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post #31 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlells01 View Post
It's been years since I last had any real interaction with Linux (going back to the original Ubuntu days, circa '05), and at that time, it was an operating system full of promise; a "diamond in the rough" so to speak, full of potential, but lacking the polish to break out and become a viable alternative to the masses (emphasizing the general population here, folks...)

All this time later, and I'm left with the subjective view that, rather sadly, nothing substantive has changed. Yes, things have undoubtedly improved, but while we're now running the excellent Windows 7 & OS X Lion, the approach of the Linux community is to have 100 different varieties (if you think I'm exaggerating -- http://distrowatch.com/) available for every conceivable subset of tech-savvy fanboy.

At the end of the day (excluding maybe the LTS version of Ubuntu, which I've yet to try), it seems that running any flavor of Linux is akin to accepting what amounts to a Beta OS as your main system, and as such, it's destined to remain a very small subset of the consumer market (see below)...

Your thoughts?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jlells01 View Post
...and there we have, yet again, your tactic du jour when it comes to those who have issues with your beloved OS.

Back to reality - Until the Linux community can recruit their collective brain trust around one standardized distribution, I fully expect, as aforementioned, that absolutely nothing will change in the next six years...within the consumer marketplace, it'll still be a boutique OS, and never become a true alternative to the established players.
1) What does Windows give the end user as an OS that Linux doesn't. I'm going to set rules and guidelines as I'm sure you have no idea what an OS delivers.

Rules:
Code:
Don't include gaming or any specific type of software NOT bundled in the OS. 

Hardware support is something both operating systems have problems with but it's not the fault of 
Linux/MS it's the manufacturer so don't include that.

I don't want to hear about easy customization/ease of use either, there are tutorials out there for both 
operating systems that guide you through everything.  If you can't find them obviously you can't 
read, this point should be excluded too.
2) What problems did you encounter? List explicitly what was "subjective" because I could get very subjective without really staying jack. If you have nothing to say and your just using subjective because your dumb, please ignore this post because I don't want to hear from you again.

3) People like you ARE the reason why linux gets a bad rep. You try it, then you tell your friends or whoever the crap listens to you and they decide not to use it. Despite the fact that they might love it, they will continue to push money towards a company that charges them for crap they don't need.

So many people I know just browse the internet and play simple games, they don't even need windows. It would help drastically to get those people to use it, it would be very nice.

4) Linux, as an operating system, runs on more embedded devices than you could name. I would say more than you could (probably) name but I really doubt you could name anywhere close to enough. I have little faith.

Those are my points, as well as what I would like you to state that MS offers over Linux. Please, don't try and say I'm crippling the argument either because an OS is supposed to offer one thing and one thing only.
Edited by mushroomboy - 11/8/11 at 5:56pm
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post #32 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlells01 View Post
...and there we have, yet again, your tactic du jour when it comes to those who have issues with your beloved OS.

Back to reality - Until the Linux community can recruit their collective brain trust around one standardized distribution, I fully expect, as aforementioned, that absolutely nothing will change in the next six years...within the consumer marketplace, it'll still be a boutique OS, and never become a true alternative to the established players.
cute. LOL.

Have all the issues you want with linux, I know all the contributions I have given to it over the last fives years, either that is thru useful discussion, helping out its users, donating money to its cause, have been to suit my interest.

I'm sorry, you don't use the software for six years, then come here, complain about it, wanting it to get fixed to your standards of what an OS should be, but you don't want to do anything about it. sorry, you have absolutely no right what so ever to complain about it, you need to get back to reality friend, you are part of the problem that linux faces, a bunch of opinions, but no actual substance to contribute to it.


I'm done with this thread, I should've known better, as it struck me when i first read it that the OP was after flamebait and trolling, but I had to think of any one else that would fancy across this thread, needed to know the TRUE opinions of a REAL linux user.
Edited by Transhour - 11/8/11 at 5:58pm
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post #33 of 42
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mushroomboy View Post
Hardware support is something both operating systems have problems with but it's not the fault of Linux/MS it's the manufacturer so don't include that.
So now we've moved on from ad hominem...to an either/or fallacy.

I'll quote myself:

"Looking at what has been put forth, I'll say this: to the end-user, it simply doesn't matter why...it's that it (be it a software program, drivers, external device, etc.) doesn't work, regardless as to whether or not the fault is within the OS itself, or third-party vendors that don't offer Linux support.

It's fun to play with, but as a full-fledged primary consumer OS...maybe I'll check back again in another SIX years
."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Transhour View Post
I know all the contributions I have given to it over the last fives years
Then keep contributing to the cause you believe in, sir; hopefully, in another six years, it'll have arrived at the point where it'll be a great alternative OS for the general public.
Edited by jlells01 - 11/8/11 at 6:07pm
post #34 of 42
ibtl

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post #35 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlells01 View Post
So now we've moved on from ad hominem...to an either/or fallacy.

I'll quote myself:

"Looking at what has been put forth, I'll say this: to the end-user, it simply doesn't matter why...it's that it (be it a software program, drivers, external device, etc.) doesn't work, regardless as to whether or not the fault is within the OS itself, or third-party vendors that don't offer Linux support.

It's fun to play with, but as a full-fledged primary consumer OS...maybe I'll check back again in another SIX years
."



