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A bit help with non-functional component but which one?

post #1 of 6
Thread Starter 
Not quite sure if I'm putting it in the right place, but this is the closest I come to it.

--- Skip to end to read the long story short---

I brought a friend's functional Shuttle K45 with Intel's E2160 (a Pentium dual-core listed as compatible) with integrated graphic and it work fine when I turn it on and checking it at out at first. But I had to remove the aftermarket CPU fan/heatsink and put in a smaller one. It was a pain and it might've involve a screwdriver , a hammer and some force *cough* and eventually with all of that, I'd simply remove the motherboard and installed it with it taken out.

Of course, it'll turn on...power supply seem to be working as it'll power my fan and 2 HD that was maxing out around 70w with a kill-a-watt. But no monitor screen, it's detecting it since if I unhook it, it'll say "no signal" and etc. It's just in energy saving mode, for the monitor. I went and brought myself a new graphic card and nothing change. Than, I swap one of the ram and villa! It work...for the FreeNas installed and than after 2-3 restart, it stopped with it hanging at the hard drive list, than after an another restart at the memory and than finally at the CPU post. And than, blank screen again.

Mind you, this was on a integrated graphic so I deducted it wasn't a graphic error as it work with an integrated after I screw up. And it wasn't ram since I brought myself an another set of ram and pop them in from every angle and slot there is at every combination. I remove the Hard drive, everything but the ram and CPU and nothing change. Eventually, I went and brought myself a non-supported intel Celeron E3300 (though it was still a 775 socket and dual core..) and ya. Nothing too. I'd notice that both of them would heat up if I place my hand on it for 5-10 seconds after starting the computer before i turn it off again to check if it was giving power to the CPU. Pin looks alright. The funny part is that there's several spot on the golden contact on the Intel E2160 that I got from friend, maybe it wasn't there before and happen afterward? I don't know.

So, it wasn't the graphic card, hard drive, ram. I can say it's either motherboard, CPU or the PSU. I'm having half a mind to hook it up to my main system and plug it in to check if it's PSU but that'll be even more time wasted... The CPU warms up when booting up, both of them that I checked. The only thing that I haven't check is the motherboard since finding one for that low is pretty hard.

So...

Long story short.

Non-functional K45 as in no post, no beep since I don't think there's case speaker, with functional graphic, RAM, hard drive (on my main desktop now) and possibility PSU. Worry about the CPU and motherboard as there's a few spot under gold contact on the CPU though not sure if it was before or after it stop working. I also attempt it with an another functional CPU and it didn't work as well. Both CPU heats up when turn on when I touch it for 5-10 seconds initially. Does that rule out a CPU and left me with the bad motherboard?

I'd reset the bios, flash the cmos battery, as well as the jumper Tested with just ram, cpu and motherboard, nothing as well.

So...anyone have any clue?And my best course of action is?
post #2 of 6
There's the possibility that you broke something with all the force you said you used. With discolored pads on the CPU, perhaps the pins weren't making good contact, thus shorting something out or burning out some pins. Whenever such a problem happens (narrowed down to mobo or CPU), IMO it is 90% chance the problem lies in the motherboard, not the CPU.

In fact, with a Shuttle K45, I'd say chances are good it is the motherboard. You should web search to see if ITX motherboards will fit. Most Shuttle cases won't fit ITX without mods, but I think the K45 can.
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Main home rig
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Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Intel 330 240GB SSD, Crucial M4 256GB mSATA SSD... Samsung DVDRW CoolIt Eco Windows 7 Home Premium x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung 305T Plus, Dell 2005FPW Cooler Master QuickFire Pro mechanical keyboard Rosewill Capstone 450W Lian Li PC-Q11B 
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post #3 of 6
Thread Starter 
Thanks for the reply.

How long do you think it'll take for the discolored spots to appear? I used an another unsupported CPU but it left no discolored pads though it did warm up a bit after leaving it on there for maybe 10-15 seconds being turned on. I'm sorta hoping it isn' the cpu too, but buying a mini-itx board would set me back around $50-60 to check if it's actually the motherboard or not. And of course, I would have to buy ram now cause the K45 Mobo uses PC5300 which I got 2 stick of already.

