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[Various] NVIDIA GeForce GTX 680 Review: Retaking The Performance Crown - Page 81

post #801 of 880
Quote:
jesus men you are the biggest "loyalist" dude I have ever read

not even some Xbots in Gametrailers are so hardcore lol

Indd and after all his fanboyism and defending he is jumping ship to two 680s ^_^ and has made threads about 7970 crossfire issues and bf3 issues <3
post #802 of 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Projector View Post

Quote:
jesus men you are the biggest "loyalist" dude I have ever read
not even some Xbots in Gametrailers are so hardcore lol
Indd and after all his fanboyism and defending he is jumping ship to two 680s ^_^ and has made threads about 7970 crossfire issues and bf3 issues <3

Kid, you're the one with the AMD rig over there, so quit it with the hypocritical nonsense. I've told you SEVERAL times the reason I was having Tri-fire scaling issues was because of my P67 PCI-E bandwidth and my slower CPU (2500k). I've since upgraded to X79/3930k and I have 99% GPU usage on all 3 cards.

I'll have a P67 rig with 2 680s in SLI, and I'll be adding a 4th 7970 to my X79 rig, so give this 'loyalist' BS a rest.

The 7970 pulls ahead at higher resolutions and when both cards are overclocked. Why don't you have a look over at the 680 overclocking thread at all of the issues people are having? Even GoldenTiger himself can't OC his card 120mhz without having BSODs and crashes in games, meanwhile I'm able to OC ALL of my cards 300mhz, and 2 of them will OC 400mhz.

The 7970 has 3GB of VRAM, OCs WAY better due to proper vcore functionality without the need for hard modding, and even at stock is dead even with the 680 @ 1440p/1600p, which is what matters most to me. High resolution gaming is where it's at. Those of you content with 1080p gaming, go for the 680. Myself, I like to push the limits when I'm spending thousands on hardware, and the 7970 gives me more bang for the buck.

I can't even FIND a 680 to buy right now. I've only been able to order ONE so far and it was price gouged to the point that it was MORE expensive than the 7970. There are 680s being sold for over $600 due to the lack of supply. Those of you that can still stand behind Nvidia are the true 'loyalists', not I.
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post #803 of 880
*** hypocrtical?! I didnt say amd was bad I'm getting a 7970 lmao. Im saying that you are defending the 7970 and praising it in 680 threads then making threads on the side with terrible driver performance and bf3 performance and jumping ship so if anyone here is a hyprocrite its you.
Loyalist?! you are the one acting like it EVERY single 680 thread you are in saying "OH WELL MAX OC 7970>LIFE" . tongue.gif

Oh and its amazing once again I didnt put the 7970 down but there you are 3 paragraths on information defending it to someone you don't even know like my opinion on your purchase matters.
I dont know its so weird its like in society when the smallest person in a group has to be the loudest and prove themselves its the same with you 7970 owners you are in every thread trying to prove yourself to people that dont care, I hope i dont get like that when i get my 7970 tongue.gif
Edited by Projector - 3/27/12 at 1:03pm
post #804 of 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Projector View Post

*** hypocrtical?! I didnt say amd was bad I'm getting a 7970 lmao. Im saying that you are defending the 7970 and praising it in 680 threads then making threads on the side with terrible driver performance and bf3 performance and jumping ship so if anyone here is a hyprocrite its you.
Loyalist?! you are the one acting like it EVERY single 680 thread you are in saying "OH WELL MAX OC 7970>LIFE" . tongue.gif
Oh and its amazing once again I didnt put the 7970 down but there you are 3 paragraths on information defending it to someone you don't even know like my opinion on your purchase matters.
I dont know its so weird its like in society when the smallest person in a group has to be the loudest and prove themselves its the same with you 7970 owners you are in every thread trying to prove yourself to people that dont care, I hope i dont get like that when i get my 7970 tongue.gif

Do you not pay any attention to the text in threads and just rant aimlessly without any foundation or meaning?

