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[Various]Intel Ivy Bridge Reviews - Page 20

post #191 of 438
I'd like to see a competitive AMD as well and I'm a huge Intel fanboy! Competition always makes things more exciting!
post #192 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mad Pistol View Post

Here's the issue that I'm seeing, though.
The point was to bring much more powerful graphics, and they did. It's definitely more powerful than the SB HD 3000 IGP's, but compared to Llano... well, Llano, the last generation APU from AMD still runs all over IB's HD 4000 graphics in literally every test, and Llano is now EOL. Trinity is going to be much more powerful in terms of graphics.
It's like intel is trying really hard to catch AMD at the APU game, and they're falling flat on their face every time. This "tick+" isn't really a tick+. It's more like a tick... with a small hint of graphics on the side. For what intel is billing it to be, IB is a letdown.
Those of you guys with SB setups, keep them. There's no reason to upgrade. None.

It is a tick+. A tick is purely a die shrink. There's architectural improvements with Ivy Bridge. Unfortunately, the transistors and process aren't meeting anyone's expectations.

If people are depressed right now, imagine how things would be if they hadn't made any architecture changes at all. We'd have a low power version of Sandy Bridge that clocks worse. Or, if Ivy Bridge's overclocking shortcomings are because they tried to tweak the architecture and use a new process at the same time, we'd have a low power version of Sandy Bridge that clocks the same and has no IPC improvement, which would be still a step back from where we are.

With the architecture improvements, Ivy Bridge is undoubtedly the better buy right now. If you overclock and don't have Sandy Bridge currently, worst case scenario you'll break even with the performance had you gotten a Sandy Bridge instead, except you'll be drawing less power. Technically, you could win the silicon lottery either way and get a great overclock, but for most people that overclock on air, the performance will be pretty similar.

However, as the process matures, the gap between IVB and SNB should lessen. SNB wasn't the first processor line of Intel's that was on 32nm... it was well matured by the time SNB launched, and according to Anandtech, the transition to 22nm has been the hardest yet for Intel. Ivy Bridge will probably look a lot more appealing by the holiday season.

If you don't overclock and are looking to buy something for a discrete graphics rig or a chassis where Trinity isn't going to be available (e.g. Macbooks), Ivy Bridge is a step forward because you're using less power under load. So, good for the laptop world, if you're not interested in or can't grab Trinity.

For anyone that does care about IGPs though, Trinity is undoubtedly (ok, not undoubtedly - AMD technically could flop again, although unlikely) going to be the better buy. Better driver support, far and away better IGP performance, and the CPU should be decently competitive. For those that care about overclocking, it'd likely fair much better than Ivy Bridge. No idea on power consumption, but IVB will likely be hard to beat.
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post #193 of 438
dear intel..

no igp version please.

kthanxbye.
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post #194 of 438
Quote:
However, this very small 5% bump in IPC will give AMD a chance to close the gap.

I doubt AMD will pull off a 5% jump from Bulldozer to Piledriver IPC wise. AMD has to consistently meet and then exceed Intel's IPC gains. Only time will tell...
post #195 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Absauston View Post

Quote:
However, this very small 5% bump in IPC will give AMD a chance to close the gap.

I doubt AMD will pull off a 5% jump from Bulldozer to Piledriver IPC wise. AMD has to consistently meet and then exceed Intel's IPC gains. Only time will tell...

No way in hell can AMD catch up. Depending on which numbers you look at, Intel has between 4x and 10x the R&D spending that AMD does. AMD will probably still be on 28 nm while Intel has perfected 22 nm with Haswell and moved on to Broadwell. I also giggle a bit that Intel has the Knight's Corner trump card on moar cores.
Edited by dr/owned - 4/23/12 at 10:40pm
post #196 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by votum View Post

overnighted a 2500k earlier today. Sick of waiting for IB and it is more of a side grade for me. Good info thanks guys

What? You can't wait for a week? IB is clearly a better buy.
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post #197 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr/owned View Post

No way in hell can AMD catch up. Depending on which numbers you look at, Intel has between 4x and 10x the R&D spending that AMD does. AMD will probably still be on 28 nm while Intel has perfected 22 nm with Haswell and moved on to Broadwell. I also giggle a bit that Intel has the Knight's Corner trump card on moar cores.

Knight's Corner is supposed to compete with Nvidia Tesla GPGPU's. Intel doesn't have CUDA, so they're just bringing a rubber chicken to a gun fight. Let me put it this way - investment banks wouldn't buy a Knight's Corner system if it had 3x the performance per dollar of Nvidia Tesla - like they really care about saving $500,000 a year (Goldman and JPM had weeks worth of $1M + profit trading days last year) when they'd have to spend years getting their trading algorithms to work properly with Intel and OpenCL.

Giggle some more, Haswell mainstream looks to be quad-core and lower. Intel must really love the fanboys; by then AMD will have 10-core Steamroller.
 
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post #198 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by jrbroad77 View Post

Giggle some more, Haswell mainstream looks to be quad-core and lower. Intel must really love the fanboys; by then AMD will have 10-core Steamroller.

Intel already has Xeon 8C/16T and my money is on Haswell being 6C/12T. Consumers just don't need 10 cores right now, something AMD doesn't seem to understand. What do you do that would scale with more cores that isn't gpgpu enabled already?
post #199 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by Absauston View Post

Quote:
However, this very small 5% bump in IPC will give AMD a chance to close the gap.
I doubt AMD will pull off a 5% jump from Bulldozer to Piledriver IPC wise. AMD has to consistently meet and then exceed Intel's IPC gains. Only time will tell...

AMD doesn't have to do squat with IPC. IPC can move backwards, if IPS (IPC * Clock Speed) improves more than IPC diminishes.

The term IPC needs to die. People get too hung up over it, when it's meaningless by itself. Clockspeed is just as important.
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post #200 of 438
Quote:
Originally Posted by dr/owned View Post

Intel already has Xeon 8C/16T and my money is on Haswell being 6C/12T. Consumers just don't need 10 cores right now, something AMD doesn't seem to understand. What do you do that would scale with more cores that isn't gpgpu enabled already?

That's fine, and AMD has 12-core Opterons. As for what needs more cores, rendering in any 3D content creation (3D movies like Toy Story, or rendering CAD models). Yes, rendering CAD will max out as many cores as you throw at it. Video encoding is another one; QuickSync quality isn't quite acceptable, and anyone who wants high-quality video for 1080p will encode with CPU (GPU encode even has noticably lower quality). And then you have stuff like Folding @ Home. It's common sense that performance per watt is better with an increased core count (if you OC an i7-2600k to match a 3930K's multi-threaded performance, you're far exceeding 125W on the CPU). So there's a myriad of reasons, but of course not everyone wants/needs >4 cores.

As for Haswell, nope, it's 4C/8T. Intel isn't a charitable foundation, they'd much rather sell their 6-cores for $600-1000 until AMD matches their multi-threaded performance with Steamroller. http://www.slashgear.com/intel-haswell-shark-bay-detailed-ahead-of-2013-debut-10194496/ 50% faster graphics, slightly bigger die. There's no room for another 2 cores plus an IGP. Maybe Skymont will have mainstream 6-core.
 
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