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Vista gaming will be 10 to 15 per cent slower than XP - Page 8  

post #71 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by apavlov13
...had MS lost that suit, you might have 3 different versions of Vista, all 20 times better than whats getting released now.
Or three ways of getting screwed over .
MS splitting up is not the end all solution, and may even compound the industry's current problems. The lessons we learned the hard way tell us that markets cannot always regulate themselves when faced with big upheavals.
In the end, evil empires are what drive society. What MS really needs is reform. It has the resources to change the world, it just needs the proper leadership, leadership that is more interested in technological innovation rather than filling their pockets.
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post #72 of 114
Microsoft code is so inefficient, they have to open up the Kernel and allow applications to access "ring 0" in order to have any reasonable performance. This has been THE single worst idea imaginable. It opens wide holes for memory leaking applications and virii/trojans.

In Vista, ring 0 is now closed. Even to anti-virus applications. It's going to take Microsoft some time to figure out how to improve code efficiency to compensate for the loss do to indirect access to the CPU and RAM.

FYI: Rings are Intel's method for partitioning RAM and adding levels of isolation between applications. Ring 0 being direct RAM addressing and CPU control. Ring 3 isolates the the applications from each other so much, that they only "see" the RAM that's been granted to them. Additionally, some CPU instructions are unavailable in Ring 3.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_mode <=good description
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post #73 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Higgins
Guys, the reason it is slower on our computers is because its a new OS that is pushing the hardware section to finally upgrade and move on. Vista is finally requiring more the 256 RAM, a crappy celeron, and a 80gig HD for a computer. Vista is pushing us into a new era of hardware. Dualcore required, 2gig RAM for midrange performance, super fast vid card. Im so glad that this is finally happening.

And another thing, usually when something requires something that isnt out yet to run correctly, ITS GOING TO RUN SLOWER ON STUFF THATS NOT GOOD ENOUGH. Mr. "i cant wait for Dx10... (next post) **** VISTA IS SO SLOW ON MY 7600 OMG SCREW M$"

Look at reality people we're testing vista on current gen hardware when the final product wont run on it, its for the better.

And BF2 runs fine in RC1 exept... It takes a while to start, and the grass and trees still have the block of green color around them as it is rendered in pre-DX10 mode... NFS MW runs great too.

Sorry if this post is sarcastic but i cant stand people who are arrogant and dont look at all the facts cough* \\/#49\\/ *cough.
Uhhh...okay.

Lets look at history. Many gamers used to dual-boot XP and Win98SE, because it had better performance than XP. Sure it had memory leaks and crashes!...but it also had significantly higher performance. Windows 2000 also has higher performance than XP. So...

Win98 -> Win2k = -10%
Win2k -> WinXP = -10%
WinXP -> Vista = -20%

Clue in...Microsoft just sucks at coding things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by selectodude
Wow, this has to be the dumbest post I've seen in awhile. I'm sending this to my friend.
Well put.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Remonster
I couldn't stand Linux but I REALLY miss using Ubuntu and looking at its task manager thing and seeing it only using like 50MB of RAM and ZERO pagefile that made me happy, now I look at Vista and I want to die. XP isn't that much better though, the Ubuntu team really has their **** in gear IMO.
Sweet! Even my Win2k uses 80MB RAM/Pagefile after being highly tweaked. 50MB is so low...

Quote:
Originally Posted by apavlov13
One more thing: for you guys who want some proof of the article in the Inquirer, AnandTech compared Vista RC1 to XP here.
OUCH!....yeah, I don't believe those figures will get much better either. nVidia and ATI are apparently able to make Aero over 100% more efficient by flipping to OpenGL....nVidia and ATI!
     
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post #74 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kramy
Uhhh...okay.

Lets look at history. Many gamers used to dual-boot XP and Win98SE, because it had better performance than XP. Sure it had memory leaks and crashes!...but it also had significantly higher performance. Windows 2000 also has higher performance than XP. So...

Win98 -> Win2k = -10%
Win2k -> WinXP = -10%
WinXP -> Vista = -20%

Clue in...Microsoft just sucks at coding things.


Well put.


Sweet! Even my Win2k uses 80MB RAM/Pagefile after being highly tweaked. 50MB is so low...


