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[HardOCP] Seasonic Platinum-1000W Review - Page 4

post #31 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Except you're arguing a detail which doesn't effect the build quality or electrical performance of a unit. You're concerned with something that doesn't matter.

If we really want to argue these things, then I could say the X-1000XP is better because the sleeving goes farther up the end of the connector compared to the HCP-1200, where the sleeving terminates over an inch away from the start of the connector.
Well, my point is more relavant than that now, isn't it?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
You have it backwards, on the HCP & X Platinum tests, the X-1000XP was running about 1*C cooler at 20% load, and 1*C higher at 100% load.
Sorry about that. Regardless, I can replace the 80mm fan with a faster one to make it work cooler (than replacing a 120mm).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Dual PCB or an extra filtering capacitor on the primary side does not make the build quality better. You don't understand PSU design or what a ZVT-Phase Shift is.

Both of these units are Full Bridge units, the only difference comes in on the primary side, not the secondary side. The secondary side is the more important factor here, as it is where you get your output from.
I do, it basically means AC power is converted to DC by a Buck converter; using Synchrous Recticifation. No need to belittle those that argue with you.

And yes, while what you're claming is correct (similar to HX1000) occasion, the unit is still better make. It's a miniscule difference, but the difference is there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Soldering is very important regarding build quality, because bad soldering means you can get either higher voltage losses or cracking solder over time, which leads to a part coming disconnected.

For that matter, 2 PCB's or more components in the equation can be seen as a down side; due to it meaning there's more parts which gives you a higher chance of something failing.
You're talking as if Delta's soldering is crap. Sorry but that's laughable. Again, yes, your point, while correct, doesn't make much sense considering we're talking about "Delta" here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
You don't like to be wrong and like to draw out these discussions.
No, I like to inform people that being Platinum doesn't make it better over Gold. And the two photos I compared to on the previous page, they show the quality difference. And it'd be silly to assume otherwise so.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
You said your self you're concerned with the fine details and that would make it worth it to your own criteria.
Yep, and the HCP does come out to be better.
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post #32 of 67
Anyway, JD, there are ppl who dont need 1200W or even 1000. Your beloved delta build doesnt come in smaller sizes.
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post #33 of 67
This thread was more interesting to read than the article.

It's like fighting with a brick wall.
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post #34 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
Well, my point is more relavant than that now, isn't it?
Neither is more relevant since neither effect build quality or performance.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
Sorry about that. Regardless, I can replace the 80mm fan with a faster one to make it work cooler (than replacing a 120mm).
Not really, since the 80mm fan inside the HCP-1200 is harder to remove than the 120mm fan in the Seasonic.
For that matter, what does replacing a fan have to do with quality? Since you can replace the fan in the Seasonic with an F408 from San Ace and push more air through the unit as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
I do, it basically means AC power is converted to DC by a Buck converter; using Synchrous Recticifation. No need to belittle those that argue with you.
No.... it doesn't. ZVT means Zero Voltage Transition. Both units use DC DC converters with Synchronous Rectification on the secondary side.

Both things you quote are designs used on the secondary side of SMPS designs, not the primary side where AC power is converted to DC power.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
You're talking as if Delta's soldering is crap. Sorry but that's laughable. Again, yes, your point, while correct, doesn't make much sense considering we're talking about "Delta" here.
You assume Delta always does well at everything, which isn't the case. For that matter, the soldering quality is still a measurable difference.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
No, I like to inform people that being Platinum doesn't make it better over Gold. And the two photos I compared to on the previous page, they show the quality difference. And it'd be silly to assume otherwise so.
They don't show any quality difference because the most you can really see is the general layout of the units and the soldering quality.
Like I said, more components = easier chance for failure.
And the soldering is about the same.

I also never said that being Platinum makes it better, it just means it's more efficient. Which is a measurable quality difference.
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post #35 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Not really, since the 80mm fan inside the HCP-1200 is harder to remove than the 120mm fan in the Seasonic.
For that matter, what does replacing a fan have to do with quality? Since you can replace the fan in the Seasonic with an F408 from San Ace and push more air through the unit as well.
I still prefer 80mm over 120/135/140.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
No.... it doesn't. ZVT means Zero Voltage Transition. Both units use DC DC converters with Synchronous Rectification on the secondary side.

