Overclock.net › Forums › Components › Hard Drives & Storage › SSD › Compressible vs Incompressible Data
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

Compressible vs Incompressible Data

post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 
I understand that some SSD's are better with Compressible Data and others Incompressible Data. I've been doing research and I'm having a hard time understanding the difference between the two. I've searched the forums but can't find a clear answer.

Could someone give me examples of each data type?

What about gaming load times? Would one SSD load games quicker than another, or are they all about the same?
post #2 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2jrock60;15386615 
I understand that some SSD's are better with Compressible Data and others Incompressible Data. I've been doing research and I'm having a hard time understanding the difference between the two. I've searched the forums but can't find a clear answer.

Could someone give me examples of each data type?

What about gaming load times? Would one SSD load games quicker than another, or are they all about the same?

I've been wondering the same thing. MushkinSean told me this
Quote:
Originally Posted by MushkinSean 
Those numbers are normal for a Sandforce drive. Typically incompressible sequential writes are in the 80 - 120Mb/s in Crystal and AS SSD
http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/storage/2010/06/25/sandforce-ssd-test/1

This was when i requested RMA because my drive has decreased in performance everywhere. I was somehow bottlenecking at 80MB/s on transfers to a RAID-0 array that is plenty fast.
SCTDF
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 2500K P8P67 PRO GTX 480 G.Skill 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Callisto Deluxe  WD Green 1TB Samsung H-50 w/ AP-14's push-pull 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 x64 Asus VH236H X2 Logitech G15 PC Power & Cooling 750W 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Antec 300 Illusion MODDED Logitech G700 Razer Tron  Creative SB Titanium 
  hide details  
Reply
SCTDF
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 2500K P8P67 PRO GTX 480 G.Skill 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Callisto Deluxe  WD Green 1TB Samsung H-50 w/ AP-14's push-pull 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 x64 Asus VH236H X2 Logitech G15 PC Power & Cooling 750W 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Antec 300 Illusion MODDED Logitech G700 Razer Tron  Creative SB Titanium 
  hide details  
Reply
post #3 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2jrock60;15386615 
I understand that some SSD's are better with Compressible Data and others Incompressible Data. I've been doing research and I'm having a hard time understanding the difference between the two. I've searched the forums but can't find a clear answer.

Could someone give me examples of each data type?

What about gaming load times? Would one SSD load games quicker than another, or are they all about the same?

Compressible data is OS & programs.

Incompressible is movies & music.

Virtually all data is compressed to a point.

Drives that do well with both types are the Crucial M4, Vertex 3, Force GT and Kingston HyperX.

Drives that don't do well with incompressible data are Agility 3, Solid 3 and Force 3.
Upstairs Rig
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k Asus Maximus VI Hero evga 1080 Ti with Hybrid mod Corsair Vengeance Pro 2133 mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 850 EVO 500gb WD Caviar Black Corsair h100i GTX Windows 8.1 64bit 
MonitorPowerCase
xb280hk EVGA Supernova 1000 G2 Corsair Carbide Air 540 
  hide details  
Reply
Upstairs Rig
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k Asus Maximus VI Hero evga 1080 Ti with Hybrid mod Corsair Vengeance Pro 2133 mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 850 EVO 500gb WD Caviar Black Corsair h100i GTX Windows 8.1 64bit 
MonitorPowerCase
xb280hk EVGA Supernova 1000 G2 Corsair Carbide Air 540 
  hide details  
Reply
post #4 of 12
Thread Starter 
What about game loading times, is one SSD faster than another?

Would a drive that's faster with incompressible data "load games faster", or one that's better with compressible data? Or is their no difference?
post #5 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2jrock60;15386952 
What about game loading times, is one SSD faster than another?

Would a drive that's faster with incompressible data "load games faster", or one that's better with compressible data? Or is their no difference?

A drive that can move incompressible data faster would be better with games. Textures etc have already been compressed as much as they could be for small size.

Keep in mind "better" doesn't mean a world of difference.
Upstairs Rig
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k Asus Maximus VI Hero evga 1080 Ti with Hybrid mod Corsair Vengeance Pro 2133 mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 850 EVO 500gb WD Caviar Black Corsair h100i GTX Windows 8.1 64bit 
MonitorPowerCase
xb280hk EVGA Supernova 1000 G2 Corsair Carbide Air 540 
  hide details  
Reply
Upstairs Rig
(11 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
4770k Asus Maximus VI Hero evga 1080 Ti with Hybrid mod Corsair Vengeance Pro 2133 mhz 
Hard DriveHard DriveCoolingOS
Samsung 850 EVO 500gb WD Caviar Black Corsair h100i GTX Windows 8.1 64bit 
MonitorPowerCase
xb280hk EVGA Supernova 1000 G2 Corsair Carbide Air 540 
  hide details  
Reply
post #6 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by mcg75;15387066 
A drive that can move incompressible data faster would be better with games. Textures etc have already been compressed as much as they could be for small size.

