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[Official] Crucial SSD Owners Club - Page 91

post #901 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

All M4s have shown lower access times with the new firmware. And the over all performance drop affects the various sized drives as well, but that was not caused by the new firmware. That was an issue before.

So what caused the overall performance drop?
post #902 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevindd992002 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

All M4s have shown lower access times with the new firmware. And the over all performance drop affects the various sized drives as well, but that was not caused by the new firmware. That was an issue before.

So what caused the overall performance drop?
Quote:
IDK what it is really...i think it may be some throttling thingy or something. :/

Ask Crucial.
post #903 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

Quote:
IDK what it is really...i think it may be some throttling thingy or something. :/
Ask Crucial.

When was this overall performance drop noticed? Is it a long time issue? I never heard it before, that's why. I only heard about the high access times caused by the new firmware.
post #904 of 1783
Here's the Crucial thread tracking that problem.

http://forum.crucial.com/t5/Solid-State-Drives-SSD/low-4K-64K-with-AS-SSD/td-p/84448

Something odd about this (if I understand it right) is that CDM showing queue depth of 32 is normal for everyone and Anvil which shows queue depth of 4 and 16 are normal - it's just the ridiculous 64 queue depth that seems to be the problem.

I think I have this problem as I only score ~280MB in RAID0 while I see others scoring 450-500+MB
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Just a 'puter
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post #905 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by error-id10t View Post

Here's the Crucial thread tracking that problem.
http://forum.crucial.com/t5/Solid-State-Drives-SSD/low-4K-64K-with-AS-SSD/td-p/84448
Something odd about this (if I understand it right) is that CDM showing queue depth of 32 is normal for everyone and Anvil which shows queue depth of 4 and 16 are normal - it's just the ridiculous 64 queue depth that seems to be the problem.
I think I have this problem as I only score ~280MB in RAID0 while I see others scoring 450-500+MB

So if I get it right, the 64K scores degrade through time with the M4?
post #906 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by FoxUlisse View Post

Thanks very very much. In your opinion I will not need any kit for plugging it in my removable 3.5 rack? Its connection is right.

If you get this drive then no as it comes with the 2.5" to 3.5" adapter bracket. The bracket is metal and does offset your SSD to the right side of the bay so your SATA/PWR cables line up with your other SATA/PWR cables on your HDD's if you have any for better cable management.

Of course you just have to unplug the cables to remove the rack with your drives mounted.

When I ordered my drive, NewEgg had drives with and without the bracket for the same price so I got the one with the bracket. If you get one without a bracket you could just use some velcro to mount the drive.
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post #907 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by kevindd992002 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by error-id10t View Post

Here's the Crucial thread tracking that problem.
http://forum.crucial.com/t5/Solid-State-Drives-SSD/low-4K-64K-with-AS-SSD/td-p/84448
Something odd about this (if I understand it right) is that CDM showing queue depth of 32 is normal for everyone and Anvil which shows queue depth of 4 and 16 are normal - it's just the ridiculous 64 queue depth that seems to be the problem.
I think I have this problem as I only score ~280MB in RAID0 while I see others scoring 450-500+MB

So if I get it right, the 64K scores degrade through time with the M4?
Not 64K - 64 QD. (Queue Depth - 64 things happening at once.)

If you're using your web browser plus a game, QD is going to hover around 1-2 on average. When loading a map it might spike up to 5-6, but most games load data serially rather than in parallel, so for a lot it would still be 1-2. If your Antivirus does something, it might go up to 3, and if Windows Update does something, perhaps as high as 4!

So yes, Desktop users rarely pass QD 4. When they do, it's not by much. Certain software can spike it much higher, but most desktop use returns to low queue depths extremely quickly.

Note: HDD performance degrades rapidly beyond QD2. Too much time spent seeking. Some drives manage high queue depths better (WD Blacks and Raptors, for example), making them more suitable for high QD environments like web servers.


It sounds like over time the Crucial M4's get more fragmented internally. Although the controller is more than fast enough that it won't impact 4k speeds, it does impact the 4K QD64 speeds, which reveal the theoretical performance of the controller. If the 4K reads don't land in the same NAND blocks as often, benchmarks go down. TRIM probably helps with this, and lack of TRIM (RAID) would hurt.
Edited by Kramy - 4/22/12 at 2:39pm
     
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Hitachi 2TB - HDS723020BLA64 Crucial M500 960GB - CT960M500SSD1 WD 4TB Black - WD4001FAEX WD 4TB Black - WD4001FAEX 
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post #908 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kramy View Post

Not 64K - 64 QD. (Queue Depth - 64 things happening at once.)
If you're using your web browser plus a game, QD is going to hover around 1-2 on average. When loading a map it might spike up to 5-6, but most games load data serially rather than in parallel, so for a lot it would still be 1-2. If your Antivirus does something, it might go up to 3, and if Windows Update does something, perhaps as high as 4!
So yes, Desktop users rarely pass QD 4. When they do, it's not by much. Certain software can spike it much higher, but most desktop use returns to low queue depths extremely quickly.
Note: HDD performance degrades rapidly beyond QD2. Too much time spent seeking. Some drives manage high queue depths better (WD Blacks and Raptors, for example), making them more suitable for high QD environments like web servers.
It sounds like over time the Crucial M4's get more fragmented internally. Although the controller is more than fast enough that it won't impact 4k speeds, it does impact the 4K QD64 speeds, which reveal the theoretical performance of the controller. If the 4K reads don't land in the same NAND blocks as often, benchmarks go down. TRIM probably helps with this, and lack of TRIM (RAID) would hurt.

If I understand your explanation correctly, it seems that for most tasks I will never reach a QD of 64? But if 4K-64 QD speeds are low, does it also mean that 4K-2 QD speeds would also be lower?
post #909 of 1783
Can I join this club? I own a Crucial M4 64 GB SSD, i'll pm the serial to the forum moderator if required.

Question: Do all the m4's need the firmware update? or only specific models?
post #910 of 1783
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsv883 View Post

Can I join this club? I own a Crucial M4 64 GB SSD, i'll pm the serial to the forum moderator if required.

Question: Do all the m4's need the firmware update? or only specific models?

You need at least firmware version 0309.
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