other factors with 3DTVs.
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post #25 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsm106 View Post
You must be from the moon.

Btw, you shouldn't be using plasmas for a desktop display.
I use my plasma for my desktop display. what makes you think you shouldn't use them for a PC. Mine fantastic for games. In all honesty the best thing I have ever used the plasma ofr is gaming. Blue rays look great and all on it, but PC games at 1080p look amazing. I thought the PS3 and Xbox looked good on it until I built my current PC.
If it's image retention your worried about, that's pretty much a thing of the past. I have had my current plasma for 3 years and have never seen so much as a hint of image retention. The plasma I had before it though, did have a problem with it, but it still works today and it's going on 7 years old. I've even let my son play games on it, and walked into the room after he had been playing split screen halo for hours by himself, without moving the guy on the bottom screen. There wasn't any ghost at all from what was showing on there. All he plays is the forge mode, so that bottom screen was never being controlled at all and just left in the same spot. I wouldn't be the least bit afraid of leaning my TV paused on something for hours on end.

On the other hand, I have owned 5 LCD tvs and all of them have broke, none of them currently work at all. I would recommend Plasma over LCD everytime, in almost every situation. The only way I would say LCD is if you were going to use it outdoors, or in some kind of sun room or something.
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post #26 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by bevo View Post
I use my plasma for my desktop display. what makes you think you shouldn't use them for a PC. Mine fantastic for games. In all honesty the best thing I have ever used the plasma ofr is gaming. Blue rays look great and all on it, but PC games at 1080p look amazing. I thought the PS3 and Xbox looked good on it until I built my current PC.
If it's image retention your worried about, that's pretty much a thing of the past. I have had my current plasma for 3 years and have never seen so much as a hint of image retention. The plasma I had before it though, did have a problem with it, but it still works today and it's going on 7 years old. I've even let my son play games on it, and walked into the room after he had been playing split screen halo for hours by himself, without moving the guy on the bottom screen. There wasn't any ghost at all from what was showing on there. All he plays is the forge mode, so that bottom screen was never being controlled at all and just left in the same spot. I wouldn't be the least bit afraid of leaning my TV paused on something for hours on end.

On the other hand, I have owned 5 LCD tvs and all of them have broke, none of them currently work at all. I would recommend Plasma over LCD everytime, in almost every situation. The only way I would say LCD is if you were going to use it outdoors, or in some kind of sun room or something.
Sweet.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=956866

Depending on how sensitive you are, Plasmas may suck so hard.

ABL, H. Line Bleed, Image Retention, Flicker, more eyestrain the LCD, electricity.

Image Retention is inherent but Burn In is almost impossible unless you're doing it on purpose.

The only way I'd recommend a plasma is when Samsung finally admits to ABL like panasonic sending out firmwares and admitting abl.

Don't get me wrong. LCDs are far from perfect with the usual uneven backlighting, blooming, and limited viewing angle, but IMO are less of a hassle.
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post #27 of 28
Quote:
Originally Posted by tubers View Post
Sweet.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=956866

Depending on how sensitive you are, Plasmas may suck so hard.

ABL, H. Line Bleed, Image Retention, Flicker, more eyestrain the LCD, electricity.

Image Retention is inherent but Burn In is almost impossible unless you're doing it on purpose.

The only way I'd recommend a plasma is when Samsung finally admits to ABL like panasonic sending out firmwares and admitting abl.

Don't get me wrong. LCDs are far from perfect with the usual uneven backlighting, blooming, and limited viewing angle, but IMO are less of a hassle.
I guess I don't play many games where the background is white, the main character is white, and everything else is white to have noticed this. Really though, i have never, ever noticed this. My screen saver is a picture of my kid in an all white shirt, and it is the brightest white I have ever seen, without losing detail with white like the lcds I have had do.

My kid was upstairs watching a cartoon one day on his LCD. I had used my calibration disk to set his TV up and had it looking what I thought was pretty decent. I noticed the sky was really bland with no clouds or anything going on so I started messing with the picture. I turned down the brightness almost all the way, and white clouds started popping up in the picture. That's what I call problem with whites. Any setting that was bright enough to use for viewing completly washed out the whites to where they didn't even show up.

I really don't know what to think about that link you posted. Anyone who has seen pictures on my plasma are amazed out how good they look.

I'm pretty big into audio and video and plasma is still my choice for everyday use. If I have a 50 inch plasma setting in front of me, or a 24 inch lcd pc monitor, I would much rather game on the 50 inch plasma and not have to set within a foot of the screen to be able to play. That to me, is going to lead to eye strain faster then anything else.

I know it's also really nice to set and stream football games on the big plasma instead of my laptop or a little pc monitor. With that said, if you are a photographer or something, a high end pc monitor would be better, but for gaming I really don't see how a plasma could be beat. Virtually no delay or motion blur, and ink blacks, with vibrant colors is hard to beat. I've had LCDs so bad that you couldn't even play games on them because of the input lag.
Edited by bevo - 11/8/11 at 6:06pm
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post #28 of 28
Hehe..

Unless you test for vs CRT I doubt about "no delay". (input lag)

my 42PW350 (42 incher) has 70-100ms input lag.. and if you can youtube.. you can see that most plasmas and bigger have more input lag.

Doesn't mean you don't notice it's not there. Read here on how plasma tech works and how it causes more strain.

While the technology results in a uniform image when the viewer is far enough from the panel, it causes visual discomfort at close distances. It's generally accepted that the human eye isn't capable of distinguishing flickering if the frequency is above about 85 Hz, but that's not exactly true. In fact, the eye is perfectly capable of doing so, but the brain can't "render" the images that fast. Consequently, an image at 85 Hz can cause eye fatigue without the viewer even being aware of the flickering.

Depends really.. Flicker IMO is still more eye straining that any normal LCDs out there.

First 3 days I had with our PDP I got dizzy and see glimmer and fliker with my eyes shut.

It's really really subjective.. I would suggest you to rather forget what I said and njoy your set.. than look for those things I mentioned

Once you see them it will fck ur viewing pleasure!

Like I say on other topics.. try the set out if you're in the US.. you can usually return and replace it anyway smile.gif

1st hand experience is better if you have ample time and money anyway smile.gif

BTW, easy on what you read on AVS forum. depending on your personality you may end up not purchasing anything LOL (since a lot of topics carefully point out the pros and cons of each display tech).
Edited by tubers - 11/12/11 at 7:08pm
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