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4.4Ghz i7-2600k at 1.272 ~ 1.290v? is safe? too much? - Page 3

post #21 of 33
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Indulgence View Post

oh men, pinoy! biggrin.gif

cpus gets damaged from the temperature and from the voltage as well.. cpus has their safe voltage limit, so if you exceed on that, cpu may experience degradation over time..

so the basic rule is, the lower volt, the better, as long as it is rock stable

i See thanks! mah men biggrin.gif

pero my voltages are completely safe from degradation right?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Fatalrip View Post

http://www.anandtech.com/show/2468/6

Cpu degradation. If you get it too hot, or run too many volts through it for an extended amount of time. The idea is that overclocking shortens the life of your cpu but in 7-10 years when it dies it won't matter because you will want something new.


Oh yeah and blend is good because it stresses the imc.

7-10 years? is that accurate for 24/7 use in overclocked mode?
Quote:
Originally Posted by plum View Post

low cpu voltage is never bad if it's stable

I see thanks! maybe i could go higher! since Indulgence i5-2500k is @4.7ghz @1.25v ^^

My only concern for getting higher clocks is that i'm a chickening out because i'm not planning on buying a new CPU in the moment for about 7-10 years D:

So here's my question will my CPU last long for 7-10 years?? i use my COMPUTER 24/7 or at least 16-19 hours a day
Edited by Ghythybhy - 4/9/12 at 10:59pm
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post #22 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghythybhy View Post

Hey thanks man ^^ anyway i only i know how NEGATIVE(-) OFFSET WORKS but i don't know how POSITIVE(+) OFFSET WORKS???
What do you mean by 1./45v???? ?D:

Positive offset is like negative offset. When you open up Real Temp, click on the top right button to cycle through the different Info states. Click until you get to something like looks like "1.3561 VID". This is known as the stock Vcore for your chip at that multiplier, it is the amount of voltage that your CPU says to your motherboard it needs to work properly (although we normally never use that amount when overclocking).

Offset in essence is the amount of voltage to be added to your VID whenever you CPU goes under load. That being said, what you need to do is figure out the manual voltage needed to achieve your overclock of choice. Mine being 4.5Ghz (for temps and 24/7 folding efficiency), I found that my stable voltage was at 1.34V under load. My VID at 4.5Ghz is 1.3561 VID. You would think that I should use negative offset to achieve -.01V? Wrong. Some Sandybridge chips suffer from Idle voltage BSOD's, which is when your chip is not given enough voltage to keep running. My limit is around 0.95V, everyone's is different, you have to find it with testing. By using a negative offset, you're also affecting your idle voltage as well. If your idle voltage at stock offset is 1.0V and you set a negative offset of -0.15V, then your idle voltage will be 0.85V. My current idle voltage is 1.04 and it works for me.

Next we have to worry about is Vdroop. When your CPU is using manual voltage, it will hover around the voltage that you set at idle. When your CPU goes under load, the voltage actually starts to drop (seems backwards right?). That is known as Vdroop, and you compensate for Vdroop with Load Line Calibration (LLC). LLC will compensate for the Vdroop by adding voltage to your CPU under load, but it doesn't affect your idle voltages (key difference from negative offset!). Depending on the Motherboard you have, there are several LLC settings (1 being most compensation, 5 being least). I recommend using either Level 2 or Level 3 (I wouldn't use Level 1 as it causes large spikes in voltage under load). In order to find the right LLC setting to use, there is a good method to use (assuming you know the voltage you need for your overclock):
  1. Start up your BIOS and look at the current Vcore reading reported by your motherboard
  2. Set LLC to Level 2, offset to +0.05v, and restart.
  3. Look at the Vcore reading again in BIOS and see how close you are to your target voltage
  4. Set LLC to Level 3 and restart and check again.
  5. Choose whichever LLC setting gave you the Vcore closest to your target (if both were way higher than target, use Level 4)
  6. Now that you have your LLC setting, use the offset needed to get your target Vcore(should be a max of +0.4-0.5v with the right LLC setting, mine is Level 3 +0.15v)
  7. Restart and run Prime95 in Blend and you should see your target Vcore in CPU-Z (if not, alter your offset by +0.05 until you get it).

And that's about it! You'll have a stable idle voltage that saves you power vs. manual voltage and you get to find the most efficient voltage for your CPU. Just remember when finding your target voltage when using Manual, step-up your Vcore/VTT in small increments.