I'm pretty sure the K45 case can accept any mini-ITX motherboard since it has the traditional screw placement, but they simply added extra length to it, I hope.

All of this for a $25 barebone that I got as a hobby project for freenas drive but now thinking of turning into a HTPC but for standard video rather than any sort of HD. Of course, I was also thinking of buying an intel atom motherboard and put it in, but it has it's issue with playing videos, I assume. Checking the performance of the CPU I got now vs the atom along with its GPU seem like a downgrade though it'll be great on the 100watt PSU.

Anyway, thanks for your view. I think I'm going to leave it in my closet until I figure out what to do about it. Maybe a socket 775 mini-itx will appear for cheaper than $40-50 and support my DDR2 4200. But other than that, I think spending a week along with $30 additional bucks on something that haven't given any result yet is the most disappointing part of this whole experience.

Sam
post #4 of 6
Thread Starter 
Quick Question on the end if anyone wanna quickly answer:

I brought myself a new motherboard, it took me around 2-3 hours for various troubleshooting on it.

I hook up the PSU with the mobo, and cpu. At first, I turned it on using the case's power button but later done it manually with shorting it.

What happen? It turn off and on and rinse and repeat while the CPU get progressively hotter until I shut it down within 10 seconds. Obviously, nothing appear on the screen. Than I took out my main desktop's power supply and done the same thing, and it done the same thing. So, It wasn't the PSU that's causing the continuous on and off. Than I went and remove the CPU and try it again but the connector still hook up. ON! Nothing appear on screen, since there's no CPU.

As for RAM, it didn't matter I just happen to didn't see that the mobo that I brought was for DDR2 6400 and 5300 and not 4200...but I put it in to try and didn't affect anything.

Short Version:
PSU+CPU+MOBO = Off and On
PSU+MOBO= On
New PSU + CPU + MOBO = Off and On
New PSU + MOBO = On

So...I can conclude the CPU"s dead based on the discoloration and the off and on cycle. But what damage the CPU? I assume it was the motherboard when I forced it earlier the week as the new CPU that I brought to try didn't work as intended. So...dead mobo and CPU. But the shuttle k45 is still a mini-itx, and the PSU seem to work along with the on/off switch as well. So...

I think I'm going to go and buy myself a used mini-itx intel atom or a cheap motherboard/cpu combo for cheap. Might as well make it a file server as I intended, or a torrentbox. Not much chance for a media center, that's for sure!

----
Quick question
If I make it a torrentbox/file server, It'll be hook up to my network by cable from my router which is connected to my desktop. If I stream the contents of the file, say a 1080p video, would the processing power (or GPU) of my desktop be the main factor as to be able to play it? I wanna make sure I can stream it and watch something like that, I'm assuming transfer speed/streaming speed won't be a issue. If anyone know, thanks.


Sam
post #5 of 6
Question for you - are you powering this on without a heatsink on the CPU?

Motherboards won't run without CPU.

For the most part "streaming" is just a fancy term for file sharing media. In some instances there can be some real-time transcoding going on which may require some heavy CPU lifting on the server, but if your playback machine is a Windows box that you would just be browsing to the shared folder on the server and clicking on a file to play, the server is just file sharing and the playback machine has to be able to handle the video.