I've already said 3+ times to you that the issues I was having with Battlefield 3 were because I was running THREE 7970s on a P67 chipset with a 2500k that wasn't providing enough power to keep my GPUs fed. As in, the GPUs were only @ 70% utilization, as opposed to 99% utilization when I switched to my current X79 rig with my 3930k. Perhaps you should've read the damn thread instead of rambling nonsense that doesn't pertain to anything.

I've also already told you that I also own a GTX 680 as well as my 3 7970s and will have TWO rigs with either of them in each, so obviously I'm not a fanboy of either. I just know the FACTS, and when I've personally tested the 680 OC'd vs my 7970 OC'd, the 7970 won... PERIOD. I tested using the same system, and using several games and synthetic benches. The only one where the 680 pulled ahead was 3dmark11, that's it. Perhaps in more Nvidia centric titles the story would be different, but not in Battlefield 3, Metro 2033, or Bad company 2.

The 680 is a great card that runs cool and has its own applications, but there is a reason the 7970 is more expensive and an all around larger 28nm, more power hungry card. That is the compute performance...

The compute performance of the 7970 absolutely blows away the 680, hell... the 580 beats the 680 in compute, lol.
Why do I care about compute? Because I also like to bitcoin mine in my spare time, and 3 7970s are a monster in BTC mining.

Another thing is that clock for clock, the 7970 is simply quicker in games/etc, not to mention the max OC potential (mhz wise) is lower on the 680. I have a very nice 680 (OC wise), and I was barely able to attain a +185mhz OC that was BF3 stable, and still crashed in Unigine, which didn't matter to me. The OC is nice, and helps alot, but as I and many other have noticed, the performance isn't stable or consistent when overclocking. Sometimes you'll score 200 points different in 3dmark11 on the same OC.
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post #805 of 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Pistol View Post

Subjective.
In instances where multiple monitors or multiple cards come into play, the HD 7970 generally wins. This is either due to poor drivers from nvidia, limited memory bandwidth from the GTX 680, or a combination of both. Also, voltage options are available on the HD 7970 for even higher overclocks than that of the GTX 680.
/fact #bothcardsaregood

Wrong. I run 2560x1600, so any single-monitor is better off with GTX 680's, both SLI and single, even max-oc to max-oc. I have compared the Radeon 7970 in my sig rig at a bench-only OC that was loud, to a single GTX 680 oc'd a medium amount and quiet as a mouse on auto fan.... and the GTX 680 wins by 7% in 3dmark11 extreme preset. It also is noticeably faster in games for me at 2560x1600 even in a single-card configuration. SLI drivers are FLAWLESS for me thus far for GTX 680, while even in single-card the Radeon 7970 gave me tons of little glitches, including the annoying ULPS-getting-stuck-on bug that required a reboot quite often when the system was left idle for long at all.

Reviews are showing comparable performance in oc'd Surround/EyeFinity for single cards, and with how bad eyefinity+crossfire tends to be from the owners' thread etc., SLI is the clear winner with comparable performance as well and non-bad drivers, + $50/card cheaper.

Barring anyone needing EXTREME resolutions like 7680x1600, the Radeon 7970 is an inferior choice in nearly all circumstances currently. 5760x1080/below the GTX 680 rocks.
Quote:
Originally Posted by m3t4lh34d View Post

GoldenTiger has proven throughout this entire thread that he is biased towards the 680 and he'll argue until hell freezes over regardless of whether it is fact or fiction. Those of us with a little common sense will realize that the 7970 is the better overclocker, period. It pulls ahead of the 680 very easily once max OCs are factored in. Sure, stock for stock the 680 wins, but we aren't 'stock' kind of people here are we? This is OVERCLOCK.net. Thus many of us want cards we can tinker with and cards that wont BSOD or crash with a measly 120mhz overclock. The way voltage is controlled with the 680 will most certainly prevent any sort of amazing overclocks on air. I doubt many of the 680 owners here are willing to hard mod their cards just to beat the 7970...

