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What to upgrade to?

post #1 of 13
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Hi guys my mate wants to take my loop and 470 off me. If i did sell it I have the option of buying his 2 TWIII 6950s that I know have been looked after well and draw less power so I could run them more comfortably on my psu but they have no warranty and ATI drivers r **** or I can get 2 brand new EVGA 560ti for the same price that will be louder and hotter and draw more power so I wouldn't have much less room for over clocking on current psu and they will be slower but they will have a warranty. Going down from a loop quietness is reasonably important when idling but in games with my G35's on I cant hear anything so it aint to important. Which will be better keeping i mind speed, looks, temps, sound, drivers and power consumption meaning room for over clocking on cpu?

If I was to do that I would end up paying roughly 240-280nzd extra to go from a full loop with a 470 on water clocked at 910 24/7 to cf 6950 or sli 560ti with a H70 cooling my cpu. The other option I can see is to not sell it and pick up another 470 with a block for about the same as the cost of the changes, and then pay abit more to get a better psu so then i can have 2 470's clocked high on water and still have a loop? You can see why I need some other opinions
post #2 of 13
You have a few questions, but then again this kind of decision isn't made every day. First thing that comes to mind is that if you're thinking to power two 470 highly OCed/OCed, then there is no problem to power two 560Ti, probably 4x 560Ti can work in the same power envelope as 2x470 OC/OV - if upgrading the PSU becomes necessary then this option becomes a bit expensive.
2x6950 SH vs new 2x560Ti - the ATI cards are obviously faster. On the other hand they are supported by a slow driver team; I don't agree AMD drivers are bad, they're just slower to release something when a new game appears. The 560Ti has a problem for SLI - too little memory. 1GB is borderline oke for a single card of this speed, adding a second in SLI uses about 1/4 of that for coherence traffic - so it may not be an advantage always to add a second 560Ti. If the 6950s are 2GB then in my book they're a clear win. Warranty is necesary if the card is new as they aren't all tested at the factory or if the card may have been abused. Otherwise you have a known working card that has been looked after, even better than a new one.
Last but not least, a recent article @TR pointed out that SLI and Xfire configs may have the "stuttering" problem, aka the game although has high FPS somehow doesn't seem to flow, if you have the time give it a read. There are many that see this as a huge problem, so they prefer getting a better single GPU if it can provide good performance, so in light of this an alternative would be something like single 6970 / GTX 570 / GTX 580 w/ a waterblock. At the same $$$ I'd always pick the single GPU if it would be fast enough.
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post #3 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by dragosmp View Post
You have a few questions, but then again this kind of decision isn't made every day. First thing that comes to mind is that if you're thinking to power two 470 highly OCed/OCed, then there is no problem to power two 560Ti, probably 4x 560Ti can work in the same power envelope as 2x470 OC/OV - if upgrading the PSU becomes necessary then this option becomes a bit expensive.
2x6950 SH vs new 2x560Ti - the ATI cards are obviously faster. On the other hand they are supported by a slow driver team; I don't agree AMD drivers are bad, they're just slower to release something when a new game appears. The 560Ti has a problem for SLI - too little memory. 1GB is borderline oke for a single card of this speed, adding a second in SLI uses about 1/4 of that for coherence traffic - so it may not be an advantage always to add a second 560Ti. If the 6950s are 2GB then in my book they're a clear win. Warranty is necesary if the card is new as they aren't all tested at the factory or if the card may have been abused. Otherwise you have a known working card that has been looked after, even better than a new one.
Last but not least, a recent article @TR pointed out that SLI and Xfire configs may have the "stuttering" problem, aka the game although has high FPS somehow doesn't seem to flow, if you have the time give it a read. There are many that see this as a huge problem, so they prefer getting a better single GPU if it can provide good performance, so in light of this an alternative would be something like single 6970 / GTX 570 / GTX 580 w/ a waterblock. At the same $$$ I'd always pick the single GPU if it would be fast enough.
hm you raise some good points. $ wise going to a single watercooled card would be either the cheapest or the most expensive. I would want most likely a 580 or if I could afford it a 590 but they are super expensive with a block and the market 4 water cooling in nz is terrible. I saw a 470 with a block go a few weeks ago on nz's version of ebay for less than a card without a block because no one has watercooling here everyone just wants stock. This means getting a decent price for it would be a pain and would probably cost by the looks of things another 200+ to get a 580 and god knows how much to get a 590 and I would have to get it in from the us. I have always said though that 1 card is better than 2 to every1 i build rigs for so going sli of cf would be abit contradictive but then again I have always wanted to try it but logics stops me everytime....
post #4 of 13
@Dragosmp, you do realize that the GTX 560Ti has a 2GB flavor of some pricing as the 6950 right? You talk as if it dosen't exsist and his only option is a 560Ti 1GB? At same VRAM both being very overclockable he's got two choices to choose from that are comparable.

