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Tips for those building new PCs with AM3+ mobos - Page 4

post #31 of 43
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by jsc1973 View Post

I see something like that and I want to send a message of my own back to them:
"Dude, just get a Dell!"

Unfortunately many enthusiasts have more enthusiasm than technical expertise or even PC building experience. While we all need to start some place, it's useful in life to use the knowledgebase that is readily available to people. That's why there are no dumb questions - except the ones you don't ask.

There are any number of tutorials and even videos online to help new and even experienced PC builders deal with issues that occur on a PC build with new hardware. What I find amazing is many enthusiasts are unwilling to invest any effort to learn or research issues and automatically assume that the new hardware they received and installed is "defective" if it doesn't do what they expect it to do - often without installation of proper drivers, no stress testing, etc.

I realize that we live in the Internet age but it amazes me that many new PC builders are resistant to actually READING online tutorials. They can't be bothered but they want instant answers and gratification from the experts. They are investing little and expecting big returns - as if they are somehow entitled to years of experience and firsthand knowledge without investing any effort to learn so they can solve their own issues and be able to help other folks.

Newegg has an online PC building video but you'd definitely need to have considerable experience to get a lot of value from it. I'd kind of consider it a quick refresher for those who have built PCs in the past. There are any number of You Tube PC building videos of various quality and technical levels. The bottom line is much of the information required is readily available to those who seek it. biggrin.gif

While in many cases it probably is appropriate to suggest that these folks just buy a pre-built PC because they are in way over their heads as far as technical knowledge, we should not be too quick to discourage these folks from learning and contributing, perhaps in the future. They certainly aren't going to learn much however if they don't invest any effort to learn.

The sad part is most of the folks in this situation do not understand they lack the technical expertise, they are not willing to invest a reasonable effort to learn, they feel entitled to have their PC issues resolved immediately if not sooner by a good samaritan and in the end they have not learned any skills to help themselves or other folks. They have missed out on the actual FUN of learning and discovering the "how and why" of PC building let alone the FUN of learning to overclock and what that world is all about. They assume because people casually talk about PC building and OC'ing in forums that anyone can do it and that no learning and little knowledge is required. As most of us here know - that is simply not the case.

That is part of the reason I started this thread - I do not want to discourage newbies I want to encourage them to learn so they know fact from fiction when it comes to building a PC or even buying components for their PC. I'd love to see fewer technically absurd product review comments everywhere based on the enthusiast's lack of sufficient PC knowledge. The only way I know of to achieve this is by nurturing their PC education and self-help skills.

I can't catch a fish daily to feed every PC enthusiasts who is "hungry" for knowledge but I'd be glad to help them learn how to fish for themselves... wink.gif

For those who don't know what the above para-phrase means, it means learning to help yourself is what life is all about. Otherwise you are pretty much dependent on someone else to provide and take care of your needs be they personal or PC or whatever. There is no better time to start learning than the present! Enjoy. thumb.gif
Edited by AMD4ME - 6/1/12 at 6:34pm
post #32 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMD4ME View Post

Unfortunately many enthusiasts have more enthusiasm than technical expertise or even PC building experience. While we all need to start some place, it's useful in life to use the knowledgebase that is readily available to people. That's why there is no dumb questions - except the ones you don't ask.

Trust me there are dumb questions... I have had the call while doing phone tech support of "My coffee cup holder broke and will not retract, can you send someone to fix/replace it?" we generally replaced it with a blank that looked like a cd/dvd drive bay but did absolutely nothing.


That being said, good post. For the most part people do just get in over their head, and most of the time there are no dumb questions.
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post #33 of 43
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHayZe View Post

Trust me there are dumb questions... I have had the call while doing phone tech support of "My coffee cup holder broke and will not retract, can you send someone to fix/replace it?" we generally replaced it with a blank that looked like a cd/dvd drive bay but did absolutely nothing.
That being said, good post. For the most part people do just get in over their head, and most of the time there are no dumb questions.

Yeah the coffee cup holder joke has been around the PC industry for at least 10 years or more... My brother use to do PC repairs for a university and you would not believe the horror stories and how people failed to have back-ups of critical data for things like a Master's Thesis..., etc. Common sense isn't as common as it once was. biggrin.gif

Let's hope that a lot of newbies and even some experienced PC builders read this thread so everyone benefits in the long run.
post #34 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMD4ME View Post

Yeah the coffee cup holder joke has been around the PC industry for at least 10 years or more... My brother use to do PC repairs for a university and you would not believe the horror stories and how people failed to have back-ups of critical data for things like a Master's Thesis..., etc. Common sense isn't as common as it once was. biggrin.gif
Let's hope that a lot of newbies and even some experienced PC builders read this thread so everyone benefits in the long run.