Then keep contributing to the cause you believe in, sir; hopefully, in another six years, it'll have arrived at the point where it'll be a great alternative OS for the general public.
That's like saying because you can't seem to make a proper rebuttal it's OCN's fault? I really hope you don't get into any technical field, because your going to have a real hard time with it.

Not to mention you have no idea what an OS does. You seem to believe that the operating system is supposed to be this end all experience tailored to do whatever you want it to do. You can't even do a logical comparison of Linux vs MS/OSX, the shipped AS IS systems without somehow bringing in 3rd party ideas. I hate to say this but... I'm calling ad hominem on you, if you can't figure that out it's probably for the better.
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post #36 of 42
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mushroomboy View Post
You can't even do a logical comparison of Linux vs MS/OSX
Again:

"Case in point though: Just last night, I was updating a GPS; within Windows and Mac (I tested both), it's a very easy task - just point-and-click.

Within Linux, it's absolutely impossible - can't be done, period (within terminal, an application, or anything else...except booting into one of those aforementioned OS's).

That's why Linux is a pain in the @ss for consumer usage; yes, there are alternatives to well-known software programs (document creation, video playback, etc.) that work great, but many things just don't function...period
."

You may not like it, but that's a proper comparison for the end-user that expects their stuff to work.
post #37 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlells01 View Post
Again:

"Case in point though: Just last night, I was updating a GPS; within Windows and Mac (I tested both), it's a very easy task - just point-and-click.

Within Linux, it's absolutely impossible - can't be done, period (within terminal, an application, or anything else...except booting into one of those aforementioned OS's).

That's why Linux is a pain in the @ss for consumer usage; yes, there are alternatives to well-known software programs (document creation, video playback, etc.) that work great, but many things just don't function...period
."

You may not like it, but that's a proper comparison for the end-user that expects their stuff to work.
You know, if you give me the model/unit I'm sure I could find your answer. What makes this even better is the fact that you can't. What's even better is, I could probably do custom stuff with linux and your GPS that you couldn't do. Oh how that works, the sm... erm, how fun it is to be one of those who understand.
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post #38 of 42
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by mushroomboy View Post
You know, if you give me the model/unit I'm sure I could find your answer. What makes this even better is the fact that you can't. What's even better is, I could probably do custom stuff with linux and your GPS that you couldn't do. Oh how that works, the sm... erm, how fun it is to be one of those who understand.
Congrats; you've established your supposed superiority.

I'll accept your challenge though; please educate us minions here as to how you'd go about updating either your Garmin or TomTom road navigation units (the two most popular automotive GPS models on the market) without having Windows or Mac on your computer.
post #39 of 42
While many good points have been made in this thread, please remember to take all points with a grain of salt, and to make your own judgement after appropriate research has been conducted.

Like mentioned, linux is simply an os, that while it does need some tender love to get working flawlessly, it is possible, and over the last decade gotten much easier. Hardware support has risen to a point that was previously thought unachievable, and open source software support is just insane. Yet the biggest argument is that it does not run this program, or that. But why should that be the fault of of a free, open source operating system who had NOTHING to do with that program?! Its the developers of these programs that are to be held accountable, and from a financial standpoint it appears that while they are aware of the linux movement, its not yet financially feasable to make applications supported for linux, yet. But maybe users should take that onto themselves to write developers in a plea, and see what can be done.

What i also find interesting is that on a site filled with modders, overclockers, tinkerers, and skilled peoples with other trades, linux is a challenge. We spend so much time doing it is whatever we do that make us unique, yet when we try linux cry that this doesnt work, or that that took 5 extra minutes. Does no one remember the days before windows xp? before windows 98? before 95? The nightmares and long nights, and early mornings that went into getting the operating system setup!?

And finally, while i do find open debates like this an interesting addition to OCN, lets please remember to keep this inside the Terms of Service, and like previously mentioned, useres whom are interested in linux, please take EVERYTHING you find with a grain of salt. Many users have different experiences.

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post #40 of 42
Quote:
Originally Posted by jlells01 View Post
Congrats; you've established your supposed superiority.

I'll accept your challenge though; please educate us minions here as to how you'd go about updating either your Garmin or TomTom road navigation units (the two most popular automotive GPS models on the market) without having Windows or Mac on your computer.
1) TomTom has offically not supported GPS, I'm sure there will be a work around eventually but again you can't blame Linux for somebody who refuses to make software to their hardware.

I'm guessing this would allow you to do what you want:
http://hackaday.com/2006/12/29/opent...tomtom-distro/

You would then get universal support with your own tomtom distro as well as GPS.

2) Garmin

http://ubuntuforums.org/archive/index.php/t-231452.html
http://sourceforge.net/projects/garmin-gps/
http://www.marengo-ltd.com/gps/
http://tuxmobil.org/linux_gps_naviga...lications.html
http://www.gpspassion.com/forumsen/t...OPIC_ID=121878

I'm beginning to think you didn't even look.

There are probably other tutorials, as well as it could possibly work on other models. Though I'm guessing you said these intentionally, knowing they don't give software support. It's like saying "use an Ipod in linux", it works now but only after people figured it out. Zunes don't work either, because MS won't release anything on them. I suppose that's the fault of Linux too?

Anyways, there's your GPS support, have a nice day.
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