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Plasticizer Problems / Discussion / Gallery - Page 225

post #2241 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by ceteris View Post

My GTX 560s had a ton of debris in them. I recommend giving a generous amount of time in flushing your rads. Still had some debris after draining my system to redo the loop.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sticks435 View Post

Strange, I flushed my UT60 for like an hour with boiling hot water over and over and never had anything come out. I haven't broken down my loop since I first installed it, so we'll see if anything broke loose during use the last 4 or 5 months.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wermad View Post

Didn't have anything come out of my Monsta 360s. I have a new one incoming, and I'll let you guys know if that has debris inside or not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Systemlord View Post

Did you ever use vinegar + hot distilled or just very hot distilled?


offtopic.gif

There is a specific thread for this issue, cmon guys just keep here for plasticizer issues, lets not turn into the mess that occurs on other threads. smile.gif

Quote:
Originally Posted by theChisel View Post

Speaking of consensus, what are the general thoughts on using ether-based polyurethane tubing? I've been in contact with FreelinWade about having a 100ft. batch of their Fre-thane tubing made in 7/16 X 5/8. They can produce it in many colors and even provided some nice samples to prove it. The only issue, however is the price at $4.25 per foot. It's pricey, but not compared to some of the other components we're all throwing in our rigs.


Quote "

"There are two general classes of polyurethane and both are commonly found in the market: ether-base and ester-base. Chemically, these are made from two different polyol alcohols that cause similar, but different reactions in the isocyanate. From the user's standpoint, the ester-based polymer is less expensive however it degrades when exposed to moisture."

"Ester-based polyurethane offers slightly better fuel and oil resistance; however, water attacks it and significantly reduces its physical properties. Ether-based polyurethane exhibits far superior hydrolytic stability, especially when being used in humid environments. Ether-based tubing will also resist fungus growth much better than the ester-based."

Manufacturer claims:

"Freelin-Wade's Fre-Thane has a high resistance to abrasion while being highly flexible and kink resistant. Its most notable quality though is its "memory." Fre-Thane will stretch and flex but always return to its original shape."

Imo :

1) you would be correct is saying that the price wouldn't be much of an issue.

2) What manufacturers claim and what is the truth has often shown to be poles apart-the only way to find out would be by actually using that sort of tubing under various controlled and monitored variables, or simply put, seeing what feedback it gets after extended use in many loops-that necessitates, a large amount of people using the tubing and reporting their findings.

3) The fact that the tubing has a 'memory' may also cause problems, in that tubing works better if it is able to be 'trained' ie made to keep the shape it is moulded to-memory type tubing will always be trying to revert to its original shape and that imo will always cause undue strain on fittings, water blocks etc.

3)But as Ghandi said, 'many difficult journey's begin with the smallest footstep' so why don't you try it out and share your findings with the thread, im sure that your efforts would be appreciated thumb.gif
Edited by kkorky - 12/23/12 at 6:33pm
post #2242 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkorky View Post

offtopic.gif
There is a specefic thread for this issue, cmon guys just keep here for plasticizer issues.rolleyes.gif

Debris will start to stir up plasticizer on the tube. I think its relavent and not off topic wink.gif
post #2243 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkorky View Post


...3)But as Ghandi said, 'many difficult journey's begin with the smallest footstep' so why don't you try it out and share your findings with the thread, im sure that your efforts would be appreciated thumb.gif

I fully intend to smile.gif

My interest in FreelinWade is strictly due to the fact that they offer their PU tubing in such a wide color spectrum. That being said, my current hurdle, holidays aside, is trying to negotiate a smaller minimum order. If they can't, the clear PU tubing from McMaster Carr is the next step.
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post #2244 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by wermad View Post

Debris will start to stir up plasticizer on the tube. I think its relavent and not off topic wink.gif

I agree, and although I definitely also agree that discussing rad flushing and debris may be slightly off topic - a secondary purpose of this thread is dispelling 'false positives' which obfuscate the plasticizer leeching problem. Just like discussing dye staining and microbial growth could be considered off topic, yet may be causal factors in people claiming leeching/clouding when in fact the problem is something else entirely.

