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Power Supply Problem (I think)

post #1 of 10
Thread Starter 
Hi all, I appear to be having a rather convoluted problem with power supplies at the moment.

First things first, the build:
Motherboard: MSI P67A-GD53 Intel P67 (REV B3) Socket 1155
CPU: Intel Core i5-2400 3.10GHz (Sandybridge) Socket LGA1155 (With Stock Cooler)
RAM: 4GB Corsair XMS3 (2x2GB) DDR3 PC3-12800C9 1600MHz 1.65v
Power Supply: Mushkin Enhanced Joule 800W

At the moment this is how it's sitting, I've removed all hard drives, optical drives, sound card, graphics card and wireless card so it's just the barebones needed to get going.

The story: I purchased the above parts, minus the power supply, about Christmas time to upgrade my aging system. At the time I had an Antec 650W but I can't remember the exact model. However it worked a charm.

I install these new parts, switch it on and it's intermittently switching itself off or not starting up at all (Getting to the windows logo screen and then hanging). It would take several attempts before it finally got to the login screen on which it would work fine for 5 mins to 5 hours without restarting itself.

After a lot of testing we replaced the antec power supply with a cheap 750W gold generic power supply that we knew worked from an old build. Sure enough the PC worked fine for the next 3 months (All the while I spent that time trying to get a replacement as it was still under warranty. Less said about that experience the better....)

So last week I got the money back for the Antec power supply and bought the above mentioned Mushkin Enhanced Joule 800W supply. Got it Tuesday and installed it that night.

This is where it becomes...odd.

Installed the Mushkin, and the computer would boot up for a split second (all fans, hard drives...etc showing life) then power down and restart itself. It would continue to do this unless you pulled the plug or switched it off at the back.

So I took it out, did all the usual checks (Make sure ALL the connectors were seated properly, double checked the manual, checked the ram, removed the non essential components like Hard drive, Optical drive, Graphics card...etc to make sure they weren't the cause of the problem) but it continued to do the same thing (Start up for a second then power down)

Put the Generic gold 750W supply in and it starts up no problem. So think it's another faulty power supply.

My brother then suggested putting it in the old system, so hooked it up to the old system (An AMD quad core, 9850) and it works first time......

So now we're at a weird situation where the New system works with the old power supply, but not the new one,
And the old system works with both the old generic supply and the Mushkin 800W.

If anyone could shed some light on this i'd be very grateful. (And sorry for the big story tongue.gif)
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post #2 of 10
I think you're right that it's likely a faulty power supply. It probably can handle the demands of the old system without failure, but the new system may be demanding enough of it to produce the evidence of problems faster and easier.

Or so it seems...
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post #3 of 10
The Joule 800W is actually a very good unit... perfectly capable of delivering its labeled power... I doubt it's the power supply... I'd say the motherboard or the RAM... it could also be a short somewhere, reinstall the motherboard.. see if there's any problem with the standoffs...
And yeah.. I know it's working with the trashy unit and it's hard to comprehend how that happens... sadly, I have no explanation of you.
Edited by Original Sin - 4/12/12 at 4:06pm
post #4 of 10
I think this one is pretty cut and dried, if it was any other component in your rig, you'd see the same behavior with the generic power supply as well. It sounds like you've already done all the diagnostics, so I'd RMA the new power supply back to wherever you bought it, and get a replacement.

That new power supply may be a wonderful model, but as we all know, occasionally a bad unit slips out, and you might have just been that unlucky guy that ended up with it.
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post #5 of 10
I basically agree with US on this one.

The behavior of the system starting up, then almost immediately shutting down, then trying to start up again, over and over like that ... it's actually most likely to be one of two things:

1) You have a short in the system somewhere, or
2) That particular mobo and psu have a compatibility issue.

If the problem is a short it's probably a very mild one, such that the components in the cheap-o unit are not sensitive enough to 'notice' it and trip the unit's protection. A short could be anywhere ... all you can really do is strip to the most bare bones you can go, and remove the mobo from the case altogether.

Most often this sort of problem is going to be a stand-off behind the board that's in the wrong place, and touching something it shouldn't be, or a 'tab' on the rear I/O panel is errantly stuck into a USB or NIC jack ... but like I say it could be anywhere ... a capacitor on the board itself is going out, a hard drive, video card, ram ...

