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post #31 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post
It's quite possibly true, but if they had of supported the 2G they would now be having to support two less models, rather than just one. Don't you think it's pretty fair to receive one major release per year for two years after your purchase?

i would honestly rather have more support than less, who cares if they drop 2 phones at once, it is still a gain overall

That's the problem though, there's a lot of phones with bad or not-so-great skins and ROMs being put into the hands of the majority which are your average users. This overall gives Android less consistency as well as generates some negativity towards Android.

I think a good alternative could be something like a ROM approval process, kinda like they have for HC, with "Android Experience"

I don't think it would. It would let the hardware manufactures focus on doing what they do best, and that's making hardware not coding skins and ROMs. It means you'd have stock Android, faster updates, less bloat, better performance from the get-go, and it would mean any faults in Android will be much more noticeable and thus fixed quickly and the OS as a whole will be improved, and your average joe would be overall happier.

The thing that slows updates is the carriers. For an example, HTC has had a perfectly functional 2.3.X build for the thunderbolt since like June, and Verizon released it a couple months back, but instantly pulled it because some of their verizon bloat wasn't working right. If the iPhone wasn't such a massive revenue source, i could see something similar happening with iPhones. But since they are "the phone" to have, no carrier wants to break their relationship with the Apple.

Yeah, but Apple is only one company selling three phones. They're doing pretty well but I'm not sure if they could ever control more market share than multiple companies releasing quite a few new phones per year.

This is one of my pet peeves. No, this is not why android has a larger market share. Consumers don't buy three phones because there are 3 hardware manufacturers.

Example, A customer walks into the store, completely unbiased. Has a choice between iPhone, and the 1 Android phone that the store retails. Chance of buying android: 1n Chance of buying iOS 1n.

Say this happens 100 times, and 50 buy iphones, 50 buy Android. Android marketshare: 50% iOS: 50%

A customer walks into the store, completely unbiased. Has a choice between iPhone, and 10 different android manufacturers. Chance of buying android: 1n Chance of buying iOS 1n.

you could have 100000000 Android devices, and the consumer will still only be purchasing one, with the same chance of purchasing either. It doesn't matter how many there are.

Say this happens 100 times, and 50 buy iphones, 50 buy android. Android market share: 50% iOS: 50%

You could argue that since there are options when buying an Android phone, that this will lead to Android being more appealing to more people, that then that is why they have more marketshare, but that would just further prove my point, that more people choose android.


/minirant


Android and iOS will still need to remain competitive with each other and that should keep things moving in the right direction.

This is very true. Go WP7!!!!

No, I mean the marketplace or "third party app stores". It's more places to go to check for good apps rather than just one place that has everything.

At least there is an option. Google bans your app from the market? No biggie, just head over to somewhere else. Who cares if it requres an extra .05 seconds to open a second AppStore. It breads competition. In the end the consumer and developers win.

and in all honesty, unless you are banned from the Market, hardly any devs choose to go exclusively with anything other than the Market. Market comes installed on most every phone, and thus has the largest userbase. If you are a dev that makes any sort of decent app, you will be putting it on the market.


I've seen several pop up that weren't that obvious and were pretty bad.

They are pretty much always stupid stuff, like stuff you would know that is wrong.

The difference is, and the improvement I'm talking about is, you shouldn't be able to put a malicious app on the market. There has never been, and never will be, a malicious app on the App Store, because of their review process and guidelines.

If you stick within popular apps, and read reviews, you are very unlikely to get malware. Read permissions, don't be an idiot.

What apps would they be?

Most notably Airplay.
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post #32 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
answers in red, too lazy to type them out in a real paragraph....
Quote:
i would honestly rather have more support than less, who cares if they drop 2 phones at once, it is still a gain overall
The same is true of me, however I think publicity wise it's better to drop support for one at a time. Who knows, though.
Quote:
I think a good alternative could be something like a ROM approval process, kinda like they have for HC, with "Android Experience"
That would definitely be better.
Quote:
The thing that slows updates is the carriers. For an example, HTC has had a perfectly functional 2.3.X build for the thunderbolt since like June, and Verizon released it a couple months back, but instantly pulled it because some of their verizon bloat wasn't working right. If the iPhone wasn't such a massive revenue source, i could see something similar happening with iPhones. But since they are "the phone" to have, no carrier wants to break their relationship with the Apple.
Oh, I see. So it isn't for example TouchWiz that is preventing OS updates rather the carrier bloat? Eh, they should try and put a stop to that then.
Quote:
This is one of my pet peeves. No, this is not why android has a larger market share. Consumers don't buy three phones because there are 3 hardware manufacturers.