Keep in mind "better" doesn't mean a world of difference.

According to MushkinSean, it's normal for myself to have 80-120 MB/s writes of anything when i used to have over double that frown.gif
SCTDF
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 2500K P8P67 PRO GTX 480 G.Skill 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Callisto Deluxe  WD Green 1TB Samsung H-50 w/ AP-14's push-pull 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 x64 Asus VH236H X2 Logitech G15 PC Power & Cooling 750W 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Antec 300 Illusion MODDED Logitech G700 Razer Tron  Creative SB Titanium 
  hide details  
Reply
SCTDF
(16 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Intel Core i5 2500K P8P67 PRO GTX 480 G.Skill 8GB 
Hard DriveHard DriveOptical DriveCooling
Callisto Deluxe  WD Green 1TB Samsung H-50 w/ AP-14's push-pull 
OSMonitorKeyboardPower
Windows 7 x64 Asus VH236H X2 Logitech G15 PC Power & Cooling 750W 
CaseMouseMouse PadAudio
Antec 300 Illusion MODDED Logitech G700 Razer Tron  Creative SB Titanium 
  hide details  
Reply
post #7 of 12
Compression algorithms rely on the fact that most data contains redundancies of some form. The algorithm creates a statistical representation of the input data and then maps the data onto it in such a way as to allow more probable data or patterns to be represented in a shorter amount of space. It follows that the more random the input data, the less it will be able to be compressed. Purely random data is incompressible because randomness does not follow any probability distribution and therefore cannot be modelled. In a similar fashion, data that has already been compressed has had the redundancies / patterns removed and thus becomes incompressible. Encrypted data is also incompressible, as one of the hallmarks of a strong encryption algorithm is that the ciphertext is indistinguishable from random data (which is intuitively obvious otherwise encryption could easily be cracked by simple statistical analysis). Likewise, since movies and music are compressed formats already, they are incompressible.

This is a simplistic explanation, but it suffices to demostrate the difference between the two types of data. In practice, most operating system components will be compressible, as will most user data except for media.
Desktop
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-2600k @ 4.6Ghz 24/7 Asrock Fatal1ty Pro Gen3 POV 570 GTX 2.5GB, Inno3D 8800GT 16GB Gskill Ripjaw X 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
Crucial M4 512GB, 4xWDRE4 1TB RAID10 OCZ60GB Cache LG BH10 Bluray Writer Win7 x64 GPT Dell U2711 + Samsung 2232BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Corsair Vengeance K90 Corsair TX950W Fractal Design Define XL Cyborg R.A.T 7 
  hide details  
Reply
Desktop
(13 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
i7-2600k @ 4.6Ghz 24/7 Asrock Fatal1ty Pro Gen3 POV 570 GTX 2.5GB, Inno3D 8800GT 16GB Gskill Ripjaw X 
Hard DriveOptical DriveOSMonitor
Crucial M4 512GB, 4xWDRE4 1TB RAID10 OCZ60GB Cache LG BH10 Bluray Writer Win7 x64 GPT Dell U2711 + Samsung 2232BW 
KeyboardPowerCaseMouse
Corsair Vengeance K90 Corsair TX950W Fractal Design Define XL Cyborg R.A.T 7 
  hide details  
Reply
post #8 of 12
excellent explanation.

Compression is favorable as it can lead to lower write amplification, as compression is really the only way to get to under a write amplification of 1.

Some say SF drives do .6
there is testing at another forum that can tell you the compressibility of different types of data with Sandforce drives, and thus you can draw a line to the amount of write amplification.

IMO that is the only attraction to SF drives, the low WA. However there is endurance to spare with all NAND anyway.
post #9 of 12
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the input guys, but let me reword my question.

Would I notice any gaming load time differences between a Crucial M4 and a Corsair Force 3?
post #10 of 12
Buy a drive that uses synchronous NAND memory, and you don't have to worry about it. Incompressible data is only a problem for drives with asynchronous NAND, as I understand it.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: SSD
Overclock.net › Forums › Components › Hard Drives & Storage › SSD › Compressible vs Incompressible Data