OUCH!....yeah, I don't believe those figures will get much better either. nVidia and ATI are apparently able to make Aero over 100% more efficient by flipping to OpenGL....nVidia and ATI!
RE: OPenGL and Aero: HAHAHA!!!!
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post #75 of 114
I for one am glad that Vista is pushing hardware capabilities. If it's like XP at all it will be around for another half a decade or more. XP running on common hardware when it was released is a bit like running vista on current hardware. It's called progress - ancient hardware should not cut it on new software - otherwise the software is not taking advantage of hardware advances. Maybe a dual-core and 2GB of RAM seems a bit excessive right now, but once Vista becomes mainstream we will have 4+ core CPU's and the typical RAM stick will be either 2 or 4 GB.

While the hardware requirements are a bit excessive ATM, Vista is made to run normally on current rigs - it's made to run normally on the rigs that will be mainstream when Vista is mainstream - in a year or so.
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post #76 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabidgnome229
I for one am glad that Vista is pushing hardware capabilities. If it's like XP at all it will be around for another half a decade or more. XP running on common hardware when it was released is a bit like running vista on current hardware. It's called progress - ancient hardware should not cut it on new software - otherwise the software is not taking advantage of hardware advances. Maybe a dual-core and 2GB of RAM seems a bit excessive right now, but once Vista becomes mainstream we will have 4+ core CPU's and the typical RAM stick will be either 2 or 4 GB.

While the hardware requirements are a bit excessive ATM, Vista is made to run normally on current rigs - it's made to run normally on the rigs that will be mainstream when Vista is mainstream - in a year or so.
Once again:

VISTA IS NOT REGULAR SOFTWARE. It's job is to run apps written for it as fast as it possibly can, while providing a UI for essential OS operations. When apps run slower on a new OS, something is very ****ed up.
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post #77 of 114
these technological transitions are nothing to do with consumer demand. They are about refreshing a global slow down in pc hardware/ software sales. They realise that most households have one or more pc's and they need to convince us that we really need to bin them, go out and buy the new technology. I seriously can't remember such a radical change, sure developments in games and software necessitated upgrades but nothing like what is being proposed with Vista and DX10.

Seriously what is there to gain ? a nicer desktop ?

Its like crossfire etc. I mean what the hell are you going to gain in return of a heavy bucks investment.

I will follow like a sheep but its not like I have a choice and frankly that stinks of tramps soiled pants
post #78 of 114
You nailed it.

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post #79 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by selectodude
VISTA IS NOT REGULAR SOFTWARE. It's job is to run apps written for it as fast as it possibly can, while providing a UI for essential OS operations. When apps run slower on a new OS, something is very ****ed up.
that's a very narrow view of an OS. an OS has to do a lot more than just allow app's to run - it is your window to the PC. everything that you do goes throught the it. even when you aren't manipulating your system directly through it, the OS is coordinating the dozens of processes that may be running, keeping up the network, ensuring security from within as well as without.

the OS is not a DOS prompt anymore. at any given time the single most complex piece of software that you have ever owned is the OS that you are running. the complexity demands system resources and vista reflects this - as did XP. the hardware that people are running vista on when they complain of lag is not cutting edge - it's a year or two old. would you want to be running xp on the hardware you had in '99?
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post #80 of 114
Quote:
Originally Posted by rabidgnome229
that's a very narrow view of an OS. an OS has to do a lot more than just allow app's to run - it is your window to the PC. everything that you do goes throught the it. even when you aren't manipulating your system directly through it, the OS is coordinating the dozens of processes that may be running, keeping up the network, ensuring security from within as well as without.

the OS is not a DOS prompt anymore. at any given time the single most complex piece of software that you have ever owned is the OS that you are running. the complexity demands system resources and vista reflects this - as did XP. the hardware that people are running vista on when they complain of lag is not cutting edge - it's a year or two old. would you want to be running xp on the hardware you had in '99?
I did, and it worked alright.

Why does each release of OS X and Linux run faster then the one before it, but Windows gets slower and slower?

You don't make an OS for the future, you make it run well on the computers it's going to be running on. OS X is coded for computers that have a 500MHz G4, and 4 3GHz Xeon cores. Linux can run on a 386 and the largest, most powerful computers in the world. Why can't Windows?
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