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post #191 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by zodac View Post


Whereas my position is completely the opposite. And unlike the other teams, no, I won't put up a poll on the issue.

My reasoning is quite simple. The majority of people will most likely vote to remove CC names. For the individual, it makes things much simpler - no need to go to all your rigs and change the names. For teams as a whole, much simpler - no need to try and to convince people to convert. For OCN in particular, much simpler. No need for proof for prizes -  we just check your points over the event.

But for the CC, I think it wouldn't help. Partly for the conversion factor, but mostly because it remove the teamwork involved in this kind of competition. We come together each year as a team because we need to work as a unit to get the maximum conversion. Look at what happened to [H] - half of them converted, and half didn't, because they were all pulling different directions. That's not how I see the CC - as a struggle to get people to convert so you can compete. It's a chance for teams to show they actually are teams, not just a bunch of individuals.

I don't see what the names add to the competition. The point of this should be about folding, not who can follow the directions the best. I think our recruiting or conversion efforts should be focused on recruiting new folders to folding, not recruiting current folders to change their name. Changing names does nothing for folding, getting new folders does. Getting people to change names is an added artificial hoop to jump through that brings about no gain.

IMO folding, recruiting new folders, and having a big folding increase to catch the attention of prospective folders is what the CC should be about. Anything that doesn't line up directly with those goals isn't needed, and certainly should not be a point of contention worth holding up the CC over. Now the fairness of the competition promotes the goals mentioned by giving more motivation to fold to the best of your abilities because in a perfect world those who try the hardest win, but what does the arbitrary name changing bring to the table in terms of FOLDING?

It's like a foot race preceded by a mandatory hot dog eating competition.
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post #192 of 314

The event is as much a Folding competition as it is a team competition. That's why - without the team element, it's the same Folding we do day in, day out, only with a different metric, and less opposing teams.

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post #193 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by zodac View Post

The event is as much a Folding competition as it is a team competition. That's why - without the team element, it's the same Folding we do day in, day out, only with a different metric, and less opposing teams.

Well if that is the best reasoning for your side of the argument then that's pretty weak ground to stand on IMO. I can be content knowing that my opinion is the one I believe to be the best for folding overall, I don't believe you could say the same about your opinion if it's based solely on who has a better team spirit.

How can that team spirit even be something to be proud of if it flies in the face of what we are supposed to be about, which is folding?

Regardless of how you justify this to yourself, you did a poor job of responding to my argument. You want a team element that differentiates this from everyday folding? Ok, how about this being the point to try and pull out all the stops for recruiting new folders to the team and increasing all of our hardware capabilities to the maximum. If we, as a team, recruit more new folders then we win but more importantly folding wins. I see nothing that changing names or hoping on one foot or spinning around before you can start to fold does to add anything to the competition or to folding, unless of course we want a hoping on one foot or spinning around or name-changing competition, I however would like a folding competition.
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post #194 of 314

Quote:

Well if that is the best reasoning for your side of the argument then that's pretty weak ground to stand on IMO. I can be content knowing that my opinion is the one I believe to be the best for folding overall, I don't believe you could say the same about your opinion if it's based solely on who has a better team spirit.

 

My persective is that this is the best way forward for the CC, which will end up being the best for Folding. I'm sorry you don't agree, but that's how I see it, and aside from things being easier, I see no benefit/need to remove the CC names.

 

Quote:

 

How can that team spirit even be something to be proud of if it flies in the face of what we are supposed to be about, which is folding?

 

While you might be able to make the argument that CC names detracts from the time we could spend recruiting other Folders, it's a bit of a stretch to make it seem as though it's anti-Folding.

 

 

Quote:

Regardless of how you justify this to yourself, you did a poor job of responding to my argument. You want a team element that differentiates this from everyday folding? Ok, how about this being the point to try and pull out all the stops for recruiting new folders to the team and increasing all of our hardware capabilities to the maximum. If we, as a team, recruit more new folders then we win but more importantly folding wins. I see nothing that changing names or hoping on one foot or spinning around before you can start to fold does to add anything to the competition or to folding, unless of course we want a hoping on one foot or spinning around or name-changing competition, I however would like a folding competition.

