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[Escapist] StarCraft 2 Threatens to Zerg Rush Chess For Science - Page 10

post #91 of 115

Regardless, as much as I like Starcraft 2, if I had the choice I'd take on a good game of Chess anyday.

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post #92 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post

You don't know the history of your favorite RTS that well. It became a cultural phenomenon as the poor communities of Korea and neighboring countries were able to play a computer game that was not very demanding. Due to its low system requirements, it was easy to purchase needed hardware to play the game. Given the large poor population and population density, it only gain in popularity quickly. Eventually it became a national sport, not because it was the best RTS, but it was popular to the poor communities that couldn't afford much (which just happened to be the majority of the population).
I'm not saying any offense to the poor communities of Asia, I'm just pointing out facts. Traditions stick and that's why SC2 took off.
Just looking out for you, but, learn your stuff. At least I went easy on ya.
Why would you even say that? You don't have any supporting arguments and you just resort to, "No, you're wrong". Then you try some sort of ... what. Mad? Why would I be mad? Are you upset that your favorite game is not the most complex RTS on the planet? Are you that attached to a game that it effects you like this?
Dude...seriously?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Domino View Post

Yes you do. Just because you are in a squad environment for infantry, you are able to position your infantry individually. Likewise, if you aren't skilled enough to know how to place individual units while in a squad environment, it shows your lack of skill in the game. Heck, they teach you how to do it in the training missions. Just to through in more complexity of the game, you account for physics, sight ratios/camo sights, road path finding, turret rotation speeds, retreat bonuses, and even the psychology of your troops (i.e. pinning/suppression and their related bonuses). Players on CoH also radically shape the map. You can't shape the map on SC2, neither SC1.
Fanboys would be fanboys. The arguments they have stated for complexity revolves in nearly all RTS games, CoH just builds on it and breaks the rules. Oh well...clouded judges before they reach high level play (which I'm an old SC1 vet and SC2 player) and have counted well over thousands of thousands of hours to RTS games of all styles. Lol, if you want to use that as an argument, then I'd just use it too. Been playing competitive RTS for 4 years, and gaming RTS since I was 8 years old.
Simply put, CoH is more micro driven... starcraft mixes the two concepts very well... CnC is more macro driven (on the higher archy of macro-micro ratios). Micro requires more thought on the micro scale, macro is more APM/macroly driven, resource prediction, rock-paper-scissors concepts, etc. Just like the sciences, macro is a lot more simple then micro but both requires dramatically different concepts that only intertwine the other characteristics of the other.
Allies versus axis really shows your lack of understanding of the game and complexity of the factions and how much they differ. How can you comment on a game on which of competitive elements when you haven't actually played the game to the pro tournament levels?
I'm a huge CnC fan at heart, but I'll easily comment on its lack of complexity any time. It just shows you how much I actually understand the game and not allow fanboy comments to cloud my judgement.

Starcraft became a cultural phenomenon because it requires pure skill, whereas in CoH there are a lot of random encounters to take into consideration that might potentially make or break the game. Starcraft is 100% player input and is so greatly balanced that the better player wins the vast majority of the time. CoH focuses on simulation and realism, which doesn't make it the best candidate for eSports.

I like both games, but in my opinion Starcraft is so far ahead of any other RTS I've tried.
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post #93 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goaky View Post

Starcraft became a cultural phenomenon because it requires pure skill, whereas in CoH there are a lot of random encounters to take into consideration that might potentially make or break the game. Starcraft is 100% player input and is so greatly balanced that the better player wins the vast majority of the time. CoH focuses on simulation and realism, which doesn't make it the best candidate for eSports.
I like both games, but in my opinion Starcraft is so far ahead of any other RTS I've tried.

Thats a great opinion you have there but its an opinion just like ours. However that other guy is basically saying we are wrong because we do not think SC is equivalent to the strategic value of chess, which is not even what the article was about but he has been spouting it this whole thread.
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post #94 of 115
The reason why chess has remained the standard for so long? It doesn't change. Starcraft changes with every patch, and oftentimes, balance is broken in these patches. Also, Starcraft II is going to play very differently with the new expansion coming out soon, and then the expansion after that (and who knows, perhaps more expansions since Activision-Blizzard loves milking). The amount of pattern memorization and recognition in Chess is way above what it is in video games like Starcraft as well.

I've done a report on this before, actually, and using a video game like Starcraft as a model would require a lot of changes involving expertise and skill. For example, 10 year/10,000 hour "rules" would become invalid.

If they replace chess with Starcraft I will be very unhappy, even though I really like Starcraft. Chess is there as the standard for a reason.
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post #95 of 115
Lol, no no no no and no. There is no comparison between chess and SC2. Chess is 100% strategy, logic and cognitive ability. SC2 is a fast-twitch game disguised as a pseudo-intellectual one. One appeals to geniuses, the other appeals to hampsters with severe ADD.
    
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post #96 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuNkDrSpOt View Post

Lol, no no no no and no. There is no comparison between chess and SC2. Chess is 100% strategy, logic and cognitive ability. SC2 is a fast-twitch game disguised as a pseudo-intellectual one. One appeals to geniuses, the other appeals to hampsters with severe ADD.

confused.gif so no strategy, logic, or cognitive ability is necessary to be a master of SC2...but, if there's no strategy or logic or thinking involved in SC2, how can there be multiple tiers? How can some people be better at it than others? I can't draw this together, but this bland sterotyping statement about how only ADD idiot hampsters are good at SC2 seems to be exactly what you're railing against in your signature with rap...
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post #97 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by FuNkDrSpOt View Post

Lol, no no no no and no. There is no comparison between chess and SC2. Chess is 100% strategy, logic and cognitive ability. SC2 is a fast-twitch game disguised as a pseudo-intellectual one. One appeals to geniuses, the other appeals to hampsters with severe ADD.

I think he's saying that because he sucks at SC2 and is envious that another country is a master at it.

Come to think of it, what e-games are Americans good at? Um…Madden? Oh that's right, Americans are only good at the e-games Asians show no interest in.
 
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post #98 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by kikkO View Post

I think he's saying that because he sucks at SC2 and is envious that another country is a master at it.
Come to think of it, what e-games are Americans good at? Um…Madden? Oh that's right, Americans are only good at the e-games Asians show no interest in.

Not to praise the yanks, but credit is given where credit is due. Quake, Counter-Strike, etc. NA is where the FPS is at and we are beginning to get big on SC2 with a lot of pros coming from Canada and the states.
post #99 of 115
i dont think chess can be replaced at all, it is classic and timeless, played a few tournaments when i was in school. sc2 is something completely different though, it brings a lot of pressure especially with timings and split-second decisions during the game. and you have to macro/micro too. i read the first few pages and i dont understand why there are people saying that this is like rock, paper, scissors or "build more units/best units". makes me want to shoot an arrow mad.gif
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Yep, Aeris died
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post #100 of 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nethermir View Post

i dont think chess can be replaced at all, it is classic and timeless, played a few tournaments when i was in school. sc2 is something completely different though, it brings a lot of pressure especially with timings and split-second decisions during the game. and you have to macro/micro too. i read the first few pages and i dont understand why there are people saying that this is like rock, paper, scissors or "build more units/best units". makes me want to shoot an arrow mad.gif

one word answer.

noobs.
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