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post #11 of 37
Yes, this was covered in depth in the review I linked in the first post if you want the nitty gritty.

AMD Fusion is simply the brand name for AMD's new, more powerful integrated graphics that works closely with processors. This is currently represented by the A-series of processors (A6-3500, a8-3870k, etc). These have fairly good integrated graphics, which can also co-operate with certain low-end AMD graphics cards for increased power. Good enough for low-end gaming quite cheap. However, that solution simply can't match the graphics or processing power of a cheap Intel processor + mid-level graphics card. For gaming at your budget, Intel gives you much more performance. AMD A-series chips are still a pretty good solution for super-budget video encoding and some other workstation tasks that use resources differently than gaming.
    
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post #12 of 37
becase the gpu is intagrated with the cpu so they are all in one thier is no need to add a AMD card but if you do your now in a crossfire ie beter graffics you you look at the bench makes I sent you you can see that with out adding a gpu the 3800 gets from high 20nes to the high 40des FPS with out adding a gpu when the I3 is tested agist the 3800 it got between 10 to 30 FPS given the fact that you have the cost of the cpu + gpu with intel I say you save more money going with AMD you can get a more powerful gpu to match out out do the A8 amd but thier gose the budget
post #13 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckerguy View Post

here is a little something to look at for you
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-fusion-intel-core-i3_7.html#sect0
and NZXT has price matching

You really should be looking at this page to compare the CPUs
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-fusion-intel-core-i3_5.html#sect1

your page is comparing the APU GPU and the HD3000 graphics doh.gif
Edited by Ironman517 - 3/29/12 at 12:16pm
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post #14 of 37
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterFred View Post

Yes, this was covered in depth in the review I linked in the first post if you want the nitty gritty.
AMD Fusion is simply the brand name for AMD's new, more powerful integrated graphics that works closely with processors. This is currently represented by the A-series of processors (A6-3500, a8-3870k, etc). These have fairly good integrated graphics, which can also co-operate with certain low-end AMD graphics cards for increased power. Good enough for low-end gaming quite cheap. However, that solution simply can't match the graphics or processing power of a cheap Intel processor + mid-level graphics card. For gaming at your budget, Intel gives you much more performance. AMD A-series chips are still a pretty good solution for super-budget video encoding and some other workstation tasks that use resources differently than gaming.

Ah okay, see the thing is I don't play or plan on buying newer games... My games are all from 2010 and below...

if I do get a AMD A8-3870K, in what range of years would the game be for me to run them on atleast medium settings...like games from 2008 and below? etc. because i'm considering an AMD CPU a long with a AMD card to save me money so i wouldnt need to spend as much

also, you said the A6, but isn't the A8 better?
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckerguy View Post

becase the gpu is intagrated with the cpu so they are all in one thier is no need to add a AMD card but if you do your now in a crossfire ie beter graffics you you look at the bench makes I sent you you can see that with out adding a gpu the 3800 gets from high 20nes to the high 40des FPS with out adding a gpu when the I3 is tested agist the 3800 it got between 10 to 30 FPS given the fact that you have the cost of the cpu + gpu with intel I say you save more money going with AMD you can get a more powerful gpu to match out out do the A8 amd but thier gose the budget

Thanks a lot, I understand now & have learned something new.
Edited by xzamples - 3/29/12 at 12:32pm
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post #15 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by MisterFred View Post

Don't use that power supply if you want your computer to last.
Even though this is the AMD forum, for a budget gaming build I suggest going with a cheap intel processor. Unless it's suuuuper-budget, where an A6 APU is a good idea. Basically, following these thoughts:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-a8-3870k.html
So here's what I recommend you buy:
($94) - g850 (sandy bridge dual-core) CPU & DVD-burner combo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.846680
-$8 or $7 if you don't want the DVD-burner part of the combo
($160-$10 rebate) - Radeon 6870
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102948
A powerful video card for a budget solution, should let you play any modern game at medium settings, most games at high or maximum settings. A tad cheaper than the Nvidia power-equivalent, the 560. If you want to drop $20-30 you can get a 460 or a 6770, if you want to pay $60 or so more, you can get a 560TI, but the 6870 is really the best price/performance for this budget range.
($55) - Asrock cheap H61 mobo
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157241
Other boards are $5 cheaper, but the Asrock has 2 controllable fan headers rather than 1.
($38) - 2x4gb 1333mhz RAM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231424
You could save $18 by going for 2x2gb.
CPU Cooler - if your current cooler doesn't fit, you can just use the stock cooler.
($37 - $20 rebate) - Corsair cx430w v2
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026&Tpk=corsair%20cx430%20v2
MUUUUUUUCH better than your allied POS. A few rare units develop coil whine, but it won't fry your system.
($75) - Seagate Barracuda 500gb 7200rpm
http://us.ncix.com/products/?sku=63468&vpn=ST500DM002&manufacture=Seagate&promoid=1263
If you want more space, $23 more for the 1TB version.
Total: $429 after rebates & promo codes.

This will be the best bang for your buck right here. You might be able to get cheaper prices in different places, but this is what you should base your build around. thumb.gif
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post #16 of 37
The reason I said for a super-budget build you'd want an A6 over the a8-3870k is because the A6 is cheaper. When you get to the point you're going to pay for an a8 & a cheap GPU to crossfire with it, you're reaching the price of an intel pentium & a 6770, which outperforms the a8. So if you were going a8 + cheap card crossfire, you might as well just go intel + 6770. But a6 is even cheaper than that, and intel integrated graphics can't run games on low graphics settings as well as the a6 integrated graphics.

