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[El Reg] 40,000 Apple fanbois demand ethical iPhone 5 - Page 6

post #51 of 141
Ethical iPhone 5? Nah, I'll just take the regular cheap one.

No company is using toxic chemicals in its products or having them manufactured by low-paid workers in the third world because they're evil, they only do it because it's cheaper so yes, if they did it any other way it would drive the cost of the product up. It's also true that no one is being forced to work in these factories, just look at the lines of thousands who want to start working for Foxconn (or whoever it was) even now that they're under investigation.

The truth is most people in America simply do not understand the types of lives people are living in those countries right now. For the most part, they know the work is dangerous and unhealthy but they have no other choice. It's not like you can quit your Foxconn factory job and go work at McDonalds flipping burgers instead, you either work for 5 cents a day or you get nothing and someone else will gladly take your place to feed his or her family.

As sad as it is, as long as people are freely choosing to do the work (and assuming employers aren't hiding the health risks from those workers, which they probably are) then it's no one's business to come and say they can't run their factory that way. We're all pretty quick to forget that most of today's first world countries were no better off during their industrial revolutions.
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post #52 of 141
They'll sell the same if they are made in good or bad working conditions
    
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post #53 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Remonster View Post

Ethical iPhone 5? Nah, I'll just take the regular cheap one.
No company is using toxic chemicals in its products or having them manufactured by low-paid workers in the third world because they're evil, they only do it because it's cheaper so yes, if they did it any other way it would drive the cost of the product up. It's also true that no one is being forced to work in these factories, just look at the lines of thousands who want to start working for Foxconn (or whoever it was) even now that they're under investigation.
The truth is most people in America simply do not understand the types of lives people are living in those countries right now. For the most part, they know the work is dangerous and unhealthy but they have no other choice. It's not like you can quit your Foxconn factory job and go work at McDonalds flipping burgers instead, you either work for 5 cents a day or you get nothing and someone else will gladly take your place to feed his or her family.
As sad as it is, as long as people are freely choosing to do the work (and assuming employers aren't hiding the health risks from those workers, which they probably are) then it's no one's business to come and say they can't run their factory that way. We're all pretty quick to forget that most of today's first world countries were no better off during their industrial revolutions.

I would agree to some extent except that in China, people are required by the government to work. If, say, the workers at Foxconn decided to form a union and go on strike, the Chinese government would have them all removed from their homes and either placed in forced labor prisons or killed (exaggerating a bit, the point is, the government would put an end to it).
    
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post #54 of 141
Of course they are mad.

More than half of the occupy protesters are probably apple users.
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post #55 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtSpike View Post

You're pretty much repeating what I said. "A crappy job is better than no job at all." Sounds like we both agree there.

Not really, you were saying that they had a choice, I was pointing out that the choice may be work for {company} and except poor conditions or starve

Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtSpike View Post

I'm not sure how you can say that it wouldn't be hard to raise the wages and still make it financially beneficial though.

Taking a very simplified view, if the government raised the wages and lowered export fees it could, in theory, balance the two off against each other. The result would be that {OEM} pays the same per product, but more of it goes into the worker's pocket. Of course the worker then spends said money in the country, and it ends up in the same place. I realize that this is a very simplified view and probably wouldn't work, but if any country could do it China could, where the government essentially controls everything.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtSpike View Post

How do you know that Apple isn't just a couple pennies an hour away from switching to Korea to lower costs? Suppliers will certainly milk as much money out of Apple as they can for producing their parts, right up to the point of Apple leaving for a different supplier. That's what any competitive company would do. So I'm not sure that there's any more milk to squeeze, and I don't think you are either. There's no reason we can't speculate on the matter, but you're stating it as fact, when I don't think there is any evidence to justify it.

I was speculating, although I agree I worded it poorly. Trying to type and pretend to work at the same time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtSpike View Post

You're still acting like they don't have a choice. It isn't up to us what they make of their lives. It is up to them.

How do you know they have a choice? Speculation? tongue.gif

Like I said the choice may be that or starve. We enjoy a lot of freedom in the West, don't imagine for a second that that is universal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtSpike View Post

I think it is noble of people to want to help. I want to help too. But I don't think imposing artificial floors on wages is the way to do it. If you want to help, then donate your monies towards whoever you think deserves it most. And work on becoming wealthy, because then you can make more of a difference..

Donating money isn't a solution nor, I agree, is setting a wage floor - I was using that as an analogy for improving conditions. Really what needs to happen is societal change which can take a long time (or not).
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post #56 of 141
These people will be singing a different tune when the iPhone 5 doesn't ship for another three years because apple has to build production facilities outside of china and it winds up costing hundreds more.
 
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post #57 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by blupupher View Post

These same 40,000 will buy the new iPhone when it comes out, even if it is wrapped in the skin of these poor workers.
.

funny. thanks, it gave me a great line to "steal".
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post #58 of 141
too be honest i don't care about those fobs
oh wait, guess there not fobs if there working in their own country...
i'd still buy there stuff anyways
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post #59 of 141
What if I demand the unethical iPhone 5?
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post #60 of 141
I think I figured out the iPhone design algorithm; help me fix syntax please, in first year comp sci tongue.gif
Code:
public class iPhone implements Apple{... //constructors not shown
 private static final double productionCost=150.00;
 public static double calcProfitForNextGen(int input){
  int gen = input;
  double price=200.00
  if (Apple.alive==true && Apple.demand==true){
      price+=50.00;
      gen++;
      Apple.consumers+=500000;
  }
  return price*Apple.consumers-productionCost();
 }
}

Edited by SprayN'Pray - 2/1/12 at 11:07pm
    
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