I guess the summary on that would simply be that unless your system is completely and thoroughly cleaned/flushed and without other oddities - the tubing itself may only be part of the problem.
post #2245 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiGiCiDAL View Post

I agree, and although I definitely also agree that discussing rad flushing and debris may be slightly off topic - a secondary purpose of this thread is dispelling 'false positives' which obfuscate the plasticizer leeching problem. Just like discussing dye staining and microbial growth could be considered off topic, yet may be causal factors in people claiming leeching/clouding when in fact the problem is something else entirely.
I guess the summary on that would simply be that unless your system is completely and thoroughly cleaned/flushed and without other oddities - the tubing itself may only be part of the problem.


Point taken, and yes whilst that may be true, plasticizer leeching is not down to debris from other parts from within the loop-i base my opinion (and thats all it is) on this:

http://www.materialsviews.com/barrier-coating-reduces-plasticizer-leaching-from-pvc/

This is a very new article(6/12/2012), and so its authenticity is up for debate.


I paid specific attention to this part: " The plasticizers often have, however, a tendency to migrate from the bulk of the PVC material to its surface and into the environment."


I cannot see debris influencing that migration/leeching process, since the migration occurs from within the tube outwards, and debris comes into contact with the outer layers of the tubing. (this does not apply to the minority of tubing that has some sort of 'special' inner coating)

If one was to say that it removes the inner layer of some tubing, thusly allowing PVC (plasticizer) into the loop-i would accept that, but most tubing does not have that inner protective layer-the specialized ones that actually state that they have such a layer are few in comparison to the ones we generally use-ergo the leeching/plasticizer problem exists already without the influence of debris.

But the deal clincher for me is that, this inner coating innovation/invention is very new technology so i highly doubt its existence within tubing that we have been referring to in this thread wink.gif


-thats my train of thought anyway. smile.gif


But your general message has weight and i agree with it thumb.gif
Edited by kkorky - 12/23/12 at 11:37pm
post #2246 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by kkorky View Post

I cannot see debris influencing that migration/leeching process, since the migration occurs from within the tube outwards, and debris comes into contact with the outer layers of the tubing.

I think I should have been a little more clear on the off chance someone reads that post out of context without reading the entire thread... although that wouldn't happen would it? rolleyes.gif

I meant to say that although I don't think anything other than fluid temperature and plasticizer content levels in the tubing are likely to cause genuine leeching - that there is a distinct possibility for someone with a buildup of organics, dye solids, flux/sediment, etc... to believe they are experiencing plasticizer leeching when it is merely the aforementioned problems and not their tubing (or at least it's merely a secondary problem).

I wholeheartedly agree that these other factors are unlikely to create or accelerate leeching if present. smile.gif
post #2247 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by DiGiCiDAL View Post

I think I should have been a little more clear on the off chance someone reads that post out of context without reading the entire thread... although that wouldn't happen would it? rolleyes.gif
I meant to say that although I don't think anything other than fluid temperature and plasticizer content levels in the tubing are likely to cause genuine leeching - that there is a distinct possibility for someone with a buildup of organics, dye solids, flux/sediment, etc... to believe they are experiencing plasticizer leeching when it is merely the aforementioned problems and not their tubing (or at least it's merely a secondary problem).
I wholeheartedly agree that these other factors are unlikely to create or accelerate leeching if present. smile.gif


LOL! Touche vis a vis taking the post out of context-i think that we all have been subject to doing that at times biggrin.gif
post #2248 of 3087
I've saw that a few US sites have the new bloodshed red advanced primochill tubing in stock now, does anyone know if any EU/UK sites have it yet? the shipping cost from frozencpu is double the price of the actual tubing redface.gif

Also has anyone used that flushing fluid they include in the retail box? is it worth running it through my loop as a flush, it won't corrode nickel/acetal will it?
Edited by paradoxum - 12/24/12 at 1:33pm
post #2249 of 3087
Quote:
Originally Posted by paradoxum View Post

I've saw that a few US sites have the new bloodshed red advanced primochill tubing in stock now, does anyone know if any EU/UK sites have it yet? the shipping cost from frozencpu is double the price of the actual tubing redface.gif
Also has anyone used that flushing fluid they include in the retail box? is it worth running it through my loop as a flush, it won't corrode nickel/acetal will it?

Sadly us Europeans are still far from getting that or Duralene tubing which seems like both are best PLasticizer free tubing.

I can't wait for either to get on stock, so that I can buy some clear tubing and use some Mayhems Dye.
    
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post #2250 of 3087
does anyone know how Feser one performs? there is nothing else available here in europe besides primochill pro and masterkleer.
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