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WOW, I Defraged my SSD; not for speed - Page 3  

post #21 of 67
The nature of solid state storage means the blocks of data are written 'randomly' across the Flash Cells. There is no logical placement like there is with a HDD. Therefore the file system is already written to the SSD in what some people call a 'Fragmented' state, but this is infact how SSD's operate. Defragging the drive will not do anything seeing as writes will just be randomly placed by the drives controller.

A mechanical HDD benefits from a 'non-fragmented' file system because the head has to move to read the blocks, so it would make more sense if the blocks are in order so the head doesn't go jumping back and forth.
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post #22 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeteck View Post

When you do, you will be BLOWN away on how freakin fast it will go!!

No. You're experiencing a placebo, or some other underlying cause.

Fragmentation for SSD's is GOOD. SSD's want to be fragmented as it spreads the data over more cells, and the more cells the data is spread over, the more channels it can read from at once. By fragmenting, your putting all the data onto a small number of cells, severely restricting the amount of channels it can read data from at once.
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post #23 of 67
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

You mean subjective experience.... Correlation on a small sample does not equal causation.
Intel, LSI, Samsung, Toshiba, etc have guys who design and do this for a living.

That is true, however can you provide me with documentation from either of those manufactures that defragging is prohibited ? and I'm not talking Tom hardware guide posting it. I want to see good hard evidence that this should never be done...
    
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post #24 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeteck View Post

Its called practical experience, and when you see a bad SSD get repaired by defraging you want to share that with the rest of the world... Once you see it fix a bad drive, you'll think twice about not doing it...rolleyes.gif

May I ask on how many different models of SSD you have tested this on?

Also, with all the different types of software & hardware out there today, I believe it is impossible for one person to know everything there is
to know......Isn't that why we are all here?
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post #25 of 67
I got my MCSE and MCSA, Passed my A+ ... I've noticed my SSD is starting to run like a potato so im going to try and defrag.. if it messes it up, then I will hold £80 to your name, if it makes things better, then I will thank you.

but from my own knowledge SSD's dont need to be defragged..
 
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post #26 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Being in the computer industry does not mean you know how subsystem work....
I highly doubt you seen even close to every known problem related to the PC. How much concurrency issues have you worked on? Have you dealt with 10GbE? Server migrations? Distributed processing?
A+ certified means you can diagnosis and fix high-level computer problems. It means nothing on design, architecture, or implementation. In addition, is A+ even updated for SSDs yet?

Thats right... i run my own computer company to.
Specialty builds and repairs.

Gives you alot of knowledge about consumer based computer electronics but doesnt teach you anything about business/enterprise systems and/or how things really work.
My other job as field engineer/technician for railway safety electronics [fail safe principle's] teach me alot more about electronics then beeing busy with consumer computers.

Having sayed that i do think you should be easy on the OP.
He just told us something he had experienced and wanted to share it with us... nothing wrong with that.. even if his findings are wrong.
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post #27 of 67
Auslogics disk defrag doesn't even defrag SSDs... it ignores them completely...

If you really feel like defragging an SSD, use MyDefrag as it has a special method for flash disks but I would argue against it completely if you would read DuckieHo's post. SSDs are supposed to fragment, that's how they equally wear out the NAND cells. Not only that but the OS doesn't actually see where the files are truly located.

Also, A+ doesn't mean anything. Pretty much everyone on this forum can easily get one. It's a $200-300 worthless piece of paper.
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post #28 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by DuckieHo View Post

Fragmentation has nothing to do with file corruption since there the mappings are maintained on a lookup table.

I was thinking about this, there have been a few anecdotal cases of fragmentation causing file corruption when I did a quick google search of it. Whilst most of these are probably due to other causes I was thinking that fragmetation might make file corruption more likely on mechanical HDDs.

Thinking aloud, but to read and write to a HDD the head has to move rapidly to access the data. Every time it moves there is a chance, albeit very small, that it might overshoot it's intended position. If the file is heavily fragmented then the head will have to repeatedly move to different locations, increasing the change of "missing" the sector it is supposed to read or write to. This, if it happened, would lead to data corruption.

Agian, this is just a thought, please correct me if I am wrong as I have no idea how the head position and physical write location is controlled. And still, this is for mechanical drives only, not SSDs.

With modern SSDs traditional defrag will do nothing at best. OP, what model was the SSD? What controller?
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post #29 of 67
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joeteck View Post

That is true, however can you provide me with documentation from either of those manufactures that defragging is prohibited ? and I'm not talking Tom hardware guide posting it. I want to see good hard evidence that this should never be done...

http://www.intel.com/support/ssdc/hpssd/sb/CS-029623.htm#5
Quote:
Do I need to defragment my Intel® Mainstream Solid-State Drive (using Windows* Disk Defragmenter* or similar program)?
No. SSD devices, unlike traditional HDDs, see no performance benefit from traditional HDD defragmentation tools. Disable any automatic or scheduled defragmentation utilities for your Intel SSD. Using these tools simply adds unnecessary wear to the SSD.
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post #30 of 67
actually, I take that back, aint doing it... dont want to wear down my Agility 3 even if it is running like a potato.. anyway to speed it up?
 
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