Both things you quote are designs used on the secondary side of SMPS designs, not the primary side where AC power is converted to DC power.
That's right, AC is converted to DC on the primary side. Secondary uses DC-DC on these units, unlike older units that use a traditional double-shift design, which is why secondary matters on these units. But I still would prefer Delta's topology over SeaSonic's here.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
You assume Delta always does well at everything, which isn't the case. For that matter, the soldering quality is still a measurable difference.

They don't show any quality difference because the most you can really see is the general layout of the units and the soldering quality.
Like I said, more components = easier chance for failure.
And the soldering is about the same.
You're right, I find Delta to be a better OEM than SeaSonic. Maybe I shouldn't have done on this case (shouldn't have thought that way).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
I also never said that being Platinum makes it better, it just means it's more efficient. Which is a measurable quality difference.
Not much at all.
Edited by Johnny Doe - 11/6/11 at 12:27pm
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post #36 of 67
And what would you tell, if you have to compare those seasonics with Enermax EMR1350EWT or any of the platimax series ?
Of course the differance in power is obvious but what about performance and rail stability ?
    
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post #37 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
I still prefer 80mm over 120/135/140.
Your personal preference doesn't make one better than the other.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
That's right, AC is converted to DC on the primary side. Secondary uses DC-DC on these units, unlike older units that use a traditional double-shift design, which is why secondary matters on these units. But I still would prefer Delta's topology over SeaSonic's here.
Like I said, the secondary side is where they are the same.

Delta/Antec uses a ZVT Phase Shift design on the primary side,
Seasonic uses a LLC Resonant Converter on the primary side.

Secondary design is still a full bridge unit that uses DC DC modules & synchronous rectification.

At the end of the day, when it comes to voltage regulation, ripple suppression, transient response, transient loads; the Seasonic is better.

There's no reason to prefer what Delta did.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
You're right, I find Delta to be a better OEM than SeaSonic. Maybe I shouldn't have done on this case (shouldn't have thought that way).
It doesn't matter what you find, it matters what the two units show. Which for all intents and purposes; the quality is just about the same.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Doe View Post
Not at all.
Efficiency is a measureable difference between the two units which denotes quality.

It doesn't matter how much money efficiency saves you; a more efficient unit does save you some money, which does make it a difference, and a difference where the Seasonic is better.
At the end of the day, there is a price difference between the two units in regards to total cost, but that is not a quality difference.
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post #38 of 67
The Seasonic is $20 cheaper, fully modular, and has two years more warranty. Based on practicality it's the winner, to me.
post #39 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Your personal preference doesn't make one better than the other.
Sorry for that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Like I said, the secondary side is where they are the same.

Delta/Antec uses a ZVT Phase Shift design on the primary side,
Seasonic uses a LLC Resonant Converter on the primary side.

Secondary design is still a full bridge unit that uses DC DC modules & synchronous rectification.

At the end of the day, when it comes to voltage regulation, ripple suppression, transient response, transient loads; the Seasonic is better.

There's no reason to prefer what Delta did.

It doesn't matter what you find, it matters what the two units show. Which for all intents and purposes; the quality is just about the same.
Yes, I've been a bit too close-minded towards SeaSonic due to my preferation of Delta.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tator Tot View Post
Efficiency is a measureable difference between the two units which denotes quality.

It doesn't matter how much money efficiency saves you; a more efficient unit does save you some money, which does make it a difference, and a difference where the Seasonic is better.
At the end of the day, there is a price difference between the two units in regards to total cost, but that is not a quality difference.
It's a miniscule difference (a few dollars in years), which most manufactorers market their units for (efficiency instead of quality). However, yes, that's not the case here.

I'd choose the HCP myself, but the Platinum is considerable as well. However, with the HCP going for $20 more, it does happen to be a better choice. Well, at least for me.
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post #40 of 67
Wow and i remember paying 350-400$ for mine XD.
was it worth it, not really but I didnt know much back then
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