Everything depends on the games you want to run, how shiny you want them to look, and if you will ever play newer games. Want to play SC2? The intel processor will be far better, hands down. Want to play Leisure Suit Larry 7? May as well just get an a6. Also, everyone has different FPS & settings tolerances. I think most games look fine at 30 fps & often play on low graphics, so for me, the cheaper AMD route might be better. Most people, at least at this website, detest 30 fps and low settings.

Again, better not so much to listen to what I have to say as read this article, probably in its entirety if you're spending this much thought on the decision:
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-a8-3870k.html

P.S. I can't believe my mind just dredged up the Leisure Suit Larry series. I never even played one of those games and they're iconic...
Edited by MisterFred - 3/29/12 at 12:51pm
    
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post #17 of 37
this is a quote from that test

The situation in gaming tests looks very good for AMD products. Although their computational performance is pretty mediocre, powerful graphic allows them to do pretty well (for integrated solutions). Fusion series processors almost always deliver higher fps than Intel processors from Core i3 and Pentium family.

Even the use of higher-performance HD Graphics 3000 core in Core i3 processors didn’t save the day. Yes, Core i3-2125 featuring this particular graphics core modification turned out about 50% faster than its fellow Core i3-2120 processor equipped with HD Graphics 2000 core, but the graphics integrated in Llano processors is even faster than that. As a result, even Core i3-2125 can only compete against the low-cost A4-3300 processor, while other products on Sandy Bridge microarchitecture looked even less appealing. And if we take into account that the graphics cores in Intel processors do not support DirectX 11, things become even more hopeless for the current Intel offerings. Only the next microarchitecture generation, Ivy Bridge, may be able to fix it, because its graphics core will be faster and will feature more up-to-date functionality.

Even if we leave out the specific numbers and view the situation from more global qualitative prospective, AMD products will still be a much more attractive option for entry-level gaming systems. The top Fusion processors from the A8 series allow playing almost any contemporary games without involving an external graphics accelerator, provided you compromise to some extent on screen resolution and image quality settings. As for Intel processors, we can’t recommend any of them for the entry-level gaming platforms, because different HD Graphics modifications are still not powerful enough for this application field.
and we are talking a budget gaming

doh.gif
post #18 of 37
Quote:
Originally Posted by truckerguy View Post

this is a quote from that test
The situation in gaming tests looks very good for AMD products. Although their computational performance is pretty mediocre, powerful graphic allows them to do pretty well (for integrated solutions). Fusion series processors almost always deliver higher fps than Intel processors from Core i3 and Pentium family.

Even the use of higher-performance HD Graphics 3000 core in Core i3 processors didn’t save the day. Yes, Core i3-2125 featuring this particular graphics core modification turned out about 50% faster than its fellow Core i3-2120 processor equipped with HD Graphics 2000 core, but the graphics integrated in Llano processors is even faster than that. As a result, even Core i3-2125 can only compete against the low-cost A4-3300 processor, while other products on Sandy Bridge microarchitecture looked even less appealing. And if we take into account that the graphics cores in Intel processors do not support DirectX 11, things become even more hopeless for the current Intel offerings. Only the next microarchitecture generation, Ivy Bridge, may be able to fix it, because its graphics core will be faster and will feature more up-to-date functionality.

Even if we leave out the specific numbers and view the situation from more global qualitative prospective, AMD products will still be a much more attractive option for entry-level gaming systems. The top Fusion processors from the A8 series allow playing almost any contemporary games without involving an external graphics accelerator, provided you compromise to some extent on screen resolution and image quality settings. As for Intel processors, we can’t recommend any of them for the entry-level gaming platforms, because different HD Graphics modifications are still not powerful enough for this application field.
and we are talking a budget gaming
doh.gif

Nobody in this thread is recommending the use of using a sandy bridge processors built in GPU. But we are comparing the APU vs an i3 + GPU. since an i3 performs better than the APU, you just have to compare the graphical settings of both setups. thumb.gif

Everyone knows llano's gpus are better. there is no argument there.
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post #19 of 37
@truckerguy
That cherry-picked section compares AMD integrated graphics vs Intel integrated graphics, which you neglected to mention and is not comparison not at issue here. I said in the very post above yours that AMD integrated is better than Intel integrated graphics, so you're not bringing up anything new.

I specifically recommended an Intel processor with a separate, discrete graphics card. Which is more powerful than AMD integrated or fusion crossfire graphics. As that article makes clear.

And of course if you read the article you are well aware that the conclusions page to that article questioned if there was a useful gaming niche for the a8 at all. Being misleading and trying to get people to buy a ****ty system by telling them it's better is pretty trollish. If xzamples wants to buy an AMD processor & run integrated graphics because it's cheaper, well all well and good. Only he can judge the monetary value of the performance difference: that's subjective because $100 to one guy is a big deal but to another guy it's well worth it for an improved gaming experience. But don't try and shove a processor on someone for no good reason or, worse, fool them into picking an option just because you're a fanboy of a system.
    
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post #20 of 37
Thread Starter 
ahh okay should I wait for the AMD Trinity? (which is the A10...i think coming out 2nd quarter of this year)

i understand if i choose amd over intel in my situation i will only be saving only little, about $100 less...sounds pretty stupid but in my case right now i'm trying to save as much as possible
Edited by xzamples - 3/29/12 at 1:08pm
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