If you have any other questions, fire away thumb.gif

And to your last post, your CPU won't start to degrade until you get to 1.35+V. But most people run up to 1.4V at ease. I wouldn't run much more than that unless you are watercooling or plan on having your CPU for a max of 2-4 years.
Edited by modinn - 4/9/12 at 11:10pm
post #23 of 33
lol. come on, there's nothing wrong going higher as long as you're monitoring your temps properly, and your voltage too.. yup, that's my current voltage for that clock, and its been running like that for months now, without having any bsods.. smile.gif
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post #24 of 33
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by modinn View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghythybhy View Post

Hey thanks man ^^ anyway i only i know how NEGATIVE(-) OFFSET WORKS but i don't know how POSITIVE(+) OFFSET WORKS???
What do you mean by 1./45v???? ?D:

Positive offset is like negative offset. When you open up Real Temp, click on the top right button to cycle through the different Info states. Click until you get to something like looks like "1.3561 VID". This is known as the stock Vcore for your chip at that multiplier, it is the amount of voltage that your CPU says to your motherboard it needs to work properly (although we normally never use that amount when overclocking).

Offset in essence is the amount of voltage to be added to your VID whenever you CPU goes under load. That being said, what you need to do is figure out the manual voltage needed to achieve your overclock of choice. Mine being 4.5Ghz (for temps and 24/7 folding efficiency), I found that my stable voltage was at 1.34V under load. My VID at 4.5Ghz is 1.3561 VID. You would think that I should use negative offset to achieve -.01V? Wrong. Some Sandybridge chips suffer from Idle voltage BSOD's, which is when your chip is not given enough voltage to keep running. My limit is around 0.95V, everyone's is different, you have to find it with testing. By using a negative offset, you're also affecting your idle voltage as well. If your idle voltage at stock offset is 1.0V and you set a negative offset of -0.15V, then your idle voltage will be 0.85V. My current idle voltage is 1.04 and it works for me.

Next we have to worry about is Vdroop. When your CPU is using manual voltage, it will hover around the voltage that you set at idle. When your CPU goes under load, the voltage actually starts to drop (seems backwards right?). That is known as Vdroop, and you compensate for Vdroop with Load Line Calibration (LLC). LLC will compensate for the Vdroop by adding voltage to your CPU under load, but it doesn't affect your idle voltages (key difference from negative offset!). Depending on the Motherboard you have, there are several LLC settings (1 being most compensation, 5 being least). I recommend using either Level 2 or Level 3 (I wouldn't use Level 1 as it causes large spikes in voltage under load). In order to find the right LLC setting to use, there is a good method to use (assuming you know the voltage you need for your overclock):
  1. Start up your BIOS and look at the current Vcore reading reported by your motherboard
  2. Set LLC to Level 2, offset to +0.05v, and restart.
  3. Look at the Vcore reading again in BIOS and see how close you are to your target voltage
  4. Set LLC to Level 3 and restart and check again.
  5. Choose whichever LLC setting gave you the Vcore closest to your target (if both were way higher than target, use Level 4)
  6. Now that you have your LLC setting, use the offset needed to get your target Vcore(should be a max of +0.4-0.5v with the right LLC setting, mine is Level 3 +0.15v)
  7. Restart and run Prime95 in Blend and you should see your target Vcore in CPU-Z (if not, alter your offset by +0.05 until you get it).

And that's about it! You'll have a stable idle voltage that saves you power vs. manual voltage and you get to find the most efficient voltage for your CPU. Just remember when finding your target voltage when using Manual, step-up your Vcore/VTT in small increments.

If you have any other questions, fire away thumb.gif

And to your last post, your CPU won't start to degrade until you get to 1.35+V. But most people run up to 1.4V at ease. I wouldn't run much more than that unless you are watercooling or plan on having your CPU for a max of 2-4 years.

I see now so if you're going for OFFET (+) you need to base the VID?

So how does it work? i mean

In OFFSET (-)

All i did was;

~ I used AUTO OFFSET(-)
~ Check the highest Vcore i received through Intel Burn Test and Prime95 just to check on how high.
~ It was 1.340v ~ 1.360v i think
~ Then the way i understood OFFSET(-) works is basic subtracting sooo ---> (1.340v - 0.060v) = 1.28v
~ Therefore i hassssszz a new highest 1.28v as my Vcore

But how about in OFFSET(+)

~?
~?
~?
~?
~?

I'm a virgin with OFFSET mode xD sorry for dumb questions..

Sooooo 1.270v ~ 1.290v how long will my CPU last? ...................

Btw my temps and voltages in idle and load

IDLE TEMPS: 36-42c

LOAD TEMPS: 60~70c

Room Temp: 30c++ <<-- not sure i just know its darn hot and its around 30c+ D:



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


IDLE VOLTAGES: 0.78v ~ 1.00V i think

LOAD VOLTAGES: 1.262v ~ 1.270v ~ 1.280v sometimesjumps at 1.290v dunno why D:


P95 only using MAX 1.28v

I remembered Intel Burn Test used up 1.29v ~ 1.30v this was ON MAXIMUM ~~~ i'm not sure i'm going to run 10 runs in MAX again later on after P95
Edited by Ghythybhy - 4/9/12 at 11:30pm
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post #25 of 33
7-10 years? is that accurate for 24/7 use in overclocked mode?

