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Ivy bridge worth it (I know there are a million threads, some things to consider though)

Poll Results: Is Ivy Bridge Primarily about marketing and not developing better tech (be honest tehe) :

 
  • 16% (1)
    Yes.
  • 83% (5)
    Nope.
6 Total Votes  
post #1 of 12
Thread Starter 
So here's some things I am considering- firstly this all starts from a q6600 upgrade (so mobo and cpu).

I just read this:
http://www.dailytech.com/Report+Mass+Launch+of+22+nm+Ivy+Bridge+CPUs+is+Delayed+Until+June/article24022.htm

And I have been reading articles for the past week or two all about Ivy bridge... similar in nature to the above read - some more tech detailed some not...

It would seem that Ivy Bridge really isn't going to be "all that great" I mean- in comparison to an i5 we aren't really looking at much of a performance increase (generally sources say between 5% and 20%). - this (IMO) means nothing... they could say that about anything... its a very BROAD statistic- what do they really mean, 20% increase in processing power *** When using notepad.exe smile.gif ??? Or perhaps do they mean that its a 20% increase in power *** In regard to video processing or graphics processing... (which leads me to the next point):

For Intel this is primarily about integrated graphics. Simplicity for major companies like Dell, HP, etc to be able to slap in a single processor and have it handle HD video for the mainstream users. - Id expect it would play some basic games like "WoW" too ... A MAJOR selling point- that simultaneously reduces manufacturing costs (simpler motherboards, no need for other on board graphics/video processing).

Next there is power consumption- those same major companies are always trying to find ways to make their laptops (and their desktops) less power hungry- because this sells better. Ivy Bridge boasts fairly substantial power usage reductions- while this is useful for just about anyone does it really make a difference to those of us running our computers constantly? - Intel suggests between 65-77 watts - this is an 18-30 watt decrease, so do the math, we are talking (depending on your electricity costs of course) probably between 10 and 15 cents a day different.

As for overclocking - other than some marginally lower temperatures I don't think (as this is purely an opinion) the 22nm design is going to stand up to much higher overclocking numbers any more than current sandy bridge line will... the design is MOSTLY the same as we've seen Intel do these die shrinks plenty of times before.

From a marketing standpoint Ivy Bridge is NOT focused on enthusiasts, it is NOT focused on the power hungry folders, and gamers.
It is however focused on money. - Money for Intel, money for any major company who sells computers. History repeats it self again- Intel has some excellent Flux Capacitors.

Again this is mostly IMHO - based on what I have gathered from reading around the net and on the forums. I wanted to see who agrees with me here to confirm that I am not crazy smile.gif
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post #2 of 12
I would think it depends on your situation. For some people it might be worth it to get, other's might not see the price worth it. It all come's down to what your going to use it for.
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post #3 of 12
I guess the smaller manufacturing process will probably appeal to those looking at getting mATX builds, where thermals are more important. tongue.gif
So yeah, I does depend on your own personal situation.
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post #4 of 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by ponywithaids View Post

I guess the smaller manufacturing process will probably appeal to those looking at getting mATX builds, where thermals are more important. tongue.gif

Thermals are definitely not that much of an issue with mATX nowadays. Mini-ITX on the other hand can be a thermal nightmare.

The people who will see the biggest gains from Ivy will be the people that use integrated Intel graphics. (In a couple of months I could be one of them redface.gif )

To be fair the current Intel HD 3000 IGP actually performs admirably in low-end games like League of Legends and WoW. I can play with High settings in LoL, and at 1080P. With substantial improvements in the IB iGPU we might see Intel carving out a chunk of the entry-level GPU segment occupied by the likes of the GeForce GT 520 and Radeon HD 6450.
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post #5 of 12
Probably just going to have to wait and see if it will be worth it or not.
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post #6 of 12
Thread Starter 
I guess one major thing for me is that we KNOW the i5 2500k is a trustworthy stable processor... is it worth waiting for 6 months to only buy something we don't know about ...
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post #7 of 12
Hardly a marketing ploy imo. It's a die shrink, same architecture just more power efficient; using less power for the same clock, plus graphics improvements that would be fairly noticeable for anyone relying on the iGPU or utilizing QuickSync.

I mean, coming from a C2Q, going to a Ivy i5, the performance gain would be fairly substantial; just going from the architectural improvements from Kentsfield to Sb, and then add the higher clocks, improved memory performance, and lower power draw. You could upgrade to a cheaper SB system when Ivy is released, or have slightly better performance at slightly lower power for the same price as current SB chips.

As for the power reductions, 10-15cents per day, adds up quite quickly; that's roughly $4.20 a month or $50 a year. At stock, that chip should last at least 5years, that's saving you $200 over the course of its life. Might not seem like much, but for some, that's very much worth it; plus, depending on how much Intel reduces the pricing on SB chips, it just might make more sense to go Ivy..

Overclocking, theoretically, Ivy would clock just as good as SB; smaller process but lower power and heat, then there's the possibility of it OC'n better, due the reduced power draw, and heat output.