If it's a compatibility issue that's almost always caused by the board not properly reading the 'all good' self-test signal that the mobo expects to receive from the PSU. There's supposed to be a consistent standard for how this communication happens but sometimes certain boards come out that just don't 'get' the signal that's delivered from certain other PSU's. This is really pretty rare so the likelihood you just randomly stumbled on a combo like that is pretty low ... Given that this same system developed a similar problem with a different PSU ... I tend to lean towards the first option.

IOW, given the totality of the story, I doubt the issue is the new PSU, tbh. I'm more inclined to think something else in your system is faulty or on it's way to becoming faulty ... or it's an installation problem.
Edited by brettjv - 4/13/12 at 8:37am
    
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post #6 of 10
Thread Starter 
Thanks all for the replies.

Took the motherboard and everything apart last night, installed the CPU and heatsink on the motherboard and connected up the power supply (All of this on a piece of cardboard outside the tower, just to make sure it wasn't a short with the standoffs) Same problem.

I even tried the paperclip trick to double check that the PSU was working and it passed that.

Going to RMA the power supply I think, if I explain the whole situation to them they might take pity on me and not charge a return fee if the power supply is in full working order.
If it's not the power supply, I can start trying to troubleshoot where a short might be. But then that means needing to RMA the motherboard probably :/
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post #7 of 10
Thread Starter 
[Update]
Decided to take apart my other system (Main one in my sig) and use that power supply. Same thing happened, so it must be the motherboard was a bad unit when I first got it and the cheap supply was masking it..
Atleast thats saved me a good £30 on delivery and being told "It's fine" by the place I bought it from.

Now just need to RMA the motherboard.

Thanks for all the suggestions smile.gif
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post #8 of 10
When diagnoising via internet we can only conclude that the person we are talking to is conducting the testing correctly and not unintentionaly biasing himself one way or the other.

Saying the old power suppy "masked" the problem with the motherboard is the point I am having trouble with.Over current protection in some form is a feature even the crudest power supplies have.
Edited by PCCstudent - 4/15/12 at 11:12am
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post #9 of 10
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCCstudent View Post

When diagnoising via internet we can only conclude that the person we are talking to is conducting the testing correctly and not unintentionaly biasing himself one way or the other.
Saying the old power suppy "masked" the problem with the motherboard is the point I am having trouble with.Over current protection in some form is a feature even the crudest power supplies have.

I've tried to be as unbiased as I can be.
My reasoning for thinking the motherboard is the problem is in removing the motherboard from the case and putting it on a piece of cardboard, plus removing all other parts apart from the CPU and heatsink, I'm trying to isolate as many variables as possible.
Using my Corsair 750W power supply (which I know works as it's been powering the system I'm using right now for over a year), if showed the exact same fault as with the new Mushkin 800W.
So in using 2 power supplies (from different makers) and the same fault occuring, I can only imagine they'res a fault in one of the remaining components (Heatsink, CPU or Motherboard)

The heatsink seems to be performing correctly, as the system doesn't overheat when using the gold 750w power supply.
The CPU also appears to be performing correctly under the gold power supply (if there was a fault with the cpu then I'd imagine the system wouldn't start at all no matter which power supply it was)
So all that is left is the motherboard, which seems the mostly likely cause of the problem.

But if you can think of anything else that doesn't require me to send for an RMA on the motherboard, then I'm all ears.
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post #10 of 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lewey22B View Post

[Update]
Decided to take apart my other system (Main one in my sig) and use that power supply. Same thing happened, so it must be the motherboard was a bad unit when I first got it and the cheap supply was masking it..
Atleast thats saved me a good £30 on delivery and being told "It's fine" by the place I bought it from.
Now just need to RMA the motherboard.
Thanks for all the suggestions smile.gif

Saw this a bit late,perhaps you can explain how the other power supply masked a problem with the motherboard.

When working with someone via internet we have to conclude the person on the other end is using a testing method that leads him to accurate conculsions,conclusions that can be used to work the way down the troubleshooting chart. Saying that one power supply was so constructed that when working nominaly it would mask a problem with a motherboard is not a conclusion I am comfortable with.
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