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[bbc] Probe finds high radiation in damaged Fukushima reactor - Page 15

post #141 of 160
But we see time and time again industry that abandons it's liabilities in this way. From gas stations that operate for 50 years and then abandon the polluted plot of land to factories to mines to manufacturers. Corporations themselves are amoral entities that would burn the world to make a penny's profit and without an outside force to ensure compliance with the needs of the people and with future generations they have demonstrated they'll do that and more without hesitation or qualm.

Now they may be counting on future technology to get them out of the bind of endless nuclear waste storage but I'm not willing to do so. I think it would be equally likely that the future will bring a different technology providing power that would render nuclear (or coal or gas or wind or whatever) obsolete. So at this future date when nuclear may be obsolete and no longer profitable do you really expect the corporation who owns X nuclear plant and all the waste it has generated over the years to have the resources to deal with that waste for however long it needs to? Without the nuclear plant to provide profit to cover it?

I'd rather burn coal and deal with global warming then saddle my descendants for all time with ever increasing amounts of nuclear waste.
post #142 of 160
What a surprise . . . . High levels of radiation inside a nuclear reactor . . .

Bloody hell, I mean seriously, were they expecting to find reduced levels of radiation?

In my opinion, we need more nuclear reactors (in Britain) and preferably reactors of the1500 MW + variety.
    
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post #143 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Blindsay View Post

Your auto parts arguement doesnt work here. You need a lot more qualifications/education to work at a nuclear plant especially in any posistion of importance. They are not going to hire some 17 year old kid with no education....
In terms of land occupied, Nuclear takes up very very little relative to how much power is produced.
Also if you look at the total life cycle of wind/solar/hydro they are not exactly as clean as people think.
Going forward I wish we would spend more time/money into Fusion....

I wanted to expand on this as well. A lot of people think we can simply import all of our power from solar and wind. In a perfect world, we could do a lot more with those techs. One problem I am seeing now is that the grid tie inverters are not a real sine-wave, and instead a modified square wave because they are cheaper to manufacture. Some people will ask, "well, what is wrong with that?"

The problem with it is that it is causing huge problems with an already overloaded grid all around the world. These cheaper grid tie inverters are causing the 3rd and 5th degree harmonics to get so distorted that most protection relays have to be set to almost no sensitivity. This leaves most plants with very little protection in the way of voltage regulator failure or a field failure. This in turn causes on generator to take down an entire part of a grid.

Are these viable means for a household, maybe, but manufacturing needs to catch up with the demands and the technology that is there. Until then, Nuclear will be a very prominent part of our lives because people in general will not give up their way of life until it is taken away. (That includes all of us with computers that almost need their own dedicated 15 amp circuit)

Just my .02 , BS, EE, power generation and distribution
Edited by boostinsteve - 4/2/12 at 5:14pm
post #144 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpankyMcFlych View Post

But we see time and time again industry that abandons it's liabilities in this way. From gas stations that operate for 50 years and then abandon the polluted plot of land to factories to mines to manufacturers. Corporations themselves are amoral entities that would burn the world to make a penny's profit and without an outside force to ensure compliance with the needs of the people and with future generations they have demonstrated they'll do that and more without hesitation or qualm.
Now they may be counting on future technology to get them out of the bind of endless nuclear waste storage but I'm not willing to do so. I think it would be equally likely that the future will bring a different technology providing power that would render nuclear (or coal or gas or wind or whatever) obsolete. So at this future date when nuclear may be obsolete and no longer profitable do you really expect the corporation who owns X nuclear plant and all the waste it has generated over the years to have the resources to deal with that waste for however long it needs to? Without the nuclear plant to provide profit to cover it?
I'd rather burn coal and deal with global warming then saddle my descendants for all time with ever increasing amounts of nuclear waste.

I'm not sure why you are so sure that there is going to be a technology that will render nuclear obsolete any time soon, I haven't seen any evidence of a breakthrough on the horizon. Look how many years we've been using coal to power things, and it's still in use today (albeit not nearly as much). There is always the hope for fusion power, but creating the device to hold and maintain the reaction is proving to be extremely difficult. The longest we've been able to maintain the fusion reaction is still under one second, we still have a long ways to go.

It seems to me that you don't fully understand how safe these materials are the way they are being stored. These containers are built to make sure no radiation leaks out as they travel down interstates to/from plants. You can even find pictures of storage sties, and you'll notice that the workers aren't wearing special protection, the containers are actually that good at their jobs.

From an economical viewpoint, these power companies want a solution to this problem; they don't want to have to pay to store this stuff. Now that Obama has closed Yucca Mountain, there is more pressure than ever to do something about it. The good news is that these storage sites are largely self-sustaining... Pretty much just a hole in the ground.

Like I've said before, nuclear facilities are some of the most regulated facilities on the planet, or at least in the US. They are built to strict standards, they are run to strict standards, and they are decommissioned to strict standards. It's actually amazing when you think about how few problems nuclear sites have had, while oil spills, coal mines collapses, and natural gas line explosions are in the news relatively often. The people running these plants know what's at stake, and lets be honest, no one wants an incident like Fukushima, Three Mile, or Chernobyl.

Continuing to use fossil fuels just because the current best clean alternative is less than perfect is pretty hypocritical in my eyes. Hell, fossil fuels have tons of downsides, I don't really see how it can be considered the lesser evil. But on the other hand, look how far oil, coal, and gas has come in efficiency and cleanliness; this is no doubt in part to it's adoption as a main power source. As long as you keep nuclear on the back-burner, progress towards a solution will be much slower.

Every power source has a necessary evil tied to it. Realistically, nuclear power is the only efficient, clean, and renewable power source we have right now. The biggest thing that needs to happen is education, something the government has been terrible about. They need to brag about how well they've done, how good these containers are, and how few accidents there have been.

Don't mean to bore you guys with a wall of text over and over, apparently I feel pretty passionately about it. Plus, no one seems to talk about the benefits of nuclear power, that's apparently not a good news story... The only thing you hear about are the same few dangers and worst-case scenarios reiterated over and over. It's really quite disappointing... Such is life, I suppose.
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post #145 of 160
Came across this recently and decided it might be a good follow-up to those saying how disastrous the Fukushima event was.

http://www.theage.com.au/comment/japans-radiation-disaster-toll-none-dead-none-sick-20130604-2nomz.html

For those too lazy to read it, no deaths, not even any radiation poisoning, for anyone in Japan.
post #146 of 160
Love how nearly no news agency reported on it.
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post #147 of 160
Holy Necro batman ***
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post #148 of 160
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wiffinberg View Post

Holy Necro batman ***

Updates aren't really necros.
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post #149 of 160
yea well
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post #150 of 160
Aww come on guys, can we stop bumping a 2 month old thread?

(Yes I know I'm guilty of this too, but can we stop?)
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