 

1) We have events that have people trying to push their hardware to the max. The TC for members who can afford to do so 24/7, and the Foldathon for everyone else.

 

2) Recruiting people is something we try to do througout the yeear - we might have more people doing so during the CC, but it's not as if we relax the rest of the year.

 

There is no team element if there's no CC name - you'll have maybe a core bunch of members going out recruiting hard, and a larger group of people helping out with issues and configurations, but again, that's not much different from what we do during the rest of the year - it's just scaled up.

 

Again, if all you wanted was a Folding competition, how is it any different from what we do during the rest of the year, besides it being for 10 days?

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post #195 of 314

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by juano View Post


359

 

You just made me miss my childhood. thxjerk.

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post #196 of 314
Agreed, z.

If we don't have name conversion, then it's just business as usual.

We fold year round. We recruit year round. In May, we come together as a team and don't worry about millionaire threads. We change our folding name and fold as one individual.

The CC is about competition. Points. Glory. Defeat. What we do year round is about folding for the cause.
post #197 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by zodac View Post

Quote:

My persective is that this is the best way forward for the CC, which will end up being the best for Folding. I'm sorry you don't agree, but that's how I see it, and aside from things being easier, I see no benefit/need to remove the CC names.


While you might be able to make the argument that CC names detracts from the time we could spend recruiting other Folders, it's a bit of a stretch to make it seem as though it's anti-Folding.



1) We have events that have people trying to push their hardware to the max. The TC for members who can afford to do so 24/7, and the Foldathon for everyone else.

2) Recruiting people is something we try to do througout the yeear - we might have more people doing so during the CC, but it's not as if we relax the rest of the year.

There is no team element if there's no CC name - you'll have maybe a core bunch of members going out recruiting hard, and a larger group of people helping out with issues and configurations, but again, that's not much different from what we do during the rest of the year - it's just scaled up.

Again, if all you wanted was a Folding competition, how is it any different from what we do during the rest of the year, besides it being for 10 days?


I still disagree with your opinion but I appreciate you taking the time to more fully respond to mine. I don't strongly disagree with your opinion, but as mentioned a few times now I do strongly disagree that the name issue should be a major point of contention worth holding up the CC (and that goes for both sides, myself included)

In response to you final question, what I believe makes the CC different is the fact that it gets more attention and promotion than use just plugging along 24/7. Yes the name change is not anti folding, but it's surely not pro folding, it's like folding agnostic tongue.gif. Anyway where was I before I distracted myself with how funny I am. I just think any any resources spent promoting current folders to do something as meaningless as change their name is a resource wasted. I will be spending my time trying to convince the non folding members of OCN to fold obviously but imagine if we were united in that effort?

That should be the real test of team camaraderie IMO, not just further reeling in those who we've already hooked onto folding by telling them to change their name, but catching new folders from within our midst. It has all of the same elements you like about getting people to change names, uniting under one banner, proving team loyalty etc. but on a much more difficult and more meaningful scale. Who cares if we can convince our own folders to change their name, I'd freaking hope we're capable of that, their our folders. But convincing our non folding denizens to come together and show their support for OCN by joining their folding team, now that is something to get behind.

201

Also Freedom!!!!

I'm so submitting that with some folding stuff added in as a possible OCN CC avatar choice this year.
Edited by juano - 4/19/12 at 8:33am
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post #198 of 314

I'm hardly gonna post and say I'm ignoring everyone's opinions and doing what I want (not saying I don't do that at times, but I'm quiet about it ;)). But at the same time, it's one of those things where you're just gonna have some people agree with it, and some disagree.

 

Rather than have people argue about it (like we're doing :P), it'd be a lot faster and a lot less hassle me just taking the decision.

 

It's not like I have more votes than the other teams in the captains' forum - when they reply, it'll go to a vote and we'll have an outcome. But if we're looking for a May CC, agreeing to keep things as they have been as much as possible would get things finalised faster.

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post #199 of 314
Quote:
Originally Posted by zodac View Post

But if we're looking for a May CC, agreeing to keep things as they have been as much as possible would get things finalised faster.

All glory to the May CC.

Oh and this was the argument I meant to have in PM with you, so now you can tell me what's happening with the link colors.
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post #200 of 314

Should have done it in the PM then; now you have nothing to barter with. :P

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