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SATA vs SATA2 vs SATA3 - Page 2

post #11 of 22
For HDDs, you don't need more than SATA2, you only really need SATA3 for an SSD or the SSD cached drives like the Seagate Momentus. It's possible that Deskstar will exceed the speed limits of SATA2 on occasion, but it won't be often enough to worry about.
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post #12 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarshallRA View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by GanjaSMK View Post

SATA is going to be limited to 150GB/s.
SATA2 is going to be limited to 300GB/s.
SATA3 is going to be limited to 600GB/s.
So if you have an array that is capable (say 4x500GB or more) of maximizing a sustained rate of X, then you will be limited to the SATA controller's capabilities (SATA 150, 300, or 600 ie; SATA, SATA2, SATA3).
Otherwise with single drives or non-high performance RAID setups, you will experience no real-world bottlenecks unless you're in the SSD world where the controller will and can make a big difference.

MB/s, not GB/s.

Even if its MB/s, that is still wrong. It should be Mb/s, see the difference?
Sata 3 is rated at 6 gigabits per second. Gigabit not gigabyte.
1 byte = 8bits
post #13 of 22
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

Not really, only in burst speeds.
No, they are just making the transition to the connection now before higher platter densities allow for faster speeds.

Okei but what aspects do You look in HDD to know that?
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post #14 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

Not really, only in burst speeds.
No, they are just making the transition to the connection now before higher platter densities allow for faster speeds.

Okei but what aspects do You look in HDD to know that? [/quote]

RPM, latency and cache, i think?
Edited by ghostrider85 - 2/28/12 at 1:25pm
post #15 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by johhu12 View Post

So if I have this HDD: http://www.hitachigst.com/deskstar-7k1000d will it benefit from SATA2? And so SATA3 HDD's are just marketing stunts right?

Perfect. As Stub said, Sata 1 and 2 are more for HDD's, while Sata3 is more SSD based. I have a few sata 3 HDD's, they work just fine but moving from sata 2-3 give's no speed boost or better performance. SSD's and sata 3= mind blown
Edited by KhaoticKomputing - 2/28/12 at 1:32pm
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post #16 of 22
can depend on the need, in a NAS server there is very little difference between 5400rpm drive and 7200rpm drives as an example..

For PC uses IIRC burst speeds come from data stored in the cache being sent, so you would expect a larger cache will have an effect. and RPM smile.gif
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post #17 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostrider85 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sean Webster View Post

Not really, only in burst speeds.
No, they are just making the transition to the connection now before higher platter densities allow for faster speeds.

Okei but what aspects do You look in HDD to know that?
Quote:
RPM, latency and cache, i think?

Also some drives better handle multi threads than others. This can help immensely in certain areas. WD1000FALS (the earlier ones, 00Y6A0) fell flat on their face after more than a single thread compared to the Seagate drives out at the same time (2008/2009?).
    
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post #18 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by allikat View Post

For HDDs, you don't need more than SATA2, you only really need SATA3 for an SSD or the SSD cached drives like the Seagate Momentus. It's possible that Deskstar will exceed the speed limits of SATA2 on occasion, but it won't be often enough to worry about.
The Momentus XT uses a single SLC NAND chip. The 500GB model maxes out at around 100MB/sec, and the 750GB model maxes out at around 190MB/sec. (Actually, a bit lower)

SATA2 is overkill for one of those. I think that's why they are SATA2 rather than SATA3? It's not like the XT is a SATA3 SSD, which has at the minimum 8 NAND chips. (All capable of those speeds)

Btw, SATA bandwidth is per-channel/port. Although some controllers are limited by their link to the CPU, the newer AMD boards can push through around 2GB/sec
---> http://www.overclock.net/t/1091002/sb850-max-throughput-benchmarks

That's enough for 3-4 SATA3 SSDs in RAID-0!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ghostrider85 View Post


Okei but what aspects do You look in HDD to know that?

RPM, latency and cache, i think?

Sequential speeds, access times, RPM.

RPM doesn't affect much, but higher RPM drives also have more aggressive seeking. Technically you could make a 5400RPM drive that seeked only a few miliseconds slower than Raptors (~6ms), but they don't want to do that. Manufacturers tune the drive to whatever speed they want, and use the RPM as a marketing stat which reveals some of the performance characteristics of the drive.

It's pretty obvious that RPM doesn't matter when you can get a 5400RPM Seagate laptop drive with 17.2ms access times, 7200RPM Seagate laptop drive with 17.2ms access times, and a 5400RPM WD Green 2TB (WD20EARX) with 15ms access times. But that said, RPM usually goes hand in hand with access times. Most 5400RPM drives are closer to 20ms, most 7200RPM are closer to 13ms, and most 10k RPM drives are closer to 7ms.

Look at the access times and sequential speeds. If you divide 1000 by the access times, that gives you an IOPS (I/O's per second) figure for how many small reads/writes a drive can perform (on average) within a second. For a 5400RPM drive it might be 50-60 IOPS. For 7200RPM, 70-80 IOPS. For a 10k RPM Raptor, ~150IOPS. (three times faster than a Green) For an SSD it's probably between 2000 and 200,000, depending on the quality of your SSD controller.


Stuff like how well a drive deals with multitasking scenarios is unadvertised. At best you can comb over reviews/benchmarks to try to figure it out.
Edited by Kramy - 2/28/12 at 6:30pm
     
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post #19 of 22
so just to make sure with sata speeds are they per specific port or for the whole sata controller?
reason I ask is I have the built in ICH9R controller. with both my 4x250 setup with each drive capable of around 110-120mb/s max speed when all four are in use it seems to peak though around the 300mb/s mark. same thing with my new 2TB drives which do damn near 200mb/s max on their own but yet with 2 in raid zero I still get around the same 300 mb/s max speed out of them.

also are there any new features that have been included in sata 3 vs sata 2? I believe when they introduced sata 2 they introduced some extra things with it on top of speed but did they do the same with sata 3?
Edited by rx7speed - 2/29/12 at 12:28am
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post #20 of 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by rx7speed View Post

so just to make sure with sata speeds are they per specific port or for the whole sata controller?
reason I ask is I have the built in ICH9R controller. with both my 4x250 setup with each drive capable of around 110-120mb/s max speed when all four are in use it seems to peak though around the 300mb/s mark. same thing with my new 2TB drives which do damn near 200mb/s max on their own but yet with 2 in raid zero I still get around the same 300 mb/s max speed out of them.

also are there any new features that have been included in sata 3 vs sata 2? I believe when they introduced sata 2 they introduced some extra things with it on top of speed but did they do the same with sata 3?

Yes they did, read here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Serial_ATA

here are some:
Quote:
  • 6 Gbit/s for scalable performance
  • Continued compatibility with SAS, including SAS 6 Gbit/s. "A SAS domain may support attachment to and control of unmodified SATA devices connected directly into the SAS domain using the Serial ATA Tunneled Protocol (STP)" from the SATA_Revision_3_0_Gold specification.
  • Isochronous Native Command Queuing (NCQ) streaming command to enable isochronous quality of service data transfers for streaming digital content applications.
  • An NCQ Management feature that helps optimize performance by enabling host processing and management of outstanding NCQ commands.
  • Improved power management capabilities.
  • A small low insertion force (LIF) connector for more compact 1.8-inch storage devices.
  • A connector designed to accommodate 7 mm optical disk drives for thinner and lighter notebooks.
  • Alignment with the INCITS ATA8-ACS standard.
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