Its an estimation based on that graph, i have a 5 year old cpu that's been overclocked the entire time at 4.1 ghz and its still running strong .
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post #26 of 33
Thread Starter 
Is there such a bad IDLE Voltage???

Because i enabled every power saving that i could get ... and some auto.

Right now i'm at BLEND TEST Prime95

MAX VCORE 1.27V EDIT: its on 1.28v now again ^^

my gosh D: what is going on D:::
Edited by Ghythybhy - 4/9/12 at 11:51pm
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post #27 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghythybhy View Post

I see now so if you're going for OFFET (+) you need to base the VID?
So how does it work? i mean
In OFFSET (-)
All i did was;
~ I used AUTO OFFSET(-)
~ Check the highest Vcore i received through Intel Burn Test and Prime95 just to check on how high.
~ It was 1.340v ~ 1.360v i think
~ Then the way i understood OFFSET(-) works is basic subtracting sooo ---> (1.340v - 0.060v) = 1.28v
~ Therefore i hassssszz a new highest 1.28v as my Vcore
But how about in OFFSET(+)
~?
~?
~?
~?
~?
I'm a virgin with OFFSET mode xD sorry for dumb questions.

IDLE VOLTAGES: 0.78v ~ 1.00V i think

LOAD VOLTAGES: 1.262v ~ 1.270v ~ 1.280v sometimesjumps at 1.290v dunno why D:

You can use negative offset if you want. The only downside is the idle BSOD's that come with it if you set too low of a negative offset. You said that it reaches 0.78v at idle, that would crash my CPU. But every chip is different and you obviously got a better chip than I did so. 1.29v for 4.4Ghz is not bad at all. Just because your chip eats lower-than-average-volts for one multiplier, doesn't mean that you'll reach a higher multiplier at lower volts too. Every chip is different and some have a max overclock no matter what (I've seen some people hit 4.5Ghz at 1.29v and then not be able to hit 4.8Ghz, known as "the wall"). I hit 4.9Ghz once but at 1.48v, it wasn't worth it for a 300Mhz upgrade. I've been thinking of trying for a 4.4Ghz overclock with sub-1.3 voltages like yourself for the increased efficiency, stability, and loop temperatures redface.gif

What motherboard are you using by the way?

To answer your question about using Positive offset if you get the Idle BSOD's I mentioned before, you'll have to use a lower LLC setting (Level 4) because of how low your voltages are to use a positive offset. For instance, since you are using a -0.06v offset I'd say that Level 4 will give you a voltage about 0.1-0.2 above your target voltage of 1.29V. Therefore you'll only need a offset of -0.01V, which means that your IDLE voltages will be +0.05v higher than before because of the smaller offset. See what I mean? LLC compensates for your load voltages. Offset is supposed to be your way to get the exact voltage you need, not do all the offsetting. Also depending on which voltage mode you are using, you need to set your C states to the following:
Quote:
Offset Mode: Your CPU will use VERY LITTLE voltage and speed when idling, ANYTIME you idle. (Even browsing can be considered idling.)
Enhanced Halt State (C1E): Enabled
CPU C3 State Support: Disabled
CPU C6 State Support: Disabled
Package C State Support: Disabled

Fixed(Manual) Mode: Your CPU will run full voltage and speed all the time, even when idling.
Enhanced Halt State (C1E): Enabled
CPU C3 State Support: Enabled
CPU C6 State Support: Enabled
Package C State Support: Auto
Source

Also, Intel Burn Test is not a good test to run whenever you start running higher overclocks. IBT stresses the CPU WAYYY too much and you'll see upwards of 10+ degree temperatures higher than anything else that will run like Prime95 Blend and Battlefield 3.

And the chip jumps to 1.29V periodically because it needs the extra voltage to perform (that's normal). Just make sure you plan for the target voltage that the CPU stays at on average, and not the max voltage. If you have a good motherboard, it should compensate for that by itself.
Edited by modinn - 4/10/12 at 12:05am
post #28 of 33
pretty good voltages for that clock, see how far you can push that baby!
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post #29 of 33
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by modinn View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghythybhy View Post

I see now so if you're going for OFFET (+) you need to base the VID?
So how does it work? i mean
In OFFSET (-)
All i did was;
~ I used AUTO OFFSET(-)
~ Check the highest Vcore i received through Intel Burn Test and Prime95 just to check on how high.
~ It was 1.340v ~ 1.360v i think
~ Then the way i understood OFFSET(-) works is basic subtracting sooo ---> (1.340v - 0.060v) = 1.28v
~ Therefore i hassssszz a new highest 1.28v as my Vcore
But how about in OFFSET(+)
~?
~?
~?
~?
~?
I'm a virgin with OFFSET mode xD sorry for dumb questions.

