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post #31 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Of course.... if a developer already knew about an exploit/weakness, they would attempt to patch it (for the most part).
Developers basically do not have testing to check for weaknesses.

EA seems to only let them fix the ones that are exploited like crazy. For example: the telporting/revive from across map that happened in BC2 for months. They still haven't fixed the knife from spawn point in BF3. Admins just use procon mods to auto ban people who get too many kills within a certain time frame or use ammo box.


Also: repost
Edited by PoopaScoopa - 1/31/12 at 7:37pm
post #32 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by PoopaScoopa View Post

EA seems to only let them fix the ones that are exploited like crazy. For example: the telporting/revive from across map that happened in BC2 for months. They still haven't fixed the knife from spawn point in BF3. Admins just use procon mods to auto ban people who get too many kills within a certain time frame or use ammo box.
Also: repost

I think those sort of cheats are hard coded into the engine and aren't something you can fix on the fly with PB. A good example is the car drop cheat on BF2. It was only prevented in patch 1.5.
post #33 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by 78@pwnt4lif3 View Post

I hope they hire a honest professional person NOT a cheater. thumb.gif This is good news. We need to beef up the security and kick cheater's coding experts in the head to show'em whose smarter biggrin.gif:thumb:

http://www.artificialaiming.net/forum/general-discussions/56017-unerring-punkbuster-season-3-a-11.html

http://www.artificialaiming.net/forum/general-discussions/56017-unerring-punkbuster-season-3-a-18.html
nice posts on those pages

They would always be one step ahead of the developers anyways...
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post #34 of 56
The only way devs could get ahead of the cheaters is to run greater verification modules on client end, scanning for things like memory editors/hooks etc... also some sort of sanity check on data being sent to and fro. The issue is that this requires running more on the clients PC, requiring potentially more bandwidth and slowing down response times.

If you do that, you'd get a cleaner game, but the same whiney bastards who complain about PB on this forum would then whine about resource hogging. I think people sometimes forget the complexity of balancing cheat prevention with resource usage and good gameplay.

But hey, people will moan about everything. It's a tough life being an arm chair expert tongue.gif
post #35 of 56
This is a wicked job. On top of that, you get to live in one of the best countries in the world!
Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdummy35 View Post

That's in the North Pole or there abouts... Born and raised in South Texas, I once moved to Indianapolis, Indiana--endured 1 winter and moved right back to Houston. Snow, temps below 20 degrees...no thank you. Cargo shorts, flip flops and the beach 80% of the year are all I need.

Soft.

I hike to Tim Hortons in -30 degrees Celsius with 1 metre of snow. Welcome to Canada.
Edited by SkillzKillz - 2/1/12 at 1:53am
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post #36 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Not true.
1) Large scale cheating detection is a mathematics problem, not a coding problem. An economist or a quant would be better suited for the job. You star with the the stat database and mine it for cheating patterns to identify suspects.... THEN examine their network communication and view their game. i.e. In the book Freakonomics, they were able to identify teachers cheating for their students by examining patterns of answers. A teacher would not be able to identify another teacher cheating easily.
2) There is nothing wrong with book-learning. Having a formal education does not make one less of a hacker.

Well, I don't think identifying cheaters and banning them is the solution. It would be like pumping water out of the boat without fixing the leak. It's a means to an end yes, but I think there should be a more pro-active approach towards cheating ergo making the game more cheat-proof instead of detection and punishment.
I'm currently studying IT myself so I have no problem with a formal education at all but I do think a hacker/bot-programmer would be a great asset to Punkbuster/Dice.
But I do see your point. My comment was indeed a bit short-sighted. And I still have much to learn rolleyes.gif
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post #37 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by 78@pwnt4lif3 View Post

I hope they hire a honest professional person NOT a cheater. thumb.gif This is good news. We need to beef up the security and kick cheater's coding experts in the head to show'em whose smarter biggrin.gif:thumb:

I hope they hire one of the biggest game hackers there is. Why? Simply because we game programmer/hackers have way more experience in exploiting games, that when it comes to securing one we know exactly what to look for. Take a look at AlterIW private Modern Warfare 2 servers for example. Their anti-cheat blows VAC out of the water.
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post #38 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by crashdummy35 View Post

That's in the North Pole or there abouts... Born and raised in South Texas, I once moved to Indianapolis, Indiana--endured 1 winter and moved right back to Houston. Snow, temps below 20 degrees...no thank you. Cargo shorts, flip flops and the beach 80% of the year are all I need.

Stockholm is very far from the North Pole actually, only the very top of Sweden crosses that border, that's like a thousand klicks apart. Though the snow is very real, this winter hasn't been so bad, but the two previous ones were horrific, and it's about to get worse this year too.
Personally I want to move to Barcelona or something later in life, after I finish school. I turn 20 the day after tomorrow. smile.gif
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post #39 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Warmonger View Post

I hope they hire one of the biggest game hackers there is. Why? Simply because we game programmer/hackers have way more experience in exploiting games, that when it comes to securing one we know exactly what to look for. Take a look at AlterIW private Modern Warfare 2 servers for example. Their anti-cheat blows VAC out of the water.

Who is the 'biggest game hacker there is' again? Like I said, I don't want to see DICE attempting to gain the so called resourcefulness of a game-hacker who sounds like he knows what he's doing.
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post #40 of 56
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bloitz View Post

Well, I don't think identifying cheaters and banning them is the solution. It would be like pumping water out of the boat without fixing the leak. It's a means to an end yes, but I think there should be a more pro-active approach towards cheating ergo making the game more cheat-proof instead of detection and punishment.
I'm currently studying IT myself so I have no problem with a formal education at all but I do think a hacker/bot-programmer would be a great asset to Punkbuster/Dice.
But I do see your point. My comment was indeed a bit short-sighted. And I still have much to learn rolleyes.gif
The pro-active approach is much more expensive and less effective.

Think about it.... We have laws, audits, checks, etc in teaching, driving, financial markets, sports, etc. No matter how many laws you create, people will continue to find ways to bypass them. So, do you as team of 10-30 people want to continue to try to stop thousands of knowledgeable people from breaking the law in every possible way? Legislation or anti-hacks are often reactive.

The other approach is better detection and punishment. While detection may not get less offenders, it will stop the more obvious offenders.... the ones that really ruin servers.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Warmonger View Post

I hope they hire one of the biggest game hackers there is. Why? Simply because we game programmer/hackers have way more experience in exploiting games, that when it comes to securing one we know exactly what to look for. Take a look at AlterIW private Modern Warfare 2 servers for example. Their anti-cheat blows VAC out of the water.
The job posting is for an administrative role... not a developer role. The job is not looking for bug/exploit hunter.
Once again...
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Once again...
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