Example, A customer walks into the store, completely unbiased. Has a choice between iPhone, and the 1 Android phone that the store retails. Chance of buying android: 1n Chance of buying iOS 1n.

Say this happens 100 times, and 50 buy iphones, 50 buy Android. Android marketshare: 50% iOS: 50%

A customer walks into the store, completely unbiased. Has a choice between iPhone, and 10 different android manufacturers. Chance of buying android: 1n Chance of buying iOS 1n.

you could have 100000000 Android devices, and the consumer will still only be purchasing one, with the same chance of purchasing either. It doesn't matter how many there are.

Say this happens 100 times, and 50 buy iphones, 50 buy android. Android market share: 50% iOS: 50%

You could argue that since there are options when buying an Android phone, that this will lead to Android being more appealing to more people, that then that is why they have more marketshare, but that would just further prove my point, that more people choose android.
That's not what I'm saying. The argument I'm making is because there are so many different droids, each with their own features and design. There's just so much more variety whereas with Apple you need to like one of three iPhone's and only one of them is new and the most powerful out. You could go for the iPhone 4S, the 4 which looks the same, or the 3GS which still looks pretty much the same although it's plastic and not as elegant, continually decreasing in performance as you go down the line.
Quote:
At least there is an option. Google bans your app from the market? No biggie, just head over to somewhere else. Who cares if it requres an extra .05 seconds to open a second AppStore. It breads competition. In the end the consumer and developers win.

and in all honesty, unless you are banned from the Market, hardly any devs choose to go exclusively with anything other than the Market. Market comes installed on most every phone, and thus has the largest userbase. If you are a dev that makes any sort of decent app, you will be putting it on the market.
I'm just a fan of having one App Store, it's just one place to go and everything's there. I'm like that with pretty much everything though.
Quote:
They are pretty much always stupid stuff, like stuff you would know that is wrong.
Quote:
If you stick within popular apps, and read reviews, you are very unlikely to get malware. Read permissions, don't be an idiot.
Oh, I've seen plenty of those but I'm talking about real malware here. There's been a few that you don't know, that are a little more serious.

It's still more stuff you have to do. You can go on the App Store and buy anything and don't even have to think about any of that stuff.
Quote:
Most notably Airplay.
You think they ripped off AirVideo or something?
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post #33 of 42
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post #34 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
I did hear that Apple contacted the guy directly about his app but I don't really think Apple actually stole anything here. Wireless syncing isn't exactly an invention or an idea, and Mac users had been asking for it for a while. His app was rejected a fair while before iTunes Wi-Fi Sync was added. The icon, meh maybe, the "shape" in the middle does look the same, but ultimately the developers icon consisted of two separate icons already in iOS joined together. (Apple reserves the right to reject specific apps, for example apps that might mimic specific functionality on the phone such as a "phone app", and they also reject any apps that use private APIs, amongst other things, and this did use them.)

There's not really any way to know if Apple stole his source code or anything, but they're far more educated than he is so I'd doubt it'd be good enough or even offer any new idea's to them. I don't even think he claimed they did that.
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post #35 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peon View Post
One of the things that's great about iPhones is their long support lifecycles - each generation has gotten about 30 months of iOS upgrades. As a result, I'm not impressed by Google's new 18 month Android upgrade program, which is being billed as an improvement over the current situation.

What is the current situation? Is Google simply targeting a handful of bad handset manufacturers with the 18 month program, or is it standard practice to drop support for existing models as soon as next year's lineup is released? How long do handset manufacturers like HTC and Samsung typically provide updates for?

3 year contracts are the standard here, so an 18 month support lifecycle would render an Android phone obsolete by the time I was halfway through the contract, whereas an iPhone would continue to get updates until the final few months.

[Edit after reading the responses] You guys aren't doing a very good job of convincing me, a satisfied iPhone owner, that I would be better off with an Android phone instead of an iPhone 4S for my next phone. I have yet to see anybody give any reasons why Android phones are superior or what they offer that would be worth giving up Apple's end-to-end experience and ecosystem.

There's something wrong with you if you'd sign up for a 3 year contract.
That aside, Apple are liars.