IDLE VOLTAGES: 0.78v ~ 1.00V i think

LOAD VOLTAGES: 1.262v ~ 1.270v ~ 1.280v sometimesjumps at 1.290v dunno why D:

You can use negative offset if you want. The only downside is the idle BSOD's that come with it if you set too low of a negative offset. You said that it reaches 0.78v at idle, that would crash my CPU. But every chip is different and you obviously got a better chip than I did so. 1.29v for 4.4Ghz is not bad at all. Just because your chip eats lower-than-average-volts for one multiplier, doesn't mean that you'll reach a higher multiplier at lower volts too. Every chip is different and some have a max overclock no matter what (I've seen some people hit 4.5Ghz at 1.29v and then not be able to hit 4.8Ghz, known as "the wall"). I hit 4.9Ghz once but at 1.48v, it wasn't worth it for a 300Mhz upgrade. I've been thinking of trying for a 4.4Ghz overclock with sub-1.3 voltages like yourself for the increased efficiency, stability, and loop temperatures redface.gif

What motherboard are you using by the way?

To answer your question about using Positive offset if you get the Idle BSOD's I mentioned before, you'll have to use a lower LLC setting (Level 4) because of how low your voltages are to use a positive offset. For instance, since you are using a -0.06v offset I'd say that Level 4 will give you a voltage about 0.1-0.2 above your target voltage of 1.29V. Therefore you'll only need a offset of -0.01V, which means that your IDLE voltages will be +0.05v higher than before because of the smaller offset. See what I mean? LLC compensates for your load voltages. Offset is supposed to be your way to get the exact voltage you need, not do all the offsetting. Also depending on which voltage mode you are using, you need to set your C states to the following:

Offset Mode: Your CPU will use VERY LITTLE voltage and speed when idling, ANYTIME you idle. (Even browsing can be considered idling.)
Enhanced Halt State (C1E): Enabled
CPU C3 State Support: Disabled
CPU C6 State Support: Disabled
Package C State Support: Disabled

Fixed(Manual) Mode: Your CPU will run full voltage and speed all the time, even when idling.
Enhanced Halt State (C1E): Enabled
CPU C3 State Support: Enabled
CPU C6 State Support: Enabled
Package C State Support: Auto

Also, Intel Burn Test is not a good test to run whenever you start running higher overclocks. IBT stresses the CPU WAYYY too much and you'll see upwards of 10+ degree temperatures higher than anything else that will run like Prime95 Blend and Battlefield 3.

And the chip jumps to 1.29V periodically because it needs the extra voltage to perform (that's normal). Just make sure you plan for the target voltage that the CPU stays at on average, and not the max voltage. If you have a good motherboard, it should compensate for that by itself.



Oh yeah i forgot to put up my specs -_-

i7-2600k
PC AMD HD Radeon 6970
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P8Z68-V-PRO
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Zalman Z9+ Mid-tower case.
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You give me light brotha <3

So is it necessary to disable CPU C3 and C6? what does it do?

i remembered it it was set on AUTO or Enabled D: not sure gonna check later

Maybe i should put LLC to Very High? right now i'm on High which is ON running now in Prime95 not problems atm..

Forgot to mention on my first post that my VRM Fixed Frequency Mode is at 350khz
Edited by Ghythybhy - 4/10/12 at 12:14am
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post #30 of 33
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ghythybhy View Post


Oh yeah i forgot to put up my specs -_-
i7-2600k
PC AMD HD Radeon 6970
Cooler Master 1000w 80+ Gold
P8Z68-V-PRO
Xion-HP 1216b HSF
Zalman Z9+ Mid-tower case.
8GB RAM Corsair
1TB Western / Seagate
You give me light brotha <3
So is it necessary to disable CPU C3 and C6? what does it do?
i remembered it it was set on AUTO or Enabled D: not sure gonna check later

While not required, it is highly recommended when using Offset. They are power-saving features intended for Manual users. When using offset mode, because of the big fluctuations in voltages and bugs that can arise when cores wind up, the CPU can BSOD due to these power-saving features. YMMV. The actual features are listed here:
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
700

And I think that I gave you enough info to get started, I'm parting from this thread. If you have specific questions about your motherboard, I recommend asking in these threads as there are people in there that know more about your specific motherboard than I do.

The Official ASUS P8P67/P8Z68 & P8Z68/GEN3 Series Owners Club
Asus Z68 Series Information Thread (drivers, BIOSes, overclocking, reviews)

Good luck in your overclock!

-Modinn
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