1080P is usually not possible on an Atom machine with rare exceptions. If you have a GPU (or Atom with ION or ION2) then you may be able to use GPU acceleration, depending on your software player, the codec used, how the media file was encoded. If all that sounds Greek to you, then it won't work for you. You will need something faster than a netbook CPU. Your E2160 and E3300 can do the job, but you would still have to find working motherboards, etc. While I commend you for trying to recycle old gear and troubleshooting it, I'm thinking it may be a case of throwing good money after bad. I would actually recommend a Celeron G530 CPU (runs around $50) with a socket 1155 mini ITX motherboard (cheapest starts at $50) and some cheap DDR3 (cheapest starts under $20). Basically for $120 you can have the latest platform that outperforms your old ones while using a fraction of the power, can be upgraded with the latest CPUs and the cheapest as well as fastest RAM on the market.
Main home rig
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CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i5-3570K ASRock Z77E-ITX GeForce GTX 670 8GB Samsung DDR3 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Intel 330 240GB SSD, Crucial M4 256GB mSATA SSD... Samsung DVDRW CoolIt Eco Windows 7 Home Premium x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung 305T Plus, Dell 2005FPW Cooler Master QuickFire Pro mechanical keyboard Rosewill Capstone 450W Lian Li PC-Q11B 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Logitech MX518 Allsop Metal Onkyo TX-SR505 receiver, Polk bookshelf speaker... 
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Main home rig
(15 items)
 
  
CPUMotherboardGraphicsRAM
Core i5-3570K ASRock Z77E-ITX GeForce GTX 670 8GB Samsung DDR3 
Hard DriveOptical DriveCoolingOS
Intel 330 240GB SSD, Crucial M4 256GB mSATA SSD... Samsung DVDRW CoolIt Eco Windows 7 Home Premium x64 
MonitorKeyboardPowerCase
Samsung 305T Plus, Dell 2005FPW Cooler Master QuickFire Pro mechanical keyboard Rosewill Capstone 450W Lian Li PC-Q11B 
MouseMouse PadAudio
Logitech MX518 Allsop Metal Onkyo TX-SR505 receiver, Polk bookshelf speaker... 
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post #6 of 6
Thread Starter 
Honestly, I wasn't actually powering that on with a heatsink at first. It was relatively annoying to installed the heatsink without taking it out on the old PC so I didn't bother when putting on the old mobo but I did somewhat when trying on the new mobo. Somewhat in that I'd place it on top so the CPU and heatsink contact and it'll transfer the heat away (though I had to make sure it actually contact) though no paste was use nor fan. I didn't think that as a big issue since neither time when i turn it on did it last longer than warm enough to be uncomfortable.

What do you mean 1080p is usually not possible on an atom machine? I'm not trying to play it on the small pc but I'm basing it on what you describe on your first paragraph with file sharing. I don't think I wanna spent the money with a ION GPU nor a relatively powerful atom. I'm sort what cheap, haha. I don't have big aspiration for even playing even 720p on the server if necessary, it's more like standard definition instead. I'm an anime fan, so CCCP all the way and given that it's linux, I don't think it'll be great with watching video on the server. Haha. Well, I didn't have much good experience with it on my netbook.

Chances are it's gonna be a linux server with me playing videos on my main windows 7 desktop. It's more for energy efficient since I wanted it on 24/7 for torrentbox and file sharing. I thought about upgradable for a bit more expense but I'd decided to go with just cheap and use what I got at the moment to do minimize the loss. If I decide to do what you recommend, and the spec is somewhat similar to the old system in term of power consumption, I'm afraid that my tiny 100watt PSU will run into trouble when dealing with that along with 2x 3.5" 2TB as well as additional fan if it gets too hot. With just the PSU and Mobo, it was at 10-15watt, when the system was 'working' with a 3.5" 2TB along with a 120gb 2.5" sata drive, it was drawing around 70watts after post. I'm afraid that the initial spinup of the hard drive with 2x2TB would exceed the 100watt limit and blow something. And of course, that's $120 with $50 for an another case and PSU. Mind you, this is the assumption that I'm thinking the tiny PSU won't be able to handle it.

So far, most of my computer last around 3 years before dying out (at least my last 2 desktop had) and it's almost alway the mobo. Well that's what I assume since I didn't exactly try to troubleshoot them when It happen. So, cheap and using whatever resource I got is probably easier on my conscious. But I am thankful for your thoughtful consideration and answering my question. I hope you can answer the question I pop at the 2nd paragraph.

Thanks!
Sam
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