@Maddox, I've found the single GTX 580 on a single 1920x1200 monitor more than enough. Albiet it's more expensive but it's the fastest in this scneario and very over clockable. Under water it surpasses them all. However a GTX 580 Lightning dosen't require water block and would be less expensive and get you some great performance. It will have fan noise and I realize you've become used to zero noise.

I will agree the single power card solution is most problem free, zero issues for me. Instead of SLI/Crossfire option at 100 FPS with microstutter, heat issues, and possible driver issues. Verse a single card with 60 FPS and none of the above is a great trade off at same price IMO.

However being practical, why sell your current SLI 470's water blocked cards. Aren't you getting the desired performance? I can't imagine your doing poorly. Next gen cards are around the corner and you can re-access your options after looking at the new cards. Why switch at all if your running them fins as is?
     
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post #5 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizonian View Post
@Dragosmp, you do realize that the GTX 560Ti has a 2GB flavor of some pricing as the 6950 right? You talk as if it dosen't exsist and his only option is a 560Ti 1GB? At same VRAM both being very overclockable he's got two choices to choose from that are comparable.

@Maddox, I've found the single GTX 580 on a single 1920x1200 monitor more than enough. Albiet it's more expensive but it's the fastest in this scneario and very over clockable. Under water it surpasses them all. However a GTX 580 Lightning dosen't require water block and would be less expensive and get you some great performance. It will have fan noise and I realize you've become used to zero noise.

I will agree the single power card solution is most problem free, zero issues for me. Instead of SLI/Crossfire option at 100 FPS with microstutter, heat issues, and possible driver issues. Verse a single card with 60 FPS and none of the above is a great trade off at same price IMO.

However being practical, why sell your current SLI 470's water blocked cards. Aren't you getting the desired performance? I can't imagine your doing poorly. Next gen cards are around the corner and you can re-access your options after looking at the new cards. Why switch at all if your running them fins as is?
Wait, isn't he asking if he should get SLI 470's

@OP: If you don't already have SLI470's, and you want an upgrade, I would seriously consider just trying to get another one ... unless you're currently running into perf issues that you *know* are due to vram constraints.

I absolutely love my SLI470 setup. It flies, microstutter is unnoticeable in any game I've played except Metro (if I try to completely max it out), they OC like a champ ... not much to dislike about SLI470's, except noise if you're on reference cooling ... but you're talking about water on the 2nd card, right?

Based on my research (err...reading a lot of articles ) AMD cards are a bit more prone to noticeable microstutter when in 2-card Crossfire than nV cards, so take that into account as you marvel at their wonderful 'scaling' ... part of how they get that great scaling is by not doing anything to curb microstutter.

SO, unless you're planning on upgrading to like Surround/Eyefinity (in which case VRAM will be an issue w/SLI470's), personally I vote for another 470 on H20. At their max OC's possible on water (generally around 900MHz), 470's in SLI will compare very favorably FPS-wise to a 6970 Crossfire setup at it's max OC on air.
    
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post #6 of 13
@Brettjv - your right. I read that wrong. He currently has one 470 on loop. I'd have to concur get a second. He'll have a very nice set up at much lower cost with that upgrade path. Not to mention under water over two air cooled noisy cards. Most cost effective price/performance path IMO too.
     
