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[REG-HARDWARE] Swiss insist file-sharers don't hurt copyright holders - Page 5

post #41 of 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by -Apocalypse- View Post

Not at a 1:1 ratio, but there are absolutely people who pirate copies of things they would have bought if they couldn't pirate it, I personally know a couple people like this. Those are lost sales. Even if it's only 10% of the people pirating that would of paid, that's still a huge amount of money denied from the people who put a lot of hard work into the product. Pirating is not a good thing, however you swing it.

Nobody's saying it's a good thing (well, at least I'm not) but people need to calm down and take a realistic look at things. When the black-and-white moralists get all worked up into a fervor, logic flies out the window and then everyone has to suffer for it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cook View Post

Students get a discount, the entire CS5 with student discount is 449.00 compared to 1899.00, Photoshop by itself is 299 vs 1000. Pirating copyrighted "For Sale" software is stealing, which is illegal. For the instance of downloading Photoshop in Brazil, there are trials. If it is that important, do the trails, don't steal. The argument always gets raised that developers are no longer doing demos or trials of their software, well if your not going to buy the software without a demo, don't steal it, just simply don't waste your time with that developer if your purchasing method does not line up with their marketing strategies. They will get the hint sooner or later, just send them a letter every time.

Adobe charges that much for their software simply because they can. "Dear Adobe, please charge less for your software." Really?

Also, I'm not sure what your definition of "poor" is, but $500 in a country where the monthly minimum wage is about 550 reals, even that is unrealistic. Trials last a mere 30 days.
Edited by Malcolm - 12/8/11 at 8:08am
post #42 of 284
I knew there had to be more to Switzerland than beautiful women! How do I move there?

The most important finding of their senate's year long study was:
Quote:
While around a third of Swiss citizens over the age of 15 download pirated content, they don't spend any less money on entertainment than usual.
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post #43 of 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by cook View Post

Students get a discount, the entire CS5 with student discount is 449.00 compared to 1899.00, Photoshop by itself is 299 vs 1000. Pirating copyrighted "For Sale" software is stealing, which is illegal. For the instance of downloading Photoshop in Brazil, there are trials. If it is that important, do the trails, don't steal. The argument always gets raised that developers are no longer doing demos or trials of their software, well if your not going to buy the software without a demo, don't steal it, just simply don't waste your time with that developer if your purchasing method does not line up with their marketing strategies. They will get the hint sooner or later, just send them a letter every time.

$300 is still a lot for a student. I am a student and I only get $90 per month, It would take me 4 months before I can buy a copy of Photoshop, that is if I don't eat anything and live without electricity and hot water for the 4 months. And IIRC you can only install the trial once on your PC, after that it gets blocked unless you buy it.
    
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post #44 of 284
Switzerland is awesome, more places should follow up with them smile.gif
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post #45 of 284
How about this (to you in favor of pirating), you work a few years on a project and you finally get the chance to release it to the public so you can make a living, but instead, people steal your product and you get nothing for all the hard work you did. It just doesn't make sense to me why people think that's okay.

I get angry when I hear about how pirating shouldn't be against the law or how it's okay, but then I remember I'm trying to reason with kids, and that just doesn't work well. Don't get me wrong, I use to do it, but as I've gotten older, I've realized it hurts developers, etc.. I'm absolutely against software theft now... I'll take the flaming.
Edited by whitingnick - 12/8/11 at 12:36pm
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post #46 of 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by whitingnick View Post

How about this (to you in favor of pirating), you work a few years on a project and you finally get the chance to release it to the public so you can make a living, but instead, people steal your product and you get nothing for all the hard work you did. It just doesn't make sense to me why people think that's okay.
I get angry when I hear about how pirating shouldn't be against the law or how it's okay, but then I remember I'm trying to reason with kids, and that just doesn't work well. Don't get me wrong, I use to do it, but as I've gotten older, I've realized it hurts developers, etc.. I'm absolutely against software theft now... I'll take the flaming.

I agree with that but software developers should let their software be sold in a similar way as Euphoria (The physics engine for GTA IV). It's free if it's not for commercial use but if it is for commercial use it cost $1200USD
    
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post #47 of 284
i hope so tongue.gif
post #48 of 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malcolm View Post

This.
People fail to realize that a large percentage of piracy is due to inability to afford the product. It's very very rampant in some places like Brazil. Do you honestly think a poor 16 year old Brazilian student who torrents Photoshop on his Pentium M laptop using a neighbor's Wifi could afford to actually buy the retail box software? No. There never was going to be any sale to begin with, hence it's not a "lost sale."

You have to live within your means...I can't afford a car so I will just go steal one. Though people will just argue nothing of material was stolen.

Remember the outrage that ensued here on OCN when that dink used pics of US Forces's custom desk to win a contest? How is that different than some one who steals software to use for their own benefit? Was US Forces and all of the people that supported his case wrong? Should the hard work and creativity of US Forces be passed around the Internet for everyone to benefit from?

maybe nothing material is stolen but there is something of value stolen. Using any excuse of any kind is not going to justify it. It is a lost sale since any one who uses it should have to pay for it. Simple as that. If they can't pay for it then they can't use it. You eat a sandwich, you pay for a sandwich. Can't pay for the sandwich you ate? Well, guess what, you will be paying more later once the cops get here
Edited by Vagrant Storm - 12/8/11 at 1:00pm
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post #49 of 284
Newsflash : Piracy is for the poor.
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post #50 of 284
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vagrant Storm View Post

You have to live within your means...I can't afford a car so I will just go steal one. Though people will just argue nothing of material was stolen.
Remember the outrage that ensued here on OCN when that dink used pics of US Forces's custom desk to win a contest? How is that different than some one who steals software to use for their own benefit? Was US Forces and all of the people that supported his case wrong? Should the hard work and creativity of US Forces be passed around the Internet for everyone to benefit from?
maybe nothing material is stolen but there is something of value stolen. Using any excuse of any kind is not going to justify it. It is a lost sale since any one who uses it should have to pay for it. Simple as that. If they can't pay for it then they can't use it. You eat a sandwich, you pay for a sandwich. Can't pay for the sandwich you ate? Well, guess what, you will be paying more later once the cops get here

I was hoping I wouldn't have to pull out this image, but it appears I do:

429

I'm not trying to "justify" it, I just have a clear understanding of why and when it occurs and how it differs from theft, hence that example I gave of the poor Brazilian student. Studios view it as a lost sale/loss of profit, even though there is no "poor people market segment" in which those supposedly lost sales ever occur. "It is a lost sale since anyone who uses it should have to pay for it." Except when you can't, then it's not.

I have games sitting in my Steam download queue right now. Those are sales. I am part of Valve's potential customer base because I have money and I am willing to pay for the convenience of Steam. If I lived in a 3rd world country and were poor, I'd be outside that base. You're looking at this as a matter of black-and-white morality, I'm looking at it another way.

In spite of what a lot of people think, digital software piracy is a victimless crime and should NOT be at the forefront of important political issues in this day and age. It honestly disgusts me to no end how much attention this is given when there are 9,001 other problems that need to be fixed before we worry about some corporation losing 0.00005% of their profits.
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