I've run my own tests and the GTX 680 oc'd beats out even a bench-only OC that is high, of a Radeon 7970. End of story. The 7970 is more expensive, has worse drivers, worse performance, and poor support. I'm only biased towards great products.
Edited by GoldenTiger - 3/28/12 at 4:25pm
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post #806 of 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by Levesque View Post

+1. Well said.
I'm driving 3X 2560X1600 and overclocking my cards to the max is a given for me. IMHO, the true high-end gaming card is the 7970. 3Gb of VRAM, and I can easily reach 1250/1600 with 4 cards in Quad-Fire.
2Gb, and limited OC don't cut it for high-end gaming set-ups. For around the same price, the 7970 is a better card for my 3X30'' Eyefinity set-up. With 4500$ worth of displays, I don't care about the price of those GPUs. I care about max OC potential, VRAM, and FPS. That's all.
Let's see some Quad-SLI 680 max OC bench at 7680X1600. smile.gif

Your circumstances are pretty extreme, though I'm not sure why you paid $1500/display. I got my 3007WFP-HC 2560x1600 S-IPS panel direct from Dell for $680 including a 5-year extended warranty... think you overpaid! For virtually everyone (meaning anyone not running 7680x1600 on tri 30" LCD's) the GTX 680 is a superior choice both performance-wise and price-wise.
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post #807 of 880
You guys saw this, right?

http://hardocp.com/article/2012/03/28/nvidia_kepler_geforce_gtx_680_sli_video_card_review/9

A little quote for you guys, who think that max OC and better average FPS is all that matters.
Quote:
We don't know what other descriptive word to use, other than "smoothness" to describe the difference we feel between SLI and CrossFireX when we play games. We've expressed this difference in gameplay feeling between SLI and CrossFireX in the past, in other evaluations, and we have to bring it up again because it was very apparent during our testing of 680 SLI versus 7970 CFX.

We can't communicate to you "smoothness" in raw framerates and graphs. Smoothness, frame transition, and game responsiveness is the experience that is provided to you as you play. Perhaps it has more to do with "frametime" than it does with "framerate." To us it seems like SLI is "more playable" at lower framerates than CrossFireX is. For example, where we might find a game playable at 40 FPS average with SLI, when we test CrossFireX we find that 40 FPS doesn't feel as smooth and we have to target a higher average framerate, maybe 50 FPS, maybe 60 FPS for CrossFireX to feel like NVIDIA's SLI framerate of 40 FPS. Only real-world hands on gameplay can show you this, although we can communicate it in words to you. Even though this is a very subjective realm of reviewing GPUs, it is one we surely need to discuss with you.

The result of SLI feeling smoother than CrossFireX is that in real-world gameplay, we can get away with a bit lower FPS with SLI, whereas with CFX we have to aim a little higher for it to feel smooth. We do know that SLI performs some kind of driver algorithm to help smooth SLI framerates, and this could be why it feels so much better. Whatever the reason, to us, SLI feels smoother than CrossFireX.

Personally speaking here, when I was playing between GeForce GTX 680 SLI and Radeon HD 7970 CrossFireX, I felt GTX 680 SLI delivered the better experience in every single game. I will make a bold and personal statement; I'd prefer to play games on GTX 680 SLI than I would with Radeon HD 7970 CrossFireX after using both. For me, GTX 680 SLI simply provides a smoother gameplay experience. If I were building a new machine with multi-card in mind, SLI would go in my machine instead of CrossFireX. In fact, I'd probably be looking for those special Galaxy 4GB 680 cards coming down the pike. After gaming on both platforms, GTX 680 SLI was giving me smoother performance at 5760x1200 compared to 7970 CFX. This doesn't apply to single-GPU video cards, only between SLI and CrossFireX.