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post #7 of 13
Thread Starter 
The thing to remember about the sli 470 setup is that I will need a new psu to get that going. That will make that upgrade the most expensive at roughlt 400-450(new card, psu, fitting, tubing etc......) The reason I was looking into the 6950's was that they draw alot less power meaning I wont have to upgrade my psu and they are cheap for new zealand. The question is then what is faster CF 6950's with light oc'ing or sli 470 with heavy oc and is the speed difference and the noise difference be worth an extra 150-200?
post #8 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaddoX View Post
The thing to remember about the sli 470 setup is that I will need a new psu to get that going. That will make that upgrade the most expensive at roughlt 400-450(new card, psu, fitting, tubing etc......) The reason I was looking into the 6950's was that they draw alot less power meaning I wont have to upgrade my psu and they are cheap for new zealand. The question is then what is faster CF 6950's with light oc'ing or sli 470 with heavy oc and is the speed difference and the noise difference be worth an extra 150-200?
The perf between the two setups would be extremely close at single screen resolutions, at higher res, the 2gb cards would pull away in many gaming scenarios. You do lose the cuda and physX though, as well as 3d ... if you care. However you gain an extra AA mode (morphological) that I believe works even on a lot of games that don't regularly support it, so that's a + for AMD.

I'd tend to say no, if it costs 150-200 more for the 2nd 470, it wouldn't make a lot of sense ... probably would grab the 6950's instead ALthough, does that price diff include the cost of PSU, and if so, are you subtracting the cost of what you could sell your current one for in coming up w/your price difference? And does having a new PSU have any 'value' to you, such that it would also add to the value of what you're getting for the 150-200?
    
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post #9 of 13
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by brettjv View Post
The perf between the two setups would be extremely close at single screen resolutions, at higher res, the 2gb cards would pull away in many gaming scenarios. You do lose the cuda and physX though, as well as 3d ... if you care. However you gain an extra AA mode (morphological) that I believe works even on a lot of games that don't regularly support it, so that's a + for AMD.

I'd tend to say no, if it costs 150-200 more for the 2nd 470, it wouldn't make a lot of sense ... probably would grab the 6950's instead ALthough, does that price diff include the cost of PSU, and if so, are you subtracting the cost of what you could sell your current one for in coming up w/your price difference? And does having a new PSU have any 'value' to you, such that it would also add to the value of what you're getting for the 150-200?
the 150-200 more comes from the calculation of a new 470 is around 300-320 and after I sell my psu a new 1 will be roughly an extra 80-100. Also add in the costs of fittings so I can set up sli which will be like 50 as I will have to get them in from america and the total upgrade to sli 470 will be around 430-470+. Compare that to the 140 extra from selling my loop and my card to get cf 6950 and then another 100 to get my mates h70 so I could still oc my cpu and you can see that its around 190-230 extra in actual fact to go sli 470 and having a beter psu is not something i consider value as I have to do it to go sli 470 so its just another cost that if I can avoid will make the process alot cheaper
Edited by MaddoX - 11/8/11 at 4:55pm
post #10 of 13
Quote:
Originally Posted by MaddoX View Post
the 150-200 more comes from the calculation of a new 470 is around 300-320 and after I sell my psu a new 1 will be roughly an extra 80-100. Also add in the costs of fittings so I can set up sli which will be like 50 as I will have to get them in from america and the total upgrade to sli 470 will be around 430-470+. Compare that to the 140 extra from selling my loop and my card to get cf 6950 and then another 100 to get my mates h70 so I could still oc my cpu and you can see that its around 190-230 extra in actual fact to go sli 470 and having a beter psu is not something i consider value as I have to do it to go sli 470 so its just another cost that if I can avoid will make the process alot cheaper
Sounds like you figured it out. Enjoy them. I personally am used to fan noise, but go to air cooled from water blocks will take some getting used to. Eventually you'll just associate it with turning on your PC. Good luck bud.
     
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