Whoever said that the iPhone 4 can't run Siri deserves to be shot.
You could've given us a better excuse instead of just 'hardware limitations'.
What does the 4S have that the 4 doesn't have?
It's not the lack of GPS, certainly.
Neither is it the lack of a 3G radio.
Or a speaker from which Siri's voice emanates.
Or a mic which you use to give commands.
Or a screen.

So there you go. You'll have to pay a hefty sum to upgrade in order to enjoy your new functionality.

Number of people who will buy the 4S just for Siri: 9,000.
Number of people who will actually USE Siri because they need to: 9.















In a million, that is.

With Android, you have the Speaktoit Assistant.
Not only is it free and compatible with phones that run Android 1.6 and above; it's actually more useful and less rude than the atrocity called Siri.
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post #36 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by Volvo View Post
There's something wrong with you if you'd sign up for a 3 year contract.
That aside, Apple are liars.

Whoever said that the iPhone 4 can't run Siri deserves to be shot.
You could've given us a better excuse instead of just 'hardware limitations'.
What does the 4S have that the 4 doesn't have?
It's not the lack of GPS, certainly.
Neither is it the lack of a 3G radio.
Or a speaker from which Siri's voice emanates.
Or a mic which you use to give commands.
Or a screen.

So there you go. You'll have to pay a hefty sum to upgrade in order to enjoy your new functionality.

Number of people who will buy the 4S just for Siri: 9,000.
Number of people who will actually USE Siri because they need to: 9.



In a million, that is.

With Android, you have the Speaktoit Assistant.
Not only is it free and compatible with phones that run Android 1.6 and above; it's actually more useful and less rude than the atrocity called Siri.
I've said the iPhone 4 can't run Siri and I certainly don't deserve to be shot, nor should anyone. Yeah, yeah, I know it's a figure of speech but still.

Siri is a lot more powerful than anything offered by Android and Siri is only in beta, more services and languages are coming. Additionally, Siri is quite useful for some general tasks such as adding, removing and changing alarms, adding calendars, moving calendars, etc., adding reminders, making quick notes. And then you've got stuff like listening to and replying to text messages in the car, making use of Wolfram Alpha and Yelp which is great too, etc.
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post #37 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
I highly doubt that every one of the 40+ roms for the Epic 4G force close and crash (roms can't even force close....)
They are based on leaked kernels from samsung and it's the rom builders who are saying it.

Please continue to doubt what you have zero 1st hand knowledge about.
post #38 of 42
Apple had wireless syncing in the newton.

Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post
I did hear that Apple contacted the guy directly about his app but I don't really think Apple actually stole anything here. Wireless syncing isn't exactly an invention or an idea, and Mac users had been asking for it for a while. His app was rejected a fair while before iTunes Wi-Fi Sync was added. The icon, meh maybe, the "shape" in the middle does look the same, but ultimately the developers icon consisted of two separate icons already in iOS joined together. (Apple reserves the right to reject specific apps, for example apps that might mimic specific functionality on the phone such as a "phone app", and they also reject any apps that use private APIs, amongst other things, and this did use them.)

There's not really any way to know if Apple stole his source code or anything, but they're far more educated than he is so I'd doubt it'd be good enough or even offer any new idea's to them. I don't even think he claimed they did that.
post #39 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by steelbom View Post
I did hear that Apple contacted the guy directly about his app but I don't really think Apple actually stole anything here. Wireless syncing isn't exactly an invention or an idea, and Mac users had been asking for it for a while. His app was rejected a fair while before iTunes Wi-Fi Sync was added. The icon, meh maybe, the "shape" in the middle does look the same, but ultimately the developers icon consisted of two separate icons already in iOS joined together. (Apple reserves the right to reject specific apps, for example apps that might mimic specific functionality on the phone such as a "phone app", and they also reject any apps that use private APIs, amongst other things, and this did use them.)

There's not really any way to know if Apple stole his source code or anything, but they're far more educated than he is so I'd doubt it'd be good enough or even offer any new idea's to them. I don't even think he claimed they did that.
So the application is detrimental to the iOS platform when Mr. Hughes publishes it, but when apple integrates it into the OS, it is a benefit?
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post #40 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by reflex99 View Post
So the application is detrimental to the iOS platform when Mr. Hughes publishes it, but when apple integrates it into the OS, it is a benefit?
If you want to sell your apps in the app store, then you play by the rules.

The rule is only apple makes operating system level modifications.
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