Anyway, I also have tried 7970, 7970x2 and 7970x3 personally and can tell you for a fact, yes, my average fps with 7970s were higher at 5760x1080, but unless I wanted to show off and brag about my fps to people on some forum, I'd never ever play at that resolution with Crossfire. The microstutter is HORRIBLE with AMD cards. It was the same with the 6970s, it's still the same with 7970s. NVIDIA does it right. Period. AMD can only do a single card right in Eyefinity, so far. Will that ever change? Maybe if they hire some NVIDIA driver guys.
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post #808 of 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by GoldenTiger View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Pistol View Post

Subjective.
In instances where multiple monitors or multiple cards come into play, the HD 7970 generally wins. This is either due to poor drivers from nvidia, limited memory bandwidth from the GTX 680, or a combination of both. Also, voltage options are available on the HD 7970 for even higher overclocks than that of the GTX 680.
/fact #bothcardsaregood

Wrong. I run 2560x1600, so any single-monitor is better off with GTX 680's, both SLI and single, even max-oc to max-oc. I have compared the Radeon 7970 in my sig rig at a bench-only OC that was loud, to a single GTX 680 oc'd a medium amount and quiet as a mouse on auto fan.... and the GTX 680 wins by 7% in 3dmark11 extreme preset. It also is noticeably faster in games for me at 2560x1600 even in a single-card configuration. SLI drivers are FLAWLESS for me thus far for GTX 680, while even in single-card the Radeon 7970 gave me tons of little glitches, including the annoying ULPS-getting-stuck-on bug that required a reboot quite often when the system was left idle for long at all.

Reviews are showing comparable performance in oc'd Surround/EyeFinity for single cards, and with how bad eyefinity+crossfire tends to be from the owners' thread etc., SLI is the clear winner with comparable performance as well and non-bad drivers, + $50/card cheaper.

Barring anyone needing EXTREME resolutions like 7680x1600, the Radeon 7970 is an inferior choice in nearly all circumstances currently. 5760x1080/below the GTX 680 rocks.

I'm at 2560x1600 as well. I have yet to have a driver issue, that you claim EVERYBODY seems to have. Most people don't have driver issues with these cards. The only real problem with them, is that you need RC11 installed first, then any of the WHQL drivers. Not all that big of a deal.....

And guess what? There's not one title out there that I cannot max out completely...with the two exceptions being GTA IV due to unoptimized drivers (I can pull off all "High" with 50 sliders though, which is acceptable), and Metro 2033....which the 680 can't do either.

I think your experience with 7970's honestly, was user error. Most of the problems with these cards are due to people simply not doing the research..which sounds to be your issue as well.
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post #809 of 880
Quote:
Originally Posted by m3t4lh34d View Post

GoldenTiger has proven throughout this entire thread that he is biased towards the 680 and he'll argue until hell freezes over regardless of whether it is fact or fiction. Those of us with a little common sense will realize that the 7970 is the better overclocker, period. It pulls ahead of the 680 very easily once max OCs are factored in. Sure, stock for stock the 680 wins, but we aren't 'stock' kind of people here are we? This is OVERCLOCK.net. Thus many of us want cards we can tinker with and cards that wont BSOD or crash with a measly 120mhz overclock. The way voltage is controlled with the 680 will most certainly prevent any sort of amazing overclocks on air. I doubt many of the 680 owners here are willing to hard mod their cards just to beat the 7970...
Quote:
Originally Posted by FcZenitFan View Post