I wish it was a joke, but I seriously had those calls
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post #35 of 43
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHayZe View Post

I wish it was a joke, but I seriously had those calls

I know but you have to laugh at these absurd questions... or you'll cry at where our society if for technical knowledge. rolleyes.gif
post #36 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMD4ME View Post

I know but you have to laugh at these absurd questions... or you'll cry at where our society if for technical knowledge. rolleyes.gif

I die a little inside every day that I realize how the intelligence level falls every day
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post #37 of 43
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarkHayZe View Post

I die a little inside every day that I realize how the intelligence level falls every day

It is amazing that many people are totally oblivious to this reality and I too share this pain. redface.gif

I'm trying to do my part to reverse this tragic situation. Every little bit helps but it's sure an uphill battle. It's going to take a lot of effort to change the decline IMO.
post #38 of 43
Quote:
Originally Posted by AMD4ME View Post

It is amazing that many people are totally oblivious to this reality and I too share this pain. redface.gif
I'm trying to do my part to reverse this tragic situation. Every little bit helps but it's sure an uphill battle. It's going to take a lot of effort to change the decline IMO.

I know we are getting WAY off topic but...lol

Unfortunately it isnt going to stop, the smart people procreate less than the dumb people at a ration of 10-1 (dumb-smart) or something pretty darn close. Give it a century or so and we will have worked ourselves back to the days of the cavemen
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post #39 of 43
Thread Starter 
I see some absurd mobo reviews on Newegg and elsewhere so I may post some of these to illustrate folks who need to do more homework as they aren't up to speed on PC builiding for any possible number of reasons - including failing to read and understand the information in the User's Manual that comes with the new mobo. I do realize that some OM's are very poor but people should still read them as PC tech changes over time.

Here's an excerpt from one review where a person blames the mobo for RAM BIOS issues.

" Cons: Dosent support ddr3 1866 in all four slots. I bought this board because it said it could handle 1866 without overclocking. But with all 4 DIMM it runs at 1333 if you take out 2 it runs at 1600.

Default settings in the BIOS are junk. Who runs sata in IDE mode? Having to tune up a board to get it to run the way it should stock is unacceptable. Lack of support on the website is also a problem. They changed settings options in the bios with some update and there is no documentation on the website that they changed anything. Cant say I will buy a XYZBTEDSA board again."


1. The first thing that people should understand is AMD officially only supports ONE DIMM PER CHANNEL @ 1866 MHz. on the FX CPUs - though most people have found it no problem to run proper 1866 MHz. rated RAM @ 1866 MHz. or higher in all four slots.

SOME mobo makers automatically set the RAM frequency to match the CPU/RAM default frequency when ALL DIMM SLOTS ARE USED. You can confirm this with a perspective mobo maker before you buy if this may be a concern for you. In addition a newer BIOS may be released to facilitate running all DIMM sockets @ 1866 MHz. - if there is enough customer pressure for this feature.

2. The person above was using an AMD FX CPU but did not seem to understand that you must MANUALLY set the RAM frequency for 1866 MHz. when you first boot the PC because the RAM SPD initially sets the RAM frequency at less than 1866 MHz. to insure the PC will boot. Once you go into the BIOS and set the RAM latencies, voltage and frequency as specified for your RAM and then SAVE the new BIOS settings, your PC will boot at 1866 MHz. from then on - (if you have an FX CPU) or whatever frequency you've chosen if your system is capable of running the RAM at that frequency - such as up to ~1600 MHz. for a Deneb and up to ~1800 MHz. for a Thuban, as examples.

3. Unfortunately this person is blaming the mobo maker for his lack of technical knowledge. His comment regarding having to "tune the mobo" is hilarious. The BIOS has options for running SATA ports in both IDE and AHCI. Depending on the user and hardware you need to set this properly for best performance. This is NOT a "JUNK" BIOS, this is a user lack of knowledge issue. There is no means possible for a mobo maker to know exactly what hardware a customer will use with a mobo so they use the safest or most common default settings and the PC builder is suppose to be knowledgeable enough to make the appropriate changes to match their hardware. If this requires too much effort then a Dell PC may be a better choice for those folks.

IMO, mobo makers should provide more details on what a new BIOS changes, but they don't because many people have no idea how complicated a BIOS is and what the changes may or may not affect. With the FX CPUs and 990FX chipsets mobo makers are still learning all of the details so it is going to take some time for everything to be as desired.
Edited by AMD4ME - 6/13/12 at 6:23am
post #40 of 43
Great thread! I've been building my own systems since the mid '90s but everytime I build a new one the technology changes so much that I have a lot of research and planning to do before buying things. This time around was no exception. That last system I built was about five years ago. With the right planning, everything worked right away. But I can certainly see how it might not have if I had not done the required research.
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