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Building a subwoofer. - Page 3

post #21 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by mdocod View Post

What? You're mistaken/confused. Bass performance is a function of displacement and box gain. The low Vas car sub needs a more sophisticated box to reach the same levels of box gain that are common in home sub designs, but there is nothing inherent about a "car sub" that forces the driver into some lower echelon of performance class. The same rules apply regardless of whether the driver is sold as a "home" or "car" or "pro sound" sub.

If I'm mistaken/confused, at least I'm not the only one. Drivers intended for car use will typically have different T/S parameters than those designed for home use, since the design goals are different. The people at diysubwoofers.org seem to be making the same faulty assumption as me.

I never placed any category of drivers in a lower echelon, but the design criteria of car or pro drivers are not the same as those of home ones. Car audio drivers may have a lower Q and higher Fs, while pro drivers would emphasize output over distortion. As you said, the same rules apply regardless of the type of driver, but the desired outcome is not always the same. Ideally, you'd want the home subwoofer to begin rolling off at a lower frequency than the one for car, which would require a different box for the same driver. You mention the more sophisticated box, but why start with a driver that places those constraints on the design in the first place?

This may not be the best analogy, but you can also use a server grade processor in a gaming desktop. However, that doesn't mean it's the best choice, when taking all factors into account, since you will either get less performance at a similar price point or pay significantly more money.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BugBash View Post

Dude,
The youtube link I posted just up there ^^ The Kraken, That is designed to be driven by two JBL 12" CAR SUBWOOFERS
If you take a look at the lower link, you will see this monster is capable of 135db @20Hz (Trust me, not much is capable of THAT!)
the plans are there to build your own.

I wouldn't mind knowing that my subwoofer is theoretically capable of doing 135 dB @ 20 Hz, but I don't see why anyone who values their hearing would want to play something that loud at home.
     
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post #22 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChaoticKinesis View Post

If I'm mistaken/confused, at least I'm not the only one. Drivers intended for car use will typically have different T/S parameters than those designed for home use, since the design goals are different.

T/S parameters for all "classes" of subs tend to be all over the map. There's an enormous amount of grey area and overlap from drivers marketed to home/car/pro sound, and ample opportunity to utilise drivers from any of those markets in any other markets. There do tend to be trends in characteristics for each grouping of drivers, however, those trends can be taken advantage of with different box designs for nearly any application.
Quote:
but the design criteria of car or pro drivers are not the same as those of home ones. Car audio drivers may have a lower Q and higher Fs, while pro drivers would emphasize output over distortion.

A car audio driver will generally have low Vas and Low Fs (heavy rigid cone), Qts and Xmax will be functions of how much money is spent on motor structure. Many woofers sold as car subs deviate from this and are actually just cheap woofers with bright colors. The low Vas of the "ideal" car sub can be taken advantage of, allowing the construction of practically sized horns and transmission lines- which may outperform some home/pro subs [depending on characteristics] in similarly sized vented enclosures.
Quote:
As you said, the same rules apply regardless of the type of driver, but the desired outcome is not always the same.

Box design can change the entire scope of a woofers application.
Quote:
You mention the more sophisticated box, but why start with a driver that places those constraints on the design in the first place?

Every driver has the option of a simple or sophisticated box. The larger and more sophisticated, generally, the more efficiency and maximum output. The low Vas car sub can often make the sophisticated box design fall into a size class that is more practical. The sophisticated box can often eek out many dB gain that the simple box will not.
Quote:
This may not be the best analogy, but you can also use a server grade processor in a gaming desktop. However, that doesn't mean it's the best choice, when taking all factors into account, since you will either get less performance at a similar price point or pay significantly more money.

It's a good analogy, but what if I added to the analogous condition, a motherboard that had a hardware thread management system that could divide single threaded tasks across many CPU cores with no noteworthy latency issues? That is the sort of "trick" that can be played with box design.

I'm not saying that car subs are better or worse, just that nearly any woofer can be made to meet nearly any goals with the proper box/horn alignment. Heck, a 6" pro-sound driver with 3mm Xmax can play 30hz at nearly 120dB if you give it a large enough horn.

Regards,
Eric
Edited by mdocod - 4/11/12 at 6:38am
     
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