You guys saw this, right?
http://hardocp.com/article/2012/03/28/nvidia_kepler_geforce_gtx_680_sli_video_card_review/9
A little quote for you guys, who think that max OC and better average FPS is all that matters.
Quote:
We don't know what other descriptive word to use, other than "smoothness" to describe the difference we feel between SLI and CrossFireX when we play games. We've expressed this difference in gameplay feeling between SLI and CrossFireX in the past, in other evaluations, and we have to bring it up again because it was very apparent during our testing of 680 SLI versus 7970 CFX.
We can't communicate to you "smoothness" in raw framerates and graphs. Smoothness, frame transition, and game responsiveness is the experience that is provided to you as you play. Perhaps it has more to do with "frametime" than it does with "framerate." To us it seems like SLI is "more playable" at lower framerates than CrossFireX is. For example, where we might find a game playable at 40 FPS average with SLI, when we test CrossFireX we find that 40 FPS doesn't feel as smooth and we have to target a higher average framerate, maybe 50 FPS, maybe 60 FPS for CrossFireX to feel like NVIDIA's SLI framerate of 40 FPS. Only real-world hands on gameplay can show you this, although we can communicate it in words to you. Even though this is a very subjective realm of reviewing GPUs, it is one we surely need to discuss with you.
The result of SLI feeling smoother than CrossFireX is that in real-world gameplay, we can get away with a bit lower FPS with SLI, whereas with CFX we have to aim a little higher for it to feel smooth. We do know that SLI performs some kind of driver algorithm to help smooth SLI framerates, and this could be why it feels so much better. Whatever the reason, to us, SLI feels smoother than CrossFireX.
Personally speaking here, when I was playing between GeForce GTX 680 SLI and Radeon HD 7970 CrossFireX, I felt GTX 680 SLI delivered the better experience in every single game. I will make a bold and personal statement; I'd prefer to play games on GTX 680 SLI than I would with Radeon HD 7970 CrossFireX after using both. For me, GTX 680 SLI simply provides a smoother gameplay experience. If I were building a new machine with multi-card in mind, SLI would go in my machine instead of CrossFireX. In fact, I'd probably be looking for those special Galaxy 4GB 680 cards coming down the pike. After gaming on both platforms, GTX 680 SLI was giving me smoother performance at 5760x1200 compared to 7970 CFX. This doesn't apply to single-GPU video cards, only between SLI and CrossFireX.
Anyway, I also have tried 7970, 7970x2 and 7970x3 personally and can tell you for a fact, yes, my average fps with 7970s were higher at 5760x1080, but unless I wanted to show off and brag about my fps to people on some forum, I'd never ever play at that resolution with Crossfire. The microstutter is HORRIBLE with AMD cards. It was the same with the 6970s, it's still the same with 7970s. NVIDIA does it right. Period. AMD can only do a single card right in Eyefinity, so far. Will that ever change? Maybe if they hire some NVIDIA driver guys.

This is true. It is backed up by an in-depth article here: http://techreport.com/articles.x/21516 with both interviews with tech guys from the companies and rigorous testing as far as microstutter goes.
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post #810 of 880
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Originally Posted by pioneerisloud View Post

I'm at 2560x1600 as well. I have yet to have a driver issue, that you claim EVERYBODY seems to have. Most people don't have driver issues with these cards. The only real problem with them, is that you need RC11 installed first, then any of the WHQL drivers. Not all that big of a deal.....
And guess what? There's not one title out there that I cannot max out completely...with the two exceptions being GTA IV due to unoptimized drivers (I can pull off all "High" with 50 sliders though, which is acceptable), and Metro 2033....which the 680 can't do either.
I think your experience with 7970's honestly, was user error. Most of the problems with these cards are due to people simply not doing the research..which sounds to be your issue as well.

Oh, I read up on the 7970 while I owned it, but the drivers still sucked even after spending hours upon hours googling for all the random little tweaks and hacks you need to make to them. Sure, the 7970 is fast too, but it's still slower+pricier+more of a hassle. If I had benched my 7970 at normal fan speeds which only netted me around 1100mhz core... the speed gap would have been even larger. GTX 680 was simply plug and play... I can't say the same of the 7970 for me. I also see LOTS of posts in the gtx 680 owners' thread and on the evga forums of people saying they're glad they switched or are switching due to amd driver issues. So, it's not user error. I did the research (which is absurd to have to do for a $550 video card) and it still was a pain. From visual glitches in less-popular titles, to ULPS issues, to powerplay resetting itself at random, and other problems, I simply hated it. I also later bought a Radeon 7950 OC (non-ref cooler) and it had the exact same problems, so it wasn't a bad card.
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