If you already have SB, upgrading to Ivy wouldn't really be worth it; from that angle it could seem like a marketing ploy, unless you want to be on the cutting edge. But, since adopting the tick-tock cycle, it's nothing new; new architecture > shrink it, make it a little better > rinse and repeat. I fail to see how its a marketing ploy.
post #8 of 12
Thread Starter 
I don't mean "marketing ploy" i mean that its just more focused on making money via the big manufacturers- its not really aimed at the tech savvy or diy'ers. And for this reason I wonder if its worth waiting for.

I am trying to decide really if I want to wait till june-july for an IB setup or just spend the same money now and get a 2500k...

I suppose I could always upgrade later if its really that good but I am wondering if I would feel bad then (when IB comes out) once I get a SB.
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post #9 of 12
PCGuru,

I mean no disrespect, but I think you should look at this a bit more altruistically, and consider what this does for the industry, for the world, for the USA and for Intel. The Tri-gate transistor Intel rolled out, which is what the next generation Ivy Bridge will be based on, is a scientific breakthrough and a major leap forward in transistor design. The advantages are numerous, but the vitals are reduced power consumption by about 50% and ability to make a denser chip with about 37% more processing power. To the industry, to Intel and to the USA, this is crucial because of the market threat from ARM (UK based), and because of the continued march toward smaller, more powerful mobile platforms.

The Tri-gate transistor design turns the transistor upright, and puts a metal gate around 3 sides. This manages to minimize (almost completely eliminates) power bleed, so when a transistor is open it consumes virtually no power at all. That allows Tri-gate transistors to run cooler, consume less power, and be more efficient. In turn, that allows Intel to manufacture smaller transistors, which can be packed more densely, contributing to increased performance, while consuming less power. That in turn means you can build smaller things, like smart phones, laptops, ultrabooks, etc. that last longer on a charge, and can do more.

This is basically Moore's law in action. Chip fabrication is getting to a point where it is approaching molecular level in terms of size. The current Sandy Bridge chips are 32nm. To put that into perspective, consider that more than 60 million 32nm transistors could fit onto the head of a pin, or that a 32nm transistor contains gates that are so small you could fit 3,000 of them across the width of a human hair. That is incredibly small, but Intel Ivy Bridge will be 22nm this year, 14nm in another year or so, and probably less than 10nm by 2015. Micron has already started producing 20nm NAND flash chips, so the race to get smaller and smaller will continue unabated for a while. But there are limits to how far it can go simply because once you get near the size of single molecule you can't hold stuff together. At some point you either stop trying to make it smaller, or you have break through the molecular structure and get down to the atomic level. This is one of the things that threatens Moore's law, and one of the reasons why advanced labs at IBM and such have been focused on organic and crystaline research for several years. It is likely that in 10-20 years from now the silicon based microchip will likely become obsolete and be replaced with something organic.

Now, you may not find it necessary to upgrade your Sandy Bridge to an Ivy Bridge just yet, the difference in performance may be too small to justify the cost, for now. But who on this forum wouldn't appreciate say 20 degrees C less heat under load, or 20% reduction in power consumption? In another year, maybe two, you could be running 8 processors in the space of one Sandy Bridge chip, and still able to cool it sufficiently with a $24 Hyper 212. But there are a lot of other applications that will absolutely benefit from this improvement today, and it could save Intel X86 architecture from being obsoleted by ARM designs. I believe there is already an X86 based phone destined for commercial release in mid-2012, which will prove that X86 architecture is viable in smart phones, and could create an interesting race. As typical of Intel, and why Intel has managed to be so successful in PCs, their ability to consolidate technologies onto the chip and make other ancillary chips obsolete is nothing short of remarkable. An Intel processor today incorporates sound, video, math, even wireless (on mobile) and so on, all of which were add-ons and more inefficient than on-die designs. Consider what Intel might be able to do in the smartphone industry if they bring that kind of innovation, drive and know-how.

I understand some of these Intel initiatives are not so popular on these forums, particularly for modders who like to tweak and adjust. But we only represent a tiny fraction of the consumer market, which is in the billions when you realize that Intel's fastest growing and largest market is in China and India. Again, no disrespect intended towards anyone, but I laud Intel for their continued innovation. They may not be perfect, and yeah marketing and bean-counters are a pain in the rear, but Ivy Bridge is a vital step forward in many ways.
post #10 of 12
Thread Starter 
Thanks very much, this is exactly the sort of response I was looking for, something to show me that Intel is not purely sucked into the corporate schema-... I guess the "tick tock" system bothers me but you are dead on about technological advancements, I agree that intel has made some major steps forward.

I guess my focus is really more on whether or not we can expect this "new generation" of tech. to be as stable and promising for the overclocking/gaming community as previous designs have been.

When I see things like "1.4 billion" transistors- I get worried about things breaking smile.gif